topic Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight in Community Spirit

deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

davidc4430 — Sat, 25 May 2019 07:25:59 GMT

Perth deafblind woman refused on board Jetstar flight says airline discriminated against her

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-25/deafblind-woman-vanessa-vlajkovic-unable-to-board-jetstar-flight/11149632

very sad once again a person with a disability is treated badly.

would she be refused a ride on a bus? or a train?

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

not_for_sale — Sat, 25 May 2019 07:40:51 GMT

It doesn't read to me that Jetstar discriminated against her. That's harsh and typical of the modern trend to play the 'It's because I'm.... card'. Jetstar stuffed up and that wasn't good enough. But they have a safety policy to follow. They apologised and I hope they learn from this and improve their service. But I do not see anything to suggest they treated her in an unfair manner just because she is deafblind.

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

domino-710 — Sat, 25 May 2019 08:21:51 GMT

I agree - no matter the ' disability ' - the responsibility - lays with the individual.

Don't go too close to the edge - oh sheesh - there was no sign telling me that.

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

chameleon54 — Sun, 26 May 2019 09:37:06 GMT

@domino-710 wrote:
I agree - no matter the ' disability ' - the responsibility - lays with the individual.

Don't go too close to the edge - oh sheesh - there was no sign telling me that.

I think thats a little harsh. The woman contacted Jetstar twice before attending the airport to confirm arrangements for her flight. Yes they stuffed up, but the answer would be simple. Have a hostess ( is that what they call them now ? ) assist the woman to her seat and allocate a staff member to assist the woman in the unlikely event of an emergency.

My wife is completely blind and regularly uses taxis and public buses to travel unaccompanied to the city. She phones the bus company a couple of days before to make the appropriate arrangements ( as the deafblind woman did ) and has never had any problems. Sure we live in a large rural town / city which is small enough for bus staff to know their regular customers. They reserve the same double seat for the missus at the top of the stairs just behind the driver each time. This allows her to access everything herself with the assistance of her guide dog.

She also arranges for a sited guide or the bus driver to assist her to a taxi at the other end once he has sorted out all of the other passengers and their luggage. Its not really that hard or a big drama. She's been doing it for years without any problems and everyone has been very helpful and accomodating.

She also uses a very accurate talking GPS system that can be programmed to give directions in metre increments to the city taxi ranks and final destination including right to the front door etc. Technology has come a long way in assisting people with disabilities..

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

domino-710 — Sun, 26 May 2019 22:42:38 GMT

@chameleon54 wrote:
@domino-710 wrote:
I agree - no matter the ' disability ' - the responsibility - lays with the individual.

Don't go too close to the edge - oh sheesh - there was no sign telling me that.

I think thats a little harsh. The woman contacted Jetstar twice before attending the airport to confirm arrangements for her flight. Yes they stuffed up, but the answer would be simple. Have a hostess ( is that what they call them now ? ) assist the woman to her seat and allocate a staff member to assist the woman in the unlikely event of an emergency.

My wife is completely blind and regularly uses taxis and public buses to travel unaccompanied to the city. She phones the bus company a couple of days before to make the appropriate arrangements ( as the deafblind woman did ) and has never had any problems. Sure we live in a large rural town / city which is small enough for bus staff to know their regular customers. They reserve the same double seat for the missus at the top of the stairs just behind the driver each time. This allows her to access everything herself with the assistance of her guide dog.

She also arranges for a sited guide or the bus driver to assist her to a taxi at the other end once he has sorted out all of the other passengers and their luggage. Its not really that hard or a big drama. She's been doing it for years without any problems and everyone has been very helpful and accomodating.

She also uses a very accurate talking GPS system that can be programmed to give directions in metre increments to the city taxi ranks and final destination including right to the front door etc. Technology has come a long way in assisting people with disabilities..

Chameleon - all regular readers here would be aware of your wife's diffculties.

That - which you have described above is exactly someone taking responsibility.

It is not comparable to a commercial airline - with several hundred passengers - all deserving equal consideration.

How many hostesses to go around - it is not only emergencies - but simple everyday necessities - like bathroom facilites etc.

