topic Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams in Buying

Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

maisy_ferret — Sat, 22 Apr 2023 01:23:20 GMT

These are everywhere and getting worse. The seller pretends to be in Australia, so that even filtering your search for "Australia only" includes them. Here are some observations on how to spot them. eBay should be doing the same and closing every single account.

1. They are normally "in-yer-face" about being Australian (not always, but commonly). There are Aussie flags and/or Aussie maps in the product pictures that appear in your search. Their name often ends in "_au", as in "ChineseScammer_au".

2. If you search for the same seller name (go to advanced search and select "search by seller", you will often find that the same seller is pulling the same trick in other locations. So, if you suspect that "ChineseScammer_au" is faking their location to be in Australia, try searching for "ChineseScammer_us" and "ChineseScammer_eu" to see if they have global aspirations (the short answer is, yes... yes, they do).

3. The location is often vague, as: "Located: NSW, Australia"

4. When you push them for an actual address, they come up with a real doozy... often involving huge mail centres like Chullora or Botany. A common one looks like this:

"Union Lucky Returns, P O Box 6008 #XXXXXX, CHULLORA New South Wales 1405 AU"

This is used to fake mail locations such that multiple businesses can have an Australian postal address (although if that address doesn't scream "scammer" then you need to read it again).

5. Contact may be revealing. They message in northern-hemisphere-friendly times. Yes, I am not only suggesting that the *item* is not in Australia, but the actual seller is not in Australia either. The replies seem to be partially auto-generated, often starting with "Dear friend".

6. The tracking number won't work with Australia Post. It just won't. Because the Australian item is in China. Try China Post. I guarantee you the tracking number works! And note how the China Post tracking will also be scam-friendly in that it will refer to "Picked up at AU Warehouse" etc. and the origin will be listed as "Australia", with the ever-present Australian flag.

7. When the item arrives (which can sometimes be quite quick, but China Post tracking states it can vary from 7 to 60 days), the packaging is completely non-descript. There is nothing to indicate that it was sent from an Australian facility (because it wasn't). There will be small clues that it was sent from China, but they will not be obvious, just another scam-friendly feature I guess.

8. The seller will absolutely NOT budge. Not a millimetre. They will state that they are in Australia no matter what evidence you throw at them. Even if the item was an $8 thing, they will fight to the end. When things get tough (like you contact eBay), then the "Dear friend" messages start arriving in earnest, attempting to wear you down to the point where you will accept some partial payment that you really don't want to accept but this starts to feel like it will take up the rest of your life so you surrender to it.

PLEASE report all to eBay. If you paid by PayPal, open a dispute. The seller will deny everything. Persist. If your item cost a couple of dollars, do it anyway. PayPal communicate to eBay, so also suggest that the account be closed, and if you found any others where it is clear that the same seller is operating with different IDs (e.g., swapping out "_au" for "_us", searching for the same item description and finding suspiciously identical adverts), let PayPal/eBay know about that as well.

These people have overrun eBay. As a buyer you are being misled. As an honest seller you are having customers funneled away from you. And, quite simply, it is also a breach of eBay policy.

Everything you can do to close them is a Good Thing (TM)!!!

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

sandypebbles — Sat, 22 Apr 2023 01:42:45 GMT

All anyone needs to do is look where the seller is registered

The same thing has been posted on the forum hundreds of times

Everyone here knows exactly what 'Chullora' and other suburb code names for sellers registered in China means

And a huge number of buyers still buy from them and then complain

SO easily avoided

Of course, it means pressing one extra button

Better to buy from just anyone and then complain they were 'mislead'

Read the feedback page before you buy

Very very very very simple to do

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

imastawka — Sat, 22 Apr 2023 01:48:24 GMT

Just so you know - ebay don't care.

They get their fees.

It's also why they are called Teflon sellers.

It's much simpler than your rant....just look at their feedback page and it shows where they are registered.

If they are registered in China, then that's most likely where the item is coming from.

After checking where they are registered, JUST DON'T BUY FROM THEM!

If people stopped buying from them, then they would weed themselves out.

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

daydreams_12 — Sat, 22 Apr 2023 02:10:26 GMT

You have been a member over 20 years I find it hard to believe that you do not check "where registered & feedback" before undertaking any purchase. Due diligence is the name of the game.

