topic Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it in Community Spirit

Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

nero_bolt — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 00:09:11 GMT

I sure hope that all the true labor voters are going to like the new RUDD party and if KDUDD gets his way you will not know the Labor party any more.

It will be the RUDD party.

I do like the true labor party and what it used to stand for but sadly that all went with Gillard and RUDD is going to trash what is left

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NO, KEVIN Rudd is not saving Labor. He's smashing what's left and building a new Rudd Party.

That is the key to the brilliant return of President Rudd. You don't like the Opposition? Vote for Rudd.

Oh, you don't like Labor? Vote for Rudd.

And you do like Rudd don't you? See the picture he tweeted yesterday of the cut he got shaving? What a guy! Bleeding for the voters!

And with that mob's backing, Rudd has such control of the Party Formerly Known As Labor that its policies are only what he says they are.

No one in Labor knows whether Rudd plans to keep the deficit to $18 billion or blow it even bigger. No one knows if he'll scrap the carbon tax or slash the public service. Will he spend or save? How will he stop the boats?

It is all for Rudd to decide, and so far he's decided virtually nothing.

But what Labor MPs do know is that they can never remove him for as long as he wins elections. Under new party rules Rudd proposed this week, he will in effect be President for life, with only voters able to throw him out.

Rudd's rules ban Labor MPs from removing any Labor prime minister, except in the almost unimaginable circumstance of 75 per cent of them signing a petition charging him (or her) with bringing the party into disrepute - and even then a ballot of party members could outvote them. Only if a leader loses an election can they be challenged - and then only once.

The changes make Rudd not a Prime Minister but President, bigger than his party. But Labor MPs should ask not just whether Rudd - sacked three years ago for being a "control freak" and "dysfunctional" - can be trusted with such power but also whether Labor can afford to lose the freedom to renew itself in office.

Three of the past four Labor prime ministers - Bob Hawke, Rudd and Julia Gillard - lost their jobs at the hands of a challenger.

At least two of those changes worked. Paul Keating replaced an unfocused Bob Hawke to lead Labor to a famous win. In replacing Gillard, Rudd turned certain rout into possible victory.

Even Rudd's dumping in 2010 worked well enough, with Gillard winning an election Labor had feared was lost. Had Rudd not sabotaged the campaign, Gillard would have won comfortably. But under Rudd's rules, every one of those leadership changes would be banned and today Gillard would be leading Labor to annihilation.

A healthy party could never agree to what Rudd proposes - putting itself in the hands of a man it could never remove while he keeps winning. What if he went mad as Doc Evatt? What if he decided to go Green?

But Labor is crippled. It is now far less popular than Rudd, who has built his return on campaigning as much against his party as the Opposition. In his first ad, released last weekend, he declares: "I believe all Australians are sick and tired of negative politics. I believe people want all of us to raise the standards."

Rudd isn't just attacking Opposition Leader Tony Abbott, but disowning Labor under Gillard - the class war talk, the gender war, the yelling. This week he also attacked the power of Labor's "factional few" and criticised how Gillard replaced Senator Trish Crossin with her "captain's pick" of Nova Peris.

Rudd is running against Labor for the votes of people who left it and against the Opposition for the votes of the rest. So far it's working, with Newspoll having Labor level with the Coalition.

So Rudd will present his proposed power grab as almost a fait accompli at a special caucus meeting on July 22. Labor MPs know if they snub him, they will sign the party's death warrant.

Already faction leaders are swallowing their pride and doubts. Paul Howes, the Australian Workers Union secretary who helped tear down Rudd in 2010, said: "The proposals that Kevin Rudd has put up are smart."

True, unions of the Right will tomorrow discuss whether Rudd is indeed taking too much power, but most Labor MPs will feel forced to concede it to him.

Last year Workplace Minister Bill Shorten, asked if he agreed with PM Gillard, sarcastically replied: "I haven't seen what she said but let me say I support what it is that she said."

Now every other minister must give that answer, too: they haven't yet seen Rudd's policies, but they support whatever he says.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/opinion/make-way-for-president-kevin-rudd/story-fni0ffxg-1226677322068

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

lightningdance — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 00:16:50 GMT

Welcome back nero. You were sorely missed, even a thread was initiated asking where you are.