Depending on an unlikely emergency - circumstances may not even allow a hostess to reach that particular passenger.

Could she even find a breathing aparatus.

As stated had the airline got it right - both disablities - the young woman would have been denied travel without a carer.

Not sure how often you have flown - but no - there is no simple ' answer '.

Without a carer - it is doubtful the young woman would have even been eligible for travel insurance.

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

chameleon54 — Mon, 27 May 2019 01:53:15 GMT

I get your point and agree with some of it. A lot probably depends on the individuals attitude. The missus is very practicle about her situation and is quite understanding that she might have to wait now and again for assistance. Sometimes this can be for extended periods of time. She also tries to minimise the inconvenience she causes others, reducing her requirements for assistance to the minimum.

Having spent quite a bit of time in the disability sector I appreciate there can be people with disabilities ( as in other walks of life ) who can tend to play up their issues. They are definately in the minority, but they are out there and when you come across them, they can be very " high maintenence".

It can be very frustrating for people with disabilities when there is an obvious lack of care or empathy to their situation, especially by large corporations and their staff such as this airline.

The deafblind woman phoned twice to make the appropriate arrangements. She paid for her ticket, packed her bags ( no doubt with some excitement at the prospect of her first independent flight ) and got to the airport in time, only to find the airline staff had stuffed up. I dont think she is being unreasonable in expecting they would make the neccesary arrangements to get her onto the flight.

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

domino-710 — Mon, 27 May 2019 02:14:25 GMT

Well - I think one point has been missed :

"I called [Jetstar] twice and had a discussion with some staff to make sure that they knew I had a disability, to make sure that they knew I had special needs," Ms Vlajkovic told the ABC through an interpreter.

The young woman is deafblind.

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

davidc4430 — Mon, 27 May 2019 02:31:56 GMT

@chameleon54 wrote:
I get your point and agree with some of it. A lot probably depends on the individuals attitude. The missus is very practicle about her situation and is quite understanding that she might have to wait now and again for assistance. Sometimes this can be for extended periods of time. She also tries to minimise the inconvenience she causes others, reducing her requirements for assistance to the minimum.

Having spent quite a bit of time in the disability sector I appreciate there can be people with disabilities ( as in other walks of life ) who can tend to play up their issues. They are definately in the minority, but they are out there and when you come across them, they can be very " high maintenence".

It can be very frustrating for people with disabilities when there is an obvious lack of care or empathy to their situation, especially by large corporations and their staff such as this airline.

The deafblind woman phoned twice to make the appropriate arrangements. She paid for her ticket, packed her bags ( no doubt with some excitement at the prospect of her first independent flight ) and got to the airport in time, only to find the airline staff had stuffed up. I dont think she is being unreasonable in expecting they would make the neccesary arrangements to get her onto the flight.

something ive noticed about attitudes to any one who has a disability and thus needs help to live a more normal life by some in society is 'if they cant help themselves they should stay home'

our once 'lend a hand' to those less fortunate in society is getting an influx of 'i'm ok jack stuff you' people.

there is no proof this woman couldnt do the things such as 'find an oxygen mask'

and what is she couldnt?

a so called normal person in a panic might well not be able to do it either.

who says she cant use a toilet without help?

are they saying if in an emergency they have anyone on board who cant follow 'procedure' will not get any help?

absolute rubbish.

lets say she had a 'carer' with her and there was an emergency and the carer was killed, would no one step in and help her?

if the answer is 'no' then what a sad situation.

looks to me like a lot of excuses to cover a wrong.

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

domino-710 — Mon, 27 May 2019 03:01:31 GMT

I don't know when you last flew.

Just a question - if travelling with a small child/children - who do you give air to first.

Where is you life jacket.

The airline delayed the flight 45 minutes.

How many missed connecting flights.

How many missed a job interview.

How many missed an important Dr's appointment.

It goes on - what about the cost to airlines - late planes - traffic control - it is not simple.

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

davidc4430 — Mon, 27 May 2019 03:11:30 GMT

@domino-710 wrote:
I don't know when you last flew.

