topic Re: Damaged item. in Buying

Damaged item.

donnao6703 — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 07:06:02 GMT

I have just recieved a damaged item. (large wall clock). Total cost- $60 : ($30 for the clock + $30 postage)
The seller is stating that she is only willing to reimburse me for the price of the clock, not the postage, as she claims she would be out of pocket, even though I paid for it. The actual cost of postage was $18 but she say's the packaging cost her an additional $11. I highly doubt that as most of it seemed used but regardless, I paid for postage not her. She says that she is within her rights to do this according to Ebay rules but I can't find anything about it on the site.

My inital message to her was to let her know about the damage and provide photo's. I said that either I could send the item back for a full refund or she could refund me $40 and keep the other $20 so she doesn't completely lose out. I thought that was fair, she doesn't.

I paid by Paypal but have read quite a few posts saying that they don't cover damaged items so it's pointless trying to make a claim through them. Not sure what to do. Any advice would be appreciated.

Re: Damaged item.

2106greencat — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 07:09:27 GMT

If the seller pushes the point and you have to open INAD you will need to return the item at your cost as per paypal rules, so yes, taking a refund without having to return is most likely the best way to go.

In saying that, a decent seller would cover postage, (I most certainly would) so you can certainly make your feelings known in feedback (after you get the refund).

Re: Damaged item.

donnao6703 — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 07:24:14 GMT

I'm fine with paying for the return postage in exchange for a full refund (even though it will leave me out of pocket a little) but she doesn't seem to want the item back. She just wants to refund the price of the clock ( $30) not the postage I paid, nor take up the offer of only repaying $40 and I keep the clock.....not that it is worth keeping as the glass is shattered, but I'm trying to be fair.

Re: Damaged item.

trusteduserid — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 07:25:17 GMT

The seller may be able to get a refund ,depending on how the seller sent it and who with.

Aust post refunds $50.00 for damaged items sent using unregistered and $100.00 using registered post.

I would be telling the seller to look into it (assuming that it got broken in the mail).

Re: Damaged item.

donnao6703 — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 07:33:39 GMT

The item was sent by Australia Post- standard delivery.
Thank you for letting me know.

Re: Damaged item.

digital*ghost — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 07:35:57 GMT

@donnao6703 wrote:

My inital message to her was to let her know about the damage and provide photo's. I said that either I could send the item back for a full refund or she could refund me $40 and keep the other $20 so she doesn't completely lose out. I thought that was fair, she doesn't.

The seller will be forced to refund the full amount of the original payment if you win a dispute (and you're more than likely to, despite what you might have read to the contrary), so technically the seller would actually be financially better off to at least provide a partial refund than allow it to get to the dispute stage, presuming they don't have specific reasons for preferring alternatives (many sellers will not provide a refund unless the item is returned first, which is their perogative and as GC says, most good sellers will reimburse all costs to the buyer, but there is nothing to oblige them to refund return P&H costs).

If the seller provides a full refund, then the postage becomes their out of pocket expense because you haven't paid for it anymore, so I think that's what the seller meant by her being out postage costs if she refunds (not that that makes it all ok, just attempting to clarify where she might be coming from).

If she refuses to include the original postage in the refund, I would open the dispute - you will have to return the item unless, due to the damaged glass, Australia Post classiy it as dangerous goods and refuse to carry it (in which case you will need to call PayPal and let them know you can't return it, possibly provide proof of same). But the way I figure it - accept $30 and be out $20, or pay (hopefully less than $20) the return postage and be out the cost of that. (In other words, it's likely returning will minimise your loss if it's less than $20, and maybe having to refund you in full will help the seller realise she had an opportunity for a better, relatively mutually beneficial resolution - and definitely a faster one that is unlikely to result in a defect recorded on her account. >_> )

Re: Damaged item.

trusteduserid — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 07:46:44 GMT

No problems, all the info needed is here- http://auspost.com.au/media/documents/registered-post-lodgement-receipt.pdf

Copy and paste the link into your browser or click HERE

IMO- It would be best if Australia Post did the refunding to the seller and then the seller can refund you. After all it is Australia Post's stuff up so they should be paying, not the seller or you!

Re: Damaged item.

trusteduserid — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 07:52:14 GMT

No problems, all the info that is needed is here- http://auspost.com.au/media/documents/registered-post-lodgement-receipt.pdf

IMO- It is Australia Post's fault so they should be paying, not the seller or you.

