topic Re: If You Could Choose in Community Spirit

If You Could Choose

celestialinter0 — Fri, 06 Jan 2023 01:43:12 GMT

If you could choose what kind of world to live in, what kind of world would you choose? If you could decide what would happen tomorrow, with what kinds of things would you fill it?

If you had the power to decide what types of opportunities would come your way, what opportunities would you select? If you knew that your experiences would match your expectations, what would your expectations be?

In fact, you do have the power to choose your own way. You do have the ability to decide what kinds of events, experiences, opportunities and circumstances come your way.

The world you experience is the world that your dreams, your thoughts, your expectations and your actions most closely resonate. The world you see and live in is the world you most sincerely expect to see.

The universe is filled with endless possibilities, and those possibilities keep growing with every minute. The way you live determines which of those possibilities will come into your life.

With your thoughts, your actions, your values, your dreams and expectations, you choose what kind of world you live in. The way you live is closely mirrored in the world you see.

Re: If You Could Choose

springyzone — Fri, 06 Jan 2023 21:38:35 GMT

I don't believe that everyone does have the ability to decide what kinds of events or experiences come their way.

We have control over our own actions, but that is all.

It is true we can decide how we react to events, but we don't have the ability to decide what events come our way.

I don't believe the possibilities keep growing with every minute either. Sure, our actions have meaning, but with the best will in the world, not everyone can achieve their early goals or dreams. Telling children they can have anything they wish for or try for is wrong (in my opinion). Sometimes we can't, no matter how hard we try. Usually though there is a sideways path we can take to something else that may in the long run prove just as rewarding.

I am not discounting the power of thought or action. Not at all. But not every hope or dream can become reality.

Re: If You Could Choose

papermoon.lady — Sat, 07 Jan 2023 00:32:39 GMT

I can't write much right now, but I think I like the concept of a world as depicted in Imagine by the Beatles...

Springy is right though - not every hope or dream can become reality. Maybe we should try to find a compromise between dreams and reality. I mean, it must not always be either... or, or black or white. There is probably something like a grey zone.

Re: If You Could Choose

domino-710 — Sat, 07 Jan 2023 03:12:23 GMT

I quite like my world. 😊

Re: If You Could Choose

papermoon.lady — Sat, 07 Jan 2023 05:14:35 GMT

I would also love to live off the grid, but this is one of those situations where I would have to find a grey zone.

Re: If You Could Choose

papermoon.lady — Sat, 07 Jan 2023 06:01:30 GMT

What opportunities would you select if you had the power to choose, Celestial?

At any rate, I would always choose peace and tranquillity over fuss and noise.

If I could, I would prefer to live in the past altogether rather than in our frantic times, but of course this is one of those dreams that cannot come true, although I can still listen to classical music and just... imagine those times.

(By the way, I meant John Lennon in my first post of course.)

Re: If You Could Choose

springyzone — Sat, 07 Jan 2023 20:06:20 GMT

I know I go against the tide on this one, but I've always been annoyed/amazed by the fact people are so impressed by the sentiments expressed in Imagine.

I find it one of the most hypocritical pieces of writing ever. (sorry papermoon. I think you are very genuine, the Beatles not so much!)

Here you had a hedonistic group who enjoyed all the trappings of their new found wealth and exploited it to the max. They had groupie girls by the ton, they enjoyed their drugs and then where did John Lennon 'settle down'? In one of the most expensive & exclusive addresses in NY and that's saying something.

I can imagine a world without heaven and hell although I think if people have no religion, they often look for something else to guide their life.

I can imagine a world without countries but you're going back to about the stone age to do it because people are territorial.

And no possessions? That's the bit in the song that riles me.

I don't know what Lennon was smoking when he wrote all that, but he's exactly like a politician, busy telling others what they should do but he sure didn't live like that himself. Far as I know Yoko still lives in the apartment. So much for sharing all your possessions or having 'no possessions.'

They could talk the talk but they never walked the walk.

The sort of world I would like to see is one where there is relative peace and reasonable law and order.

Where there is access to necessities no matter what the income.

But I don't expect everyone to have the same level of wealth or possessions and in fact I think it is better if it isn't that way as people need incentives and we need to be honest, some people work harder than others.

What we need is a society though where, although some are better off than others, we don't leave anyone or any group totally behind. Sort of like a flock of birds.

I have this theory that there will never be absolute peace because we're an edgy species and we grow and develop through conflict, but I'd just be happy if we can avoid over the top conflict-all out wars, nuclear attacks etc

Re: If You Could Choose

springyzone — Sat, 07 Jan 2023 21:38:07 GMT

Sorry, couldn't resist. Just saw this on facebook.😁

Re: If You Could Choose

arctoph_49 — Mon, 09 Jan 2023 19:44:28 GMT

I am British and I have always loved the Beatles, even if, particularly in the past, they were probably more loved and popular in the USA than in the UK, where they have been a bit controversial sometimes.

As a matter of fact, at some stage they saved my life because they gave me hope.

The dream of "Imagine" also reminds me of some sort of nirvana somehow, and I think the concept of nirvana has its own validity for its followers.