Just a question - if travelling with a small child/children - who do you give air to first.

Where is you life jacket.

The airline delayed the flight 45 minutes.

How many missed connecting flights.
How many missed a job interview.
How many missed an important Dr's appointment.

It goes on - what about the cost to airlines - late planes - traffic control - it is not simple.

when i was 5

i watch the tv programs about why planes crash and would only fly in one at last resort.

as for this woman, she didnt hold the plane up from takeoff.

that was the idiot airline staff.

they had a simple choice, refuse her permission to fly or put her in her seat.

for 45 minutes they didnt do either.

she did what she was told to by the airline people.

she told them her situation, when booking her flight, it was their screw-up not hers.

if people were delayed and missed apointments, were late for anything, its not her fault.

instead of running around not knowing what to do they could have just put her on the damn plane and crossed their fingers!

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

domino-710 — Mon, 27 May 2019 03:47:23 GMT

This is not a train - nor a bus.

Nor is it about discrimination against people with disabilities.

One is expected at the airport at least 2 hours for domestic travel - before boarding.

The very thought if she were my daughter - (keeping in mind the young woman is deafblind) - how to find a loo - how to find a departure gate - and indeed how to find someone to even ask.

Being - perhaps followed into a loo - this is not a perfect world - she is unable to either hear or see danger.

I simply think - with some disabilities - common sense should dictate - that which is safe & that which is not.

Oh - who would you give air to first. lol

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

davidc4430 — Mon, 27 May 2019 04:05:15 GMT

your very intollerant arnt you

ive noticed you have little sympathy for people with disabilitys

they are fine as long as they dont try to be like normal people right?

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

lyndal1838 — Mon, 27 May 2019 04:09:40 GMT

She did arrive at the departure gate with a support person who explained everything to the airline staff who then spent 45 minutes trying to find a staff member to fly with her.

It would appear that she did everything correctly but the airline staff stuffed up.

With the disabilities that she has I think it should be up to her to travel with her own support person and not expect the airline to provide someone to "babysit".

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

chameleon54 — Mon, 27 May 2019 04:16:13 GMT

@domino-710 wrote:

This is not a train - nor a bus.

No, but the principle is the same. The disabled person needs to navigate through a series of physical obstacles to reach the check in and be escorted to a seat. This would often be with the assistance of a sighted guide, but not always. It is very possible the woman could be assisted with a guide dog. The missus uses one and along with her technical ' tools " such as the GPS is able to walk 1.5 km. through heavily built up areas with a number of road crossings etc. to the gym or library, get to doctors appointments independantly, go to the PO and collect mail etc. The guide dog has been trained to find our mail box among 4000 others and put his nose on it. She also makes her own way to the council chambers for meetings with staff as a disability advocate.

There is a common misconception that people with disabilities should just sit at home and cant do anything much for themselves. This is simply not correct. Sure some stuff is harder, but many people simply adapt to their circumstances quite well. They might just need a bit of assistance now and again.

And as for how often the wife has flown on major airlines. The answer is more often than me. Probably around half a dozen times since we where married. She travels a lot more than I do including occasionally flying to visit interstate relatives.

Nor is it about discrimination against people with disabilities.

One is expected at the airport at least 2 hours for domestic travel - before boarding.

The deafblind woman may well have been there on time.

The very thought if she were my daughter - (keeping in mind the young woman is deafblind) - how to find a loo - how to find a departure gate - and indeed how to find someone to even ask.

Guide dog maybe ? They can find loos. ( The smell...... )

Being - perhaps followed into a loo - this is not a perfect world - she is unable to either hear or see danger.

Life is full of dangers. We cant all simply stay in our homes because it is too dangerous outside...

I simply think - with some disabilities - common sense should dictate - that which is safe & that which is not.

Again.... everyone makes a trade off between safety and living and experiencing their lives. Every time you cross a road, drive a car or even travel on an airline.

Oh - who would you give air to first. lol

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

lyndal1838 — Mon, 27 May 2019 04:25:07 GMT

@davidc4430 wrote:
your very intollerant arnt you
ive noticed you have little sympathy for people with disabilitys
they are fine as long as they dont try to be like normal people right?