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

sugar249 — Sat, 22 Apr 2023 02:17:20 GMT

I'm confused, last time I checked drop shipping wasnt against any law.

yes being located in china and pretending to be in Australia is dodgy.

But you seem to be implying drop shipping is a scam, there are many business's that legitimately use drop shipping.

I think you have 2 different issues mixed up.

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

imastawka — Sat, 22 Apr 2023 02:36:09 GMT

What policy, exactly, is it you think they are breaking?

Drop shipping | eBay

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

springyzone — Sat, 22 Apr 2023 02:43:15 GMT

Unfortunately some sellers are very misleading both on ebay and elsewhere. The advertising may lead you to suppose they are aussie sellers.

On ebay, I have found the best guide is the delivery date range.

If the end date is outside what you are prepared to put up with, don't buy. It is probably one of these Chinese sellers.

If the delivery date is reasonable but the item doesn't arrive by then, open an item not received claim. With ebay. Get your money back.

As sandy said, you can also check beforehand where the seller is registered and this is worth doing even if it does take an extra click and bit of investigating.

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

countessalmirena — Sat, 22 Apr 2023 06:23:09 GMT

OP, you post this as though it’s new information. However, most of the regular posters here have only posted how to identify Chinese eBay sellers… but they (including me) have done so more exactly and more simply.

There’s no need to go on a comparison hunt. Check the seller’s feedback profile page (accessible by clicking onto their feedback %) and you will see it in black and white.

Registered in China xx/xx/xxx

These sellers are not subject to eBay Australia rules in the same way that sellers registered in eBay Australia are. eBay.com.au and eBay.cn are two different animals. eBay Australia does permit such sellers to list item location as somewhere in Australia, even when it’s not. Do a search on these boards for “just in time fulfilment” - I for one have explained this a few times after another well-respected member first introduced the topic here.

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

gutterpunkz05 — Sat, 22 Apr 2023 10:23:11 GMT

Obviously you dont know much about logistics, be it national or international.

Just a couple of recent instances for you, ordered machinery parts from a B&M distributor in Qld. No worries parts will be overnighted from Sydney warehouse. Next day, sorry parts now on back order from USA. Estimated delivery date, your guess is as good as mine.

Separate purchase 1 pallet of industrial parts, purchased from B&M Distributor with $800 for express freight, normally 3-4 days door to door. 14 days and item has still not left distributor. Issue currently under investigation.

Two weeks ago, went to buy a new vehicle. Vehicle not expected to be available for another 4 months, despite the fact that it is just over 100km away. Unfortunately it is stranded of the eastern seaboard, along with 1000's of others, waiting for port entry due to quarantine delays.

For years international logistics, which also includes drop shipping (completely legal), has operated on a just in time system. Will the system grind to a halt, your guess is as good as mine

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

maisy_ferret — Fri, 12 May 2023 02:20:21 GMT

Actually, the location fraud I am talking about is about faking the location... hence the name... If all you are doing is checking the feedback page then you haven't seen it.

... so my "rant" stands....

... and yours doesn't.

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

maisy_ferret — Fri, 12 May 2023 02:26:08 GMT

That's a good point, really. Many legit businesses drop ship (usually from China).

My commentary was about location fraud more than anything. These dropshippers are scammers in the sense that what they work very hard at is to convince the buyer community that they and their products are in a specific country, when that is not true. I think the content stands, but I agree there is some room to be confused. Perhaps the title should have been "Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Location Scams"... the word "location" should have also been more prominent in the account.

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

sandypebbles — Fri, 12 May 2023 02:26:50 GMT

Yes, we have all seen it

And yes, we are all aware that eBay allow sellers to put anywhere as the item location, and that, alone is meaningless

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

maisy_ferret — Fri, 12 May 2023 02:30:08 GMT

It's called the "policy" of not lying about your product. Part of the "product" is where it is located. There are times when that could be meaningful. For example, buying a product purportedly located in Australia, but being shipped from China changes delivery times. China Post says it can extend up to 60 days. It often doesn't, but that is not the point. The point is that they are misrepresenting the location of themselves and the product. The thing I bought (yeah, I know, I wasn't paying attention) was not as described. That is more likely to be the case when people don't handle the product and send it to. So, there are two reasons. They aren't difficult. I'm surprised you had to ask, considering one involves a small matter of fraud (and discussions with eBay confirm).

