topic Re: Advice needed re probable fraud in Buying

Advice needed re probable fraud

iainlouden — Tue, 17 Jul 2012 06:31:50 GMT

I paid for an item on 10th July via paypal and had no communication from the seller until I requested seller details from Ebay on 11th July.

The item was listed as being in Port Germein SA as was the seller.

I was told the item would be posted the next day ( 12th July ) by registered post and I requested the tracking number.

Today ( 17th July ) I received an Auspost express post platinum envelope with no return address.

I was suspicious of the parcel as it was very light and felt like there was just a piece of paper in it rather than a 10 gram item.

I videoed myself opening it and all it contained was an advertisment for holidays in Darwin.

The fact that some unknown person paid $13.50 for the prepaid envelope to send me an unsolicited sheet of A4 paper rang alarm bells so I tried tracking it via Auspost but it didn't show the originating location...only the closest main post office to me and then my local post office.

I tried the main Post office near me and they couldn't do any better apart from telling me it was not purchased. or lodged there.

Phoned Auspost and they could not track it to its origin either.

I have sent another message via ebay to the seller requesting the tracking number but really I'm pretty sure I have been the victim of internet fraud.

I tried the phone number Ebay gave me for this seller but it is a fake...Telstra have confirmed it does not exist.

The seller has just updated the details, after I requested the tracking number earlier today, to say that the item was posted today (17th July) but has not given me a tracking number as I have requested on 2 occasions.

I have just requested the tracking number again.

Any advice on what I should do now?

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

a_beautiful_room — Tue, 17 Jul 2012 06:49:42 GMT

Open an item not as significantly described dispute (in the "resolve a problem" drop down box, next to the item in "my ebay").

Stop wasting your time trying to confirm the origin of the envelope - who cares?

Clearly and concisely explain the problem in the dispute.

Ask for a full refund.

If you don't get a reply or refund from the seller within 2 days escalate to a claim.

Paypal will then decide the outcome.

If you can upload a pic of the empty envelope so much the better.

Keep the envelope and piece of paper as you will probably have to return it by registered post to the address that paypal gives you. Yes, nonsensical I know, but it is easier to play this by paypal's rules than try and get an exception which will cost you many frustrating hours on the telephone and probably jeopardise your case by trying to be "correct" even if in the end that doesn't matter.

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

a_beautiful_room — Tue, 17 Jul 2012 06:51:01 GMT

Also make sure that you in your dispute explain that the sellers phone number doesn't exist as incorrect details of address and phone number etc. will go srtongly in your favor - this is not allowed on ebay.

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

mini*lindy — Tue, 17 Jul 2012 06:56:23 GMT

and please, when paypal tell you to 'return the not as described item' you do so by registered post to the address paypal give you... and keep your receipt, handstamped and dated by the post office, it is your guarantee of your refund!

goodluck

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

2106greencat — Tue, 17 Jul 2012 07:40:23 GMT

Please tell me this was not the silver bullion. If it was, open INAD dispute, (although the trick to the plan may be that you have indeed recieved and signed for an item the seller has infact sent and can prove posting,) but clever you, videoing opening it was a good idea. I think the scam may work thus: you sign for a parcel, they have proof of posting said parcel, seller wins dispute unless you can prove INAD - and that would be hard to prove had you not done what you did. You have hopefully covered yourself well enough, someone else here will have better advice soon I am sure

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

Anonymous — Tue, 17 Jul 2012 07:49:42 GMT

On the surface it appears that this rogue has simply tossed the Platinum satchel into a post box in which case he/she has no proof of sending.

Poetic justice if you could go for 'item not received'.

Unfortunately you can only open one dispute.

What was the item listing number ( or first 20 characters of the title ) ?

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

Anonymous — Tue, 17 Jul 2012 07:53:30 GMT

Platinum envelope. Sorry, not sure if you can just toss these into a posting bin.

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

***super_nova*** — Tue, 17 Jul 2012 07:54:51 GMT

Report the incident through this site:

http://www.police.qld.gov.au/programs/cscp/eCrime/internet/report/

that is Queensland police, but there are links to report on line fraud everywhere in Australia.

Open PP case and then call PP and explain what happened, and that you are reporting it to police. There is no way you should be required to post the empty envelope back. It is not item not as described this is fraud.

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

iainlouden — Tue, 17 Jul 2012 07:59:39 GMT

No it was not the silver bullion...it is worse than that !...$500 worth of worse.

