topic Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy in Community Spirit

Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

imastawka — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 04:30:55 GMT

Ebay have removed listings, worldwide, in the last couple of days

for Golliwog/Golly citing the 'hateful or discriminatory policy.'

Aunt Jemima dolls (mammy dolls) have also gone

The weird part is, there was a sub-category in Dolls/Bears for Golliwogs

All things Golliwog have disappeared.

Books including ones by Enid Blyton have gone.

It's ok to sell them, just don't put golliwog/golly in the title.

I have been informed that I need to be educated on the matter,

and have been given links to things like the Jim Crow Museum

http://www.ferris.edu/HTMLS/news/jimcrow/golliwog/

My own opinion is, I love gollies. I can see no relevance to them in Australia.

I think they are/were a much loved toy with no underlying racial tones.

A lot of people may be upset by the images, but I think Ebay has just made

them worth a lot more money on other sites.

I'm not looking for an argument, and you won't get one.

I would just like some more opinions.

It started on the Selling Boards

http://community.ebay.com.au/t5/Selling/Item-specific-Listing-Removed-Sick-Of-It/td-p/1834945

I would hope that opinions do not run too hot, and turn into arguments.

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

opmania — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 04:43:34 GMT

I'm not sure if there is a problem

With the doll the name or both

What if someone was to update a similar

Doll with plait hair with beads

Funky clothes

Same doll but just bring it into the

21 St century how would that go do you think

Because I've been thinking about that for

Ages

Call it something different like a funky diva

Doll

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

polksaladallie — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 04:46:45 GMT

I just googled, and there are books and Blyton books and pattern books still there. ?

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

imastawka — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 04:51:04 GMT

There are plenty of black/brown dolls out there - like Blythe dolls for instance.

But the objection with golly and mammy dolls is their background

of minstrel blackface and domestic slavery.

I had no knowledge of that when I was four, and I doubt it would have meant

anything to me either.

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

i-need-a-martini — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 04:51:40 GMT

I am surprised that ebay still allowed the dolls to be listed.

The tide turned on those dolls in the UK in the 1960's and finally death knell happened 30 years ago when Enid Blyton books removed the golloiwog characters when they finally appreciated the reality of what the dolls stood for.

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

imastawka — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 04:53:54 GMT

@polksaladallie wrote:
I just googled, and there are books and Blyton books and pattern books still there. ?

Did you google or search on ebay? Zilch on ebay

Enid Blyton books have golly on the cover, but not in the title.

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

i-need-a-martini — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 04:53:54 GMT

@imastawka wrote:
There are plenty of black/brown dolls out there - like Blythe dolls for instance.

But the objection with golly and mammy dolls is their background
of minstrel blackface and domestic slavery.

I had no knowledge of that when I was four, and I doubt it would have meant
anything to me either.

Perhaps not ima. But think about how the golliwogs/black characters were always potrayed by Enid Blyton - dirty, nasty, thieving, naughty. Whether you recall knowledge or not, the subconcious retains informaion like this.

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

bright.ton42 — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 04:57:05 GMT

@imastawka wrote:
There are plenty of black/brown dolls out there - like Blythe dolls for instance.

But the objection with golly and mammy dolls is their background
of minstrel blackface and domestic slavery.

I had no knowledge of that when I was four, and I doubt it would have meant
anything to me either.

Same with me stawka. I loved my golliwog dolly, just like my favourite baby doll was a brown ceramic beauty which I loved best of all. It's adults who give them the racist tag not children.

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

imastawka — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 04:59:06 GMT

But think about how the golliwogs/black characters were always potrayed by Enid Blyton - dirty, nasty, thieving, naughty. Whether you recall knowledge or not, the subconcious retains informaion like this.

I never had books as a child. I remember reading somewhere that Enid's Golly

was turned into a helpful taxi driver.

But then, Big Ears was accused of being gay. Did that image remain embedded?

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

polksaladallie — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 05:05:43 GMT

New Idea Sewing Pattern 1971 Cute Doll Golliwog Toy CRAFT Retro Sew Project ★

VINTAGE VILLAWOOL TOY KNITTING PATTERN BOOK 159 DOG BEAR BUNNY GOLLIWOG - CUTE!

Vintage patons knitting book no 596 children 2-8 years jumpers jackets golliwog

Enid Blyton Books Includes The Three Golliwogs Enid Blyton books, Three Golliwogs, Bimbo and Topsy, Stories for Bedtime .

There are quite a lot.

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

opmania — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 05:06:32 GMT

What about all the brown

Downing plates on eBay with

Characteur picininis

Always on here

How is that different

Did you know that on a

Previous trip to Sydney

Oprah would only come on

The condition that all

Golliwogs were removed from

The stores

That was a few years back

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

imastawka — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 05:08:15 GMT

Too late to edit. Found this -

The original Noddy stories featured golliwogs who lived in Golly Town, including Mr Golly, one of Noddy's best friends who ran Toyland's garage and looked after Noddy's car.

For Noddy's 60th birthday

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/6359248/Noddy-returns-without-the-golliwogs.html

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

polksaladallie — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 05:14:59 GMT

111738139642

111669654903

251286597908 These are books.

252040947251

There are plenty on ebay.

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

imastawka — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 05:16:11 GMT

Polks, it seems that ebay are discriminatory and should report themselves.

All those listings only post to Australia and not worldwide.

That means the listing would not show on any other ebay site except Australia

So the US ebayers would not get offended I guess

I'm also thinking ebay haven't caught up with everybody yet.

Opmania, yes, the same thing happened in Melbourne when Oprah visited here.

The ex-premier of Victoria Jeff Kennett is a golly collector

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

polksaladallie — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 05:17:08 GMT

OK, I thought you meant they had disappeared everywhere on eBay.

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

imastawka — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 05:18:53 GMT

@polksaladallie wrote:
OK, I thought you meant they had disappeared everywhere on eBay.

I thought they had too. I really think it's only a matter of time

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

imastawka — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 05:22:13 GMT

What about all the brown

Downing plates on eBay with

Characteur picininis

Always on here

How is that different

Opmania. Brownie Downing, and Peg Maltby for that matter,

Are painters of delightful aboriginal children.

They are in no way what the golly haters call 'grotesque charicatures'

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

lloydslights — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 06:24:17 GMT

But the objection with golly and mammy dolls is their background

of minstrel blackface and domestic slavery.

I wonder if any Al Jolson records or movies will be banned or indeed the classic Gone with the Wind, following that reasoning.

DEB

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

moonflyte — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 06:26:44 GMT

@imastawka wrote:
What about all the brown
Downing plates on eBay with
Characteur picininis
Always on here
How is that different

Opmania. Brownie Downing, and Peg Maltby for that matter,
Are painters of delightful aboriginal children.

They are in no way what the golly haters call 'grotesque charicatures'

But isn't that the same thing, objectifying a race?

Re: Racist and Hateful? or Much Loved Toy

polksaladallie — Sat, 15 Aug 2015 06:28:35 GMT

There was no minstrel blackface or domestic slavery in Gone With the Wind, not in the versions I have seen and read.