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

imastawka — Fri, 12 May 2023 02:58:23 GMT

@maisy_ferret wrote:
Actually, the location fraud I am talking about is about faking the location... hence the name... If all you are doing is checking the feedback page then you haven't seen it.

... so my "rant" stands....

... and yours doesn't.

Firstly, I wasn't ranting. But you admit you were.

And secondly, you didn't read my post properly -

'Ebay don't care' and 'if they are registered in China, then that's most likely where the item is coming from'.

And thirdly - I just don't care anymore.

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

*sons_n_daughters* — Fri, 12 May 2023 10:14:30 GMT

Check where the seller is REGISTERED because that's where the item will be coming from, not where the listing says it is. Then you can avoid these issues.

There is no so called fraud. As a buyer, it's up to you know how everything happens, including dropshipping. Learn how ebay works. If that doesn't work for you, threaten to close your account. That always works (yeah right).

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

springyzone — Sat, 13 May 2023 00:59:09 GMT

@maisy_ferret wrote:
Part of the "product" is where it is located. There are times when that could be meaningful. For example, buying a product purportedly located in Australia, but being shipped from China changes delivery times. China Post says it can extend up to 60 days. It often doesn't, but that is not the point. The point is that they are misrepresenting the location of themselves and the product.

If an item is delayed past the advertised delivery window, then the solution to this is to open an ebay claim for item not received. Do it within a week or so of the due date. Never put up with a 60 day delay, it doesn't matter what the seller says. It doesn't matter if it is coming via China post or Aus post. Not your problem. Tolerate no long delays.

The main problem with item misrepresentation is that some overseas goods may be unsafe. They may not conform to the expected standards that items have to meet when they are imported by big companies here for commercial sale. This applies especially to electrical items, electronics, that sort of thing.

Your best bet is just to check feedback, ETA and where the seller is registered.

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

loupy31 — Wed, 17 May 2023 04:18:01 GMT

I have had similar problems, I am in SA, Item was supposed to be in Melbourne,

But Further research, after I purchased it, showed, it was coming from china, After many hours with ebay, I got a full refund, just over a month of waiting, the seller is a total A.Hole,

And yes, Faking the location is Fraud, which ever way you look at it, And is subject to Australian laws

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

sandypebbles — Wed, 17 May 2023 04:24:20 GMT

All of which could have been avoided by checking who you were buying from before doing so

Would have taken 5 seconds

No need to 'further research' or 'spend hours with ebay'

Yes, the seller is clearly shown as registered in China

Yes, the feedback % is an utter shocker

Even if the seller AND the item really were in Australia , the feedback is still enough to ring alarm bells to avoid avoid avoid

If you are going to use 'Australian consumer law' nonsense, then report it

Such law do not apply to sellers registered in China

No I don't work for eBay'

No, I don't buy from sellers who are as dodgy as the day is long and then complain

No, I don't help such sellers stay in business

Go and report them to the proper authorities 'under Australian consumer law'

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

countessalmirena — Wed, 17 May 2023 04:47:42 GMT

@loupy31, search on these boards for “just in time fulfilment”. I’ve posted about it several times. It explains how an item not in Australia may be considered to be, nonetheless, in Australia, according to eBay policy.

It’s not an ACL issue.

To avoid buying from sellers in China (where the possibility of the item location probably being China is high), check seller location, not item location.

To avoid buying from sellers in Australia who are drop-shipping etc., check feedback comments (filtered to just negatives over last 12 months) to see if the comments state something along those lines.

Rule out unrealistically low prices for items in your searches; this is one of the best ways to weed out the most obvious unbranded Chinese listings.

I would probably put it at under 30 seconds or so to rule out a seller or listing in my searches.

Re: Beware Chinese Drop-Shipping Scams

sugar249 — Wed, 17 May 2023 12:22:00 GMT

@loupy31 wrote:
I have had similar problems, I am in SA, Item was supposed to be in Melbourne,

But Further research, after I purchased it, showed, it was coming from china, After many hours with ebay, I got a full refund, just over a month of waiting, the seller is a total A.Hole,
And yes, Faking the location is Fraud, which ever way you look at it, And is subject to Australian laws

Maybe had you spent just 30 seconds of research before you hit the buy button, you would have saved your self the further research and hours to Ebay. The sellers Feedback is rubbish already.

You really only have yourself to blame, you even admit in your feedback that the sellers feedback is bad. Why did you buy??