Re: Damaged item.

donnao6703 — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 08:02:08 GMT

Thank you for clarifying the postage cost issue digital*ghost, I was trying to wrap my head around the logistics of it and couldn't see why she was claiming she was going to be out of pocket for it. ( I must be getting old haha). Anyway, I would much prefer to settle outside of a dispute lodgement, but I don't think the seller is feeling the same way. Not to worry, as you said, it may result in a lesson the seller needs to learn. If it falls my way that is 😕

Re: Damaged item.

bsal6160 — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 09:15:32 GMT

This is not an Aust Post problem. The seller FAILED to package the clock properly.

Re: Damaged item.

davewil1964 — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 13:11:40 GMT

You got that right.

I don't understand why people want to blame AP for sending stuff that can't comply with AP's criteria. They clearly state that everything must be packaged to withstand 22kg dropped from waist height (in reality chucked from 5 metres), and people still think a bit of bubblewrap will give them protection.It will, but not from AP.

Re: Damaged item.

trusteduserid — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 21:27:56 GMT

Just wondering how you know that?I cannot see where it says that it was not packaged properly. Am I missing something?

Re: Damaged item.

trusteduserid — Sun, 01 Jun 2014 21:35:45 GMT

I cannot understand why people want to blame the seller always. It may well be the sellers fault, but so far there is no evidence to suggest this.

IMO- If Australia Post broke it, they should pay!

Re: Damaged item.

donnao6703 — Mon, 02 Jun 2014 03:00:24 GMT

So many different opinons makes it very confusing and hard to judge what the best thing to do is but as of today the seller wants me to open a PayPal claim as she is very sure it will work in her favour. I myself can't decide who is in the wrong for the item being broken- her or AP, although I will say that if it was me who was sending the item I would have packed it alot better than she did, which was a single layer of bubble wrap over the glass front and outer frame of the clock and cardboard cut and taped to fit over the front and back ( so wrapped to the shape of the clock)
The glass is quite thin, so that to me was asking for trouble.

Anyway, since I now have to go the route of making a claim, could anyone advise as to what condition I make the claim under?
I see there is a provision for ''Item not as described'' but nothing about damage....

Thanks again.

Re: Damaged item.

donnao6703 — Mon, 02 Jun 2014 03:43:54 GMT

Never mind. PayPal dispute in progress.

Re: Damaged item.

rjm6572 — Mon, 02 Jun 2014 04:52:52 GMT

the seller is totally at fault for not packing properly

Re: Damaged item.

davewil1964 — Mon, 02 Jun 2014 08:02:01 GMT

@trusteduserid wrote:
Just wondering how you know that?I cannot see where it says that it was not packaged properly. Am I missing something?

It's a fair bet. One now borne out by the buyer.

AP do not offer a 'fragile' service, so everything has to be packed to withstand robust treatment. A bit of bubblewrap and thin cardboard with not even an air gap does not provide that.

At the least it should have been double boxed. Anything with glass in it should be double boxed.

Re: Damaged item.

trusteduserid — Tue, 03 Jun 2014 01:39:15 GMT

Fair enough. I believe in asking questions before shooting, unlike in America 🙂

Re: Damaged item.

donnao6703 — Tue, 03 Jun 2014 06:26:53 GMT

Has anyone had any dealings with PayPal? The seller wanted the dispute escalted to a claim but is now fibbing out the packaging. She is claiming she doubled boxed it, which is completely untrue. I wanted to repond with photo's of the packing but there is no provision for me to respond at all. I called them and was told that if they needed anything like that they will contact me for it. Hopefully they do as I can't see how just taking her word for it would be fair.

Re: Damaged item.

phorum_junkie* — Tue, 03 Jun 2014 06:53:10 GMT

What you should probably done is taken the clock to the PO with all the packaging and ask if they would accept responsibility, chances are they will say that the parcel was not packed securely enough to resist damage if a 20kg parcel is dropped on it from shoulder height, once you had that notification it would have stymied any claim from the seller that it was correctly packaged.

There is no significance in the seller having escalated it to a claim, a dispute is just a chance for the two parties to communicate through Paypal, once it is escalated then you communicate with Paypal and they will adjudicate based on the prior communication.

You have stated your case and the most likely scenario is that they will find in your favour and you will receive a refund as soon as the parcel is returned. I would asvise you to send it with signature required.

If Paypal find in the seller's favour then come back here and we can tell you how to proceed, I have only had Paypal find in the other parties favour a couple of times and a phonecall has sorted it out in my favour everytime.