Here's hoping that you can stay for a while but as I've read & been pm'd there's a group on here who live to report.

I thought these boards would restrict this type of behaviour, the cliques, the vengeful reporting, but seems these new boards are even more suited to that type of behaviour.

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

nero_bolt — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 00:23:57 GMT

So it would seem LD from what I have read so far. People being reported just because they dont agree with the bullies and THE GROUP

Sad to see.

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Cosmo Howard and Mark D. Jarvis say Canada is a warning to Labor. Don’t make Kevin Rudd unsackable:

Unlike in other Westminster systems, the leaders of all Canadian parties have for some time been selected via national leadership conventions based on delegate or membership voting, replacing the role the parliamentary caucus played.

The change in Canada was embraced in the same language as Rudd’s: giving more power to party members, enhancing democratic legitimacy and creating more inclusive parties…

Yet the biggest impact of eliminating the caucus’s ability to remove a sitting party leader, including a prime minister, has been to dramatically alter the balance of power between parliamentary caucus and the leader.

The shift has granted the party leader an awesome degree of security, making them effectively unaccountable between periodic leadership contests or reviews.

Instead, party caucus members stand relatively powerless to address what they see as abuses of executive power or other cases of a leader not acting in the party’s interest, facilitating the excessive party discipline that has come to be a blight on partisan politics in Canada. And far from reinvigorating party membership and grassroots involvement, the Canadian changes haven’t done much to reverse the downward slide in party membership. Recent polling by the Samara institute suggests only about 10 per cent of Canadians are members of political parties.

I also worry about the cultural impact. This shifts us closer to celebrity politics and the cult of the Leader. I worry about the future of sound policy and debate - and of enlightened democracy.

True blue believers in the true Labor ethic and the once proud labor party should be worried....

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

lightningdance — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 00:36:48 GMT

Giving Rudd more power is like resurrecting Hitler. Yeah yeah, Godwins law, but completely appropriate in this instance.

This madman is power crazy & totally narcissistic in behaviour. He is a total phoney, all the smiley smiles & manic hand gestures are something I hoped would never be foisted on the Australian people ever again.

He plotted his revenge from the minute J Gillard knifed him, he plotted her downfall, undermined her every move & leaked like a sieve in 2010 to the extent that J Gillard was made to sit with him in the most humiliating fashion to pretend to the voters there was nothing wrong.

His jihad of revenge has been exposed but he makes out he's totally ignorant of any wrongdoing. Are people stupid? or are they of the mind that "whats in it for me" & that's all that matters to them.

I have no confidence in the coming election if Abbott doesn't get out there to expose this psycho, rebuff his taunting to debate him, & try to educate the voters of just what they would be in for if this phoney were to be voted back.

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

nero_bolt — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 00:53:01 GMT

It's Rudd's party now, unions just live in it

Read more: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/federal-politics/political-opinion/its-rudds-party-now-unions-just-live-in-it-20130710-2pqbz.html#ixzz2Yh4XMciw

The party has come back to Kevin Rudd on bended knee, desperate for the salvation only he seems capable of.

Be afraid if you are a true labor person

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

lakeland27 — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 01:05:37 GMT

fear manifests itself in many ways.

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

monman12 — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 01:45:09 GMT

Good that you are around NW, some of theacolytes were displaying concern over your non appearance. Myself I tend to lump you into my TRBAG container: predictable, outrageous at times, but "worthy" reading when compared with the porridge threads.

TAB: ALP 2.9 : Lib 1.38

nɥºɾ

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

lakeland27 — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 01:52:33 GMT

been a bit of a shift in those odds nɥºɾ , still some good money to be made backing rudd though .i dont think those prices will last long.

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

freakiness — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 02:39:11 GMT

@monman12 wrote:
Good that you are around NW, some of theacolytes were displaying concern over your non appearance. Myself I tend to lump you into my TRBAG container: predictable, outrageous at times, but "worthy" reading when compared with the porridge threads.

PS
TAB: ALP 2.9 : Lib 1.38

nɥºɾ

Why John? Why the constant subtle attacks on women?