I'm glad I listened to my internal warning bells about the parcel and videod myself opening it...might be a lesson for us all there.

I have now eliminated the only other item I'm waiting on by getting the tracking number for it and confirming it has been sent,

That only leaves 1 item not received ( unless you call a A4 advertisment "item received" ) and the seller will not respond to me in any way or provide a tracking number so I have opened a dispute as advised...thanks everyone for the advice.

This is my first bad experience on Ebay since I joined and it's enough to put me off for good.

Regardless of the outcome I will be making a fraud report to the Police and it should be easy for them to track him from the bank account linked to his Paypal account... will they bother though !

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

koalablue12 — Tue, 17 Jul 2012 08:05:27 GMT

Good for you, I am so amazed that you thought to record what you did, fantastic, and good luck;-)

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

Anonymous — Tue, 17 Jul 2012 08:15:34 GMT

$500.00

Sounds like the 10 gram gold bullion bar from a zero feedbacker posting from an iphone.

If PayPal are on their toes then the payment should be on hold anyway.

Good luck with it all.

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

iainlouden — Tue, 17 Jul 2012 08:58:56 GMT

Phew..paypal have the $ on hold and have escalated the dispute and told me that I'll be almost certainly getting the money backand that they don't want the envelope...but I'm keeping it in a safe place anyway till all is sorted..then the Police will be given it.

Thanks for all the advice and comments.

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

zigzagdot — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 04:24:27 GMT

Paypal escalation / investigation is very good and thorough, they have saved my dumb purchase butt on more than one occassion. If they told you you stand a good chance of getting your money back it's almost certain you will. It might take time but you will. Most of my Paypal purchases are funded via debit card, I thought reversing charges via debit card was an option but it's not always the case, thank God for Paypal!

I used to complain about their fees and the power they have operating on your bank account but when the shoe is on the other foot you thank your lucky stars for Paypal! They make online buying a lot safer, they are the reason I still buy online.

Is it possible to give a hint of who the Seller is or what you bought, I looked at your feedback profile but found nothing for that period?

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

janeababe — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 06:07:22 GMT

Is it possible to give a hint of who the Seller is or what you bought, I looked at your feedback profile but found nothing for that period?

**********************************

1 x 10 gram Perth Mint gold bar 999.9 - investment gold

13bids, sold for $485 + $6postage.

0 feedback, newly opened account holder.

**********************************

Op... this alone would have had the alarm bells ringing, and i would have been hitting the back button, not the bid button.

good luck with your paypal case.

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

colkym — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 06:09:45 GMT

No zigzagdot, naming and shaming can get you into trouble around here.

You can find it in the OP's purcase history though 😉

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

phorum_junkie* — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 09:59:25 GMT

I would have opened an item not received dispute, until the seller entered the tracking number in to the Paypal dispute you have no proof that they have tried to defraud you, if they did enter the tracking number you could then have changed the reason for the dispute to a not as described.

You may need to report it to the police in order for Paypal to refund you if the seller denies that they sent you a piece of paper, a film of you opening the parcel may provide corroboration but as it could be edited it would not be counted as proof positive.

When you get your refund you should still report the seller to the on line auction fraud report site, they may be dumb enough to try it again!

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

Anonymous — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 10:19:39 GMT

Well I just learned something new PJ. I have always thought

you could only open one dispute a particular reason then that was it.

Didn't know you could actually change the reason for the dispute while it was still open.

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

Anonymous — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 10:30:23 GMT

If the seller sent a $500.00 gold ingot in a platinum express envelope

( not an insurable satchel ) and is no record of lodgement then you can be almost certain he/she can't prove posting.

Go with PJ's advice ( if correct ).

Lodge an INR dispute first. It would be an honest claim because you must definitely have not received the item you paid for ( which coincidentally is also SNAD ).

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

Anonymous — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 10:53:46 GMT

I will have another go at English ( not the English PJ ).

If the seller sent a $500.00 gold ingot in a platinum express envelope ( not an insurable satchel ) and there is no record of lodgement ( that you were able to find ) then you can be almost certain he/she can't prove posting because the envelope was just thrown into a post box.

Re: Advice needed re probable fraud

phorum_junkie* — Wed, 18 Jul 2012 11:35:03 GMT

Lol termalert you got there in the end but OP has already opened the not as described dispute. When you open an item not received dispute there is an option to change it to not as described.

That option has only been available for a couple of years or so, you used to have to call Paypal and beg them to change the reason for the dispute.