Intolerant or not, there are some disabilities or combination of disabilities that require some sort of restrictions on the person leading a "normal" life.

I have known deaf people and blind people and each of them has been able to compensate for their particular disability but I can't even begin to understand how they would function on their own with both disabilities.

David, putting the young woman on the plane and crossing their fingers just does not cut it. Do you think the airline would have spent 45 minutes trying to find a staff member to fly with her if they did not have to. If something had gone wrong how would it look at an enquiry if they had just stuck her in a seat and crossed their fingers?

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

domino-710 — Mon, 27 May 2019 04:27:43 GMT

That really is quite offensive.

You have no idea of my life - my family - nor my friends.

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

domino-710 — Mon, 27 May 2019 04:31:38 GMT

@domino-710 wrote:
Well - I think one point has been missed :

"I called [Jetstar] twice and had a discussion with some staff to make sure that they knew I had a disability, to make sure that they knew I had special needs," Ms Vlajkovic told the ABC through an interpreter.

The young woman is deafblind.

I repeat - how did she/herself call - discuss - listen to & hear - ' Yeah - that's all good '.

It states she spoke to the ABC through an interpreter.

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

davidc4430 — Mon, 27 May 2019 05:01:23 GMT

@domino-710 wrote:
That really is quite offensive.

You have no idea of my life - my family - nor my friends.

i find 99% of what you write quite offensive too, funny that.

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

davidc4430 — Mon, 27 May 2019 05:10:10 GMT

@lyndal1838 wrote:
@davidc4430 wrote:
your very intollerant arnt you
ive noticed you have little sympathy for people with disabilitys
they are fine as long as they dont try to be like normal people right?
Intolerant or not, there are some disabilities or combination of disabilities that require some sort of restrictions on the person leading a "normal" life.

I have known deaf people and blind people and each of them has been able to compensate for their particular disability but I can't even begin to understand how they would function on their own with both disabilities.

David, putting the young woman on the plane and crossing their fingers just does not cut it. Do you think the airline would have spent 45 minutes trying to find a staff member to fly with her if they did not have to. If something had gone wrong how would it look at an enquiry if they had just stuck her in a seat and crossed their fingers?

of course i was not serious about 'crossing fingers'

merely showing the rules are silly, when so called 'normal' people may well require 'help' too in an emergency.

yes, totally agree, we 'normal' people need to 'help' those with disabilitys fit into our world.

not put barriers up and blame them for our poor performance.

i honestly dont believe had she been put on the plane anything bad would of happend because of it.

maybe a stewardess may have needed to assist her in some small way, i dont know, but she seems a very able person.

she did the right things, but had her trip ruined by the failure of the 'normals'

Re: deafblind woman refused Jetstar flight

chameleon54 — Mon, 27 May 2019 05:26:44 GMT

R.I.P Twistie......

On the subject of what people with disabilities can do. ( or shouldnt try to do ) ....

Just heard the sad news that twistie has passed away today. Twistie was so named because his torso and short stumpy arms and hands where severly deformed from birth giving him the appearance of the salty yellow crisp sold in delis. Sure it wasnt a very P.C name, but twistie embraced the name and life and just got on with it.

Twistie was well known in yard dog trials and had one of the best kelpie studs in Australia. The old black kelpie I have came from Twistie and he took him back on several occasions for breeding purposes...........HE STILL OWES ME A KELPIE PUP AS A SERVICE FEE !!!

As well as trailing dogs right around Australia, Twistie with the half sized arms and deformed claws of hands DROVE SEMI TRAILERS for a living. Not just a specially modified semi with special controls, but any truck he climbed into. He specialised in livestock carrying, loading four decks of sheep or two decks of cattle on his own. He didnt ask for help and didnt need it. I have no idea how he changed the 18 gears or reached the steering wheel, but he managed perfectly fine, travelling many hundreds of kilometres at a time.

Although terribly deformed he wasnt disabled in any way. R.I.P to a country legend.