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

monman12 — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 02:51:31 GMT

When it comes to gambling LL, forget party allegiances as a comment like this: "still some good money to be made backing rudd though" can be countered with: still some good money to be lost.

I agree LL that the odds will change, which way is anyone's bet, however the odds have for the last few federal elections, reflected the eventual outcome.

We now are in the equivalent of a "new" ALP era opposing the worn/ tired Libs, will Rudd be Pat-Man, or Progressive Man?. He does not have long to demonstrate which.

nɥºɾ

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

monman12 — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 02:57:23 GMT

FN: "Why John? Why the constant subtle attacks on women?"

Did you ever coach Gillard FN?

nɥºɾ

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

pct001wine — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 03:12:23 GMT

John, I'm a bloke, and may I say that the constant references to "Sisterhood" and such-like do you no credit.

I used to enjoy your sometimes incisive, often graph-laden, analyses of situations and posts, and you appeared then to not have a foot in any particular camp, be it gender-based or political. I have been on the receiving end of a gentle barb or two from you, mostly deserved, but always with an empirical/factual focus.

Now they seem to be littered with snide and irrelevant comments about people based on their gender, not their message.

I look forward to reading posts again from the "Old John".

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

lightningdance — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 03:26:35 GMT

When there's sites like Destroy the joint & other gender based groups like Emilys list and Women for Gillard, the CS group who endlessly post derogatory & insulting posts about Abbott., then I think monman's remarks are in context & acceptable.

Playing the sexist/gender card on here has been the purview of the women on here, they instigate it & they participate in it.

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

freakiness — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 04:24:26 GMT

@monman12 wrote:
FN: "Why John? Why the constant subtle attacks on women?"
Did you ever coach Gillard FN?

nɥºɾ

Of course not, why would I think she needs my coaching.

We spoke with no reference to gender, about the NBN and digital future.

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

freakiness — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 04:31:38 GMT

@lightningdance wrote:
When there's sites like Destroy the joint & other gender based groups like Emilys list and Women for Gillard, the CS group who endlessly post derogatory & insulting posts about Abbott., then I think monman's remarks are in context & acceptable.

Playing the sexist/gender card on here has been the purview of the women on here, they instigate it & they participate in it.

We've had men's clubs forever. Our society has always been patriachal so it stands to reason that groups will be formed to overcome that male domination. There is nothing wrong with that.

As for Emily's list, at least Labor are acting to improve the situation rather than allowing the token woman to come on board for more than tea making duties. It is NOT a bad or shameful thing. We should be proud of forcing change in an old boys club.

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

lightningdance — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 04:43:32 GMT

The sisterhood abandoned Gillard. Nothing like a bit of self preservation to sort the true believers of Emily's list out.

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

kilroy_is_here — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 04:53:20 GMT

i personally dont care waht sex my politions are as long as they are ellected on ability & have a clear set of veiws regardless of the fact that i agree or disagree with them.

the biggest tragity to take place so far in all of this is the diindorsment of a long serving labour polition ( who happens to be a woman) who had served her electrate for many years was a member of her party & had a set values & politics that she believed, only to be replaced by a non memeber who has admittedshe has no policies and no cleir veiws or directions on how she would fill the roll.and is only there becuase she was female aboriginal and fitted into a demigraphic that the prime minister wanted to promote.

choices should always be made around who best fits the job not who fills a quoter.

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

the_great_she_elephant — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 04:53:47 GMT

@lakeland27 wrote:
fear manifests itself in many ways.

Reading this thread, I had a flashback to a day,l many years ago, when my dad chopped the head of one of our chooks. To my utter amazement, it ran round the chook yard three time flapping its wings before it dropped.

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

lightningdance — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 05:05:45 GMT

Nova is obviously not an Emily's lister, whereas Crossin was a founding member who set it up after copying Jenny's list from the USA. Fat lot of good it did her in the eyes of the Emily's lister Gillard.
Moral of this story? There's no loyalty in politics as Crossin & Gillard both found out after the knife slid in.

Re: Make way for President Kevin Rudd and the end of the Labor Party as you know it

izabsmiling — Thu, 11 Jul 2013 05:23:05 GMT

Freaki , your question in #9 may have been answered within the comment quoted in that same post ?

"worthy" reading