Anyway, taste is taste of course, particularly in music or any form of art.

As for hypocrisy, yes, they didn't give up their possessions, but they are not the only singers who sing of a perfect world of harmony and who have a lot of money. Or... the infamous "All I want for Christmas is you" by Mariah Carey. She has made soooo much money with that song. Maybe that's all she really wants?

Re: If You Could Choose

springyzone — Mon, 09 Jan 2023 20:09:08 GMT

Don't get me wrong, I generally love a lot of the Beatles music.

And I don't believe anyone should have to give up all their wealth, not at all.

As I said earlier, I think the world actually works better when people do experience reward for effort.

But the words of Imagine do say 'imagine no possessions' as if that is an ideal to aim for and that I think is misguided rubbish, impossible to achieve as such.

As for thew words of 'All I want for Christmas is you', different. It is talking about emotions/relationships and it is perfectly possible for a person to have both wealth and a close, loving relationship with someone else.

Having said that, I personally don't like the tune of that song all that much, it is probably one of my least fav Christmas songs, but there you go, it all comes down to personal taste I guess.

Re: If You Could Choose

arctoph_49 — Mon, 09 Jan 2023 20:33:02 GMT

Yes, obviously the world would not go on if we all had no possessions.

The concept in "Imagine" is not only some sort of nirvana though.

When I was younger, I remember I watched a movie about St. Francis, and I have even just found a clip where he gives up all his possessions. I am not saying everybody should do that. I am just saying people find happiness in different ways, and the rich are not always as lucky as they think they are, nor are those who want to give up everything crazy. Happiness is subjective.

That said, I am spiritual but not religious.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ev2d92_W47Y

Re: If You Could Choose

springyzone — Mon, 09 Jan 2023 21:15:16 GMT

I agree with you. Mother Theresa was another who had very little in the way of possessions. It is possible for some people to devote their lives to helping others and I have great respect for those people.

The difference is she practised what she preached.

I don't believe those who want to live simply are crazy, I don't believe wealth necessarily brings happiness (or unhappiness for that matter. All money can buy is goods and services, it can't buy emotions as such).

Being poor doesn't necessarily bring happiness either, it can cause stress though.

I'm not against people having ideals, it is just the disconnect between the words of Imagine and the lifestyle of the writer always jars with me.

Re: If You Could Choose

arctoph_49 — Mon, 09 Jan 2023 22:03:42 GMT

@springyzone wrote:
I don't believe those who want to live simply are crazy, I don't believe wealth necessarily brings happiness (or unhappiness for that matter. All money can buy is goods and services, it can't buy emotions as such).
Being poor doesn't necessarily bring happiness either, it can cause stress though.

In order to be poor and happy you need to be spiritual too, otherwise it can definitely cause stress.

And the rich? Well, Jesus did say "It is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich person to enter the Kingdom of God".

Of course money is not a sin in itself, but many rich people become very greedy. As a matter of fact, the more they have, the more they want to have. But there are also good rich people.

The Vatican is incredibly rich, they say.

Re: If You Could Choose

domino-710 — Mon, 09 Jan 2023 22:50:53 GMT

I think the whole verse is what is meant by ' possessions '.

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man

Re: If You Could Choose

springyzone — Wed, 11 Jan 2023 00:16:01 GMT

@arctoph_49 wrote:
Of course money is not a sin in itself, but many rich people become very greedy. As a matter of fact, the more they have, the more they want to have. But there are also good rich people.
The Vatican is incredibly rich, they say.

This reminds me a bit of pensioners here, where you might get a pensioner who has been living in a house for over 60 years, where it was just a moderate middle class suburb when they moved in but has risen in value in the years since and they are now millionaires as far as assets go, but not necessarily in ready cash.

The vatican, I think, has some ready cash but the main value is in the buildings themselves and they can't exactly pull them apart and sell them off to the highest bidder.

Re: If You Could Choose

arctoph_49 — Wed, 11 Jan 2023 00:49:40 GMT

@springyzone wrote:
The vatican, I think, has some ready cash but the main value is in the buildings themselves and they can't exactly pull them apart and sell them off to the highest bidder.

Well, I think it is better if we don't discuss the Vatican's wealth here, but you can google the issue as well as estimates if you wish.

Re: If You Could Choose

papermoon.lady — Wed, 11 Jan 2023 01:41:43 GMT

Have you read "Siddharta" by Hermann Hesse, arcto? It is a wonderful novel about the quest for enlightenment.

Re: If You Could Choose

arctoph_49 — Wed, 11 Jan 2023 01:52:26 GMT

Yes, but a long time ago. I loved it.

Re: If You Could Choose

papermoon.lady — Wed, 11 Jan 2023 02:01:38 GMT

I have read it twice, both in English and in German.

Re: If You Could Choose

imastawka — Wed, 11 Jan 2023 05:01:41 GMT

@springyzone wrote:

The vatican, I think, has some ready cash but the main value is in the buildings themselves and they can't exactly pull them apart and sell them off to the highest bidder.

An understatement.

If I could choose, the Vatican would not be in my world.

And I was raised Catholic.