Seller Has Full Tracking with SOD -- Still Loses INR Case

[clarry100]

I was reading a story over on the Facebook ebay sellers groups where a seller sent out an item with tracking and SOD.

The tracking was associated with the buyers delivery address.

The last ebay estimated delivery date passed but the tracking still showed "in transit". ie no delivery scan event yet.

There is a lodgement scan event inside the seller's stated handling time. Proving postage to the buyer's address.

Buyer opens formal INR case.

Seller launches Aust Post investigation. And uploads their tracking info onto the now open case.

Buyer escalates the case and ebay close in buyers favour and refund from seller funds.

How can this be?

I thought if ebay wished to refund then in this situation it should be their nickel, not the seller's.

I thought the tracking situation should have had this one covered hands down for the seller.

Especially since the Aust Post investigation has not completed yet. Tomorrow apparently.

Am I missing something here?

What would be the point of paying for tracking and/or SOD when you will lose like this anyway?

Might just as well send out everything by untracked large letter, if it will fit.

[clarry100]

@character_parties_aus wrote:

What happens if the item is subsequently delivered post refund?

---

Yes really...

The AP investigation is not even completed yet and its possible that this may turn up the item and it gets delivered to the buyer.

Do ebay then reverse their premature decision on appeal?

[beautysecretfashion]

If buyer paid via Paypal ensure you tell Paypal what has happened, if the money was taken out of your account by ebay from Paypal account that really is interfering by a party that I would think legally cannot do so.  I would also message ebay and tell them you are going to the Ombudsman as you did the right and honest thing.  If ebay want to PAY the buyer for the loss well and good BUT no money should be taken out of your Paypal account.

I would phone ebay not email or message and explain what has transpired. You can prove you sent it which is your obligation.  ebay in Australia to my knowledge is not like the USA whereby you have to prove delivery JUST that it was sent??  I would also insist that any defects which occur relating to this matter should be removed by the fact that you can prove you sent the item!!

Not only are sellers NOW being blamed for how long it takes a parcel to be delivered BUT ALSO held accountable for it going missing??? Shocking and quite frankly I feel if you speak to the Financial ombudsman you will find it all should go in your favour.

I am not against the buyer being compensated by ebay... that is what they promise and should keep HOWEVER that promise should NOT be at the expense of the seller when the seller has done all things correctly!!!!

I would not give up...♥

[collect247]

No ebay won't reverse their decision if the item finally gets delivered,I had this happen to me several times late last year.

And the buyers even gave positive feedback that they did receive their items.

Ebay must have had a vandetta against me because they suspended me because of too many of these kinda situations.

And I thought that all of that nonsense has changed but looks like it's still going on,just so pathetic.

[lyndal1838]

The ebay MBG demands proof of delivery of the item.....it is paypal that only asks for proof of posting.

[dazzledayz]

---

@clarry100 wrote:

I was reading a story over on the Facebook ebay sellers groups where a seller sent out an item with tracking and SOD.

The tracking was associated with the buyers delivery address.

The last ebay estimated delivery date passed but the tracking still showed "in transit". ie no delivery scan event yet.

There is a lodgement scan event inside the seller's stated handling time. Proving postage to the buyer's address.

Buyer opens formal INR case.

Seller launches Aust Post investigation. And uploads their tracking info onto the now open case.

Buyer escalates the case and ebay close in buyers favour and refund from seller funds.

How can this be?

I thought if ebay wished to refund then in this situation it should be their nickel, not the seller's.

I thought the tracking situation should have had this one covered hands down for the seller.

Especially since the Aust Post investigation has not completed yet. Tomorrow apparently.

Am I missing something here?

What would be the point of paying for tracking and/or SOD when you will lose like this anyway?

Might just as well send out everything by untracked large letter, if it will fit.

---

Clarry, eBay will always side with the buyer so don't expect any sympathy from them.

Go straight to PayPal and claim under their seller protection program.

This IMO is the main advantage of using a tracked delivery service; it effectively gets you free insurance via PayPal.

[clarry100]

The INR case was opened/closed within ebay not PayPal.

Just the seller funds have been deducted from their PayPal account by ebay.

So not too sure if/not PayPal will want to get in the middle of it even tho payment was made via PayPal.

It seems the main point of difference here is that ebay MBG require proof of delivery (which in this case HAS NOT happend as there is no delivery scan event), and PayPal only require proof of postage (which in this case HAS happened).

It's also my understanding that under Australian Consumer Law that proof of lodgement with the carrier service is all that is required.

However, as has been suggested, the FOS might take an interest in this case as the seller has done everything they were required to do and reasonably could have done. Its the failure of Aust Post that is the problem here.

And certainly if the package does end up being delivered when Aust Post investigate then the buyer would be legally obliged to reimburse the seller, or return the goods. Failure to do so could then result in a fraud case being opened with The ACORN against the buyer.

https://www.acorn.gov.au/

https://www.fos.org.au/

[davewil1964]

---

@lyndal1838 wrote:

The ebay MBG demands proof of delivery of the item.....it is paypal that only asks for proof of posting.

---

BUT AUSTRALIAN LAW deems goods to have been received once they are posted. eBay can include any conditions they care to, but the law trumps them every time. it might work for international transactions but for domestic law trumps any and every eBay 'policy' that conflicts with same.

[justkidzbiz]

The seller can appeal if the tracking eventually shows delivered.

[the_pooze]

---

@davewil1964 wrote:

---

@lyndal1838 wrote:

The ebay MBG demands proof of delivery of the item.....it is paypal that only asks for proof of posting.

---

BUT AUSTRALIAN LAW deems goods to have been received once they are posted. eBay can include any conditions they care to, but the law trumps them every time. it might work for international transactions but for domestic law trumps any and every eBay 'policy' that conflicts with same.

---

Absolutely agree, eBay can have all the policies they like but, where the Seller can prove an item has been despatched under Australian Law they cannot be held liable for what may or may not happen fron that point on.

eBay tried that carp with me once when an item was destroyed by Aus Post (run over by forklift) but, the provision of the relevant links to the applicable government websites and the assurance that I would not hesitate to involve every government department and the media soon had them suggesting they'd "let this one go".

[clarry100]

As a matter of interest I just went and looked up the Sale of Goods Act (SOGA) for QLD (each state has its own).

On Page #20 at Para 34 (1) it states.... See link below for full doc.

When, in pursuance of a contract of sale, the seller is authorised or required to send the goods to the buyer, delivery of the goods to a carrier, whether named by the buyer or not, for the purpose of transmission to the buyer is prima facie deemed to be a delivery of the goods to the buyer.

This would seem to say that proof of postage is all that is required under Australia Consumer Law (ie a carrier acceptance scan event).

This fits the PayPal model where proof of postage is sufficient.

I wonder if ebay are pushing the legal boundaries (at least in AU) a bit by having a MBG requirement to prove delivery (ie have a delivery scan event). I would be inclined to challenge their ruling on this case based on the above para.

https://www.legislation.qld.gov.au/LEGISLTN/CURRENT/S/SaleGoodA1896.pdf