topic Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post in Selling

Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

dave4110 — Fri, 11 Sep 2015 11:19:04 GMT

Hi everyone, I recently experienced a situation where the buyer bought an item and paid for Express Post. I sent out the item with Express Post the next day, but the item took about six business days to reach him, because his postcode was outside of the Aus Post Express network According to Aus Post, so it became a regular Parcel Post delivery.

Prior to the receipt of the item, the buyer opened a INR case. While the case was open, I noticed that I couldn't do a partial refund in eBay for the Express Post cost, eBay only allowed full refund for INR cases. I went to PayPal and saw that PayPal has held that transaction, so I wasn't able to do any refund through PayPal either.

I called eBay and PayPal, and was basically bounced between these two companies, Paypal saying the case was opened outside of PayPal so they can't do anything (even though they put a hold on that transaction), and eBay saying for INR they can only do full refund, so partial refund needs to be done in PayPal.

In the end the item was received by the buyer, and the case was resolved. But has anyone else experienced something similar?

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

clarry100 — Fri, 11 Sep 2015 11:34:39 GMT

We had a similar experience about 6 months ago. But in our case it was only one day late. Luckily the buyer was not so displeased and did not open a case against us
I asked my local PO why it should be a day late and they could not explain the delay so they handed over a free satchel.
So we refunded our buyer their express fee and they were happy about that
So a good outcome for us.
So you might want to take up the issue with your local PO and ask about a free satchel. They should do it because you have paid for express but only received standard mail service.
When we get express mail orders now we check if the postcode is outside the network and advise the buyer that it may not be next business day due to this reason. But they are normally not more than one extra day and often still next business day anyway.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

lane-ends — Fri, 11 Sep 2015 12:00:18 GMT

Typically if they are outside express zone, it goes express as far as nearest center, then standard the remainder. So normally it is still likely to be quicker than regular. Aps guarantee is simply a replacement satchel.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

lyndal1838 — Fri, 11 Sep 2015 12:11:53 GMT

Unless both sender and receiver are in the Express Zone there is no guarantee that the parcel will be delivered overnight and no compensation available.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

dave4110 — Fri, 11 Sep 2015 12:28:20 GMT

Any difference in buying the Aus Post Express satchel VS paying for Express Post when creating the postage label in eBay?

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

collect247 — Fri, 11 Sep 2015 12:37:46 GMT

Cost$$

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

justajunk — Fri, 11 Sep 2015 14:11:54 GMT

I had an item sent by Express take two weeks to get to the other side of the country since it was sent over a long weekend period. Buyer didn't complain or open a case fortunately, but he did leave one star for Postage Time, which eBay removed since I had uploaded valid tracking with 24 hours of posting the parcel.

I still take that though as a lesson learnt the hard way. I likewise rang up Australia Post and the lady I spoke to admitted that I wasted my money with the additional express postage charge since a parcel between our postcodes would always only be sent as a regular parcel. Lots of stress and the end result? I now never use express AND I write in my listings that Express post is not available. The things I send can be sent as letters, so (under the current system) they usually only take a few days to get to the other side of the country. I've even sent one customer five large letters once to avoid having to deal with the stuff-arounds of fitting all the items into a super-slow parcel.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

dave4110 — Fri, 11 Sep 2015 22:32:18 GMT

After this experience, for the next buyer that purhased and chose Express Post, when creating the postage label in eBay, I saw it has a note in there to say the destination postcode is not in the Express Post network. I didn't notice that before, not sure if buyers see that when they choose Express Post??

Anyway this time I sent a message to the buyer about it first, and he replied was fine with Express Post even it may end up with Parcel Post delivery speed. Seems like sellers need to check first to cover our butts in case these types of disputes happen. Sellers seem to cop it from buyers even though it's obvious it's outside of seller's control or responsiblity.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

dave4110 — Fri, 11 Sep 2015 22:38:44 GMT

The other issue is that there seems to be a catch-22 when trying to give partial refunds to the buyer. This is the first case I've dealt with as a seller, so this INR case means eBay allows only all-or-nothing refunds, and PayPal freezing the transaction so partial refunds can't be done in PayPal.

I was basically told by eBay to use PayPal to manually transfer money to the buyer to do the partial refund (which means I need to cover the PayPal fees or otherwise the buyer will surely complain that the refund is less than what he paid me). It also means I paid PayPal fees twice, once for the transaction, and another for the manual transfer to refund the postage cost.

eBay said because PayPal is a separate company now, so that how it will work from now on.

Anyone else had issues doing partial refunds after the eBay/PayPal split?

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

black*poppy — Fri, 11 Sep 2015 22:46:24 GMT

When you refund the buyer, you won't pay any extra paypal fees. Paypal actually refund that part of fees you gave already paid (2.4 % or whatever it is of the amount you are refunding)

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

dave4110 — Fri, 11 Sep 2015 23:27:28 GMT

Correct, however in this INR case, PayPal froze the transaction so you couldn't do any type of refund in PayPal, partial or otherwise. And in eBay you could only do full refund, not partial. Hence the issue.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

phorum_junkie* — Sat, 12 Sep 2015 07:35:04 GMT

I have noot had it happen but for a long time now I have not offered Express Post, if a buyer emails and requests it I check that they are in the next day delivery zone and if they are not then I just say sorry, not possible.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

joethenuts — Sun, 13 Sep 2015 00:01:49 GMT

dave your listing said regular for $$$$ or express for $$$ i asume , most buyers and me or even you would not know if there in the zone ,

unless the buyers tried to use express before, maybe it would be an idea if you can say in your descriptions on postage for express you must be the zone check with aus post or something, about the refund from express to regular what are we talking about $5 or $10 , on paypal you can send money to anybody you like with a space for a note saying bla bla refund for free .at worst the extra fee you paid were a few cents from regular to express whats 2.4 % of $5 or $10

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

jensmanchester-australia — Sun, 13 Sep 2015 00:20:48 GMT

ExpressPost has never been a guaranteed overnight service Australia Wide.

Express post is a service which offer the fastest possible delivery time between two locations. 99% of the time it is much quicker than regular post particularly when going between states and even more so when travelling between the east and west coast.

I have always offered express post as an option and as I am based in WA 99% of the time it is a 2 - 3 day service. Buyers frequently choose the express post option and are more than happy to receive their parcel in 2 - 3 days instead of the 7 - 10 days it can take with regular post.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

joethenuts — Sun, 13 Sep 2015 00:40:39 GMT

the buyer was not in the express zone, the seller was happy to refund the diference , but was not sure how to.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

dazzledayz — Mon, 14 Sep 2015 10:31:15 GMT

@dave4110 wrote:
Hi everyone, I recently experienced a situation where the buyer bought an item and paid for Express Post. I sent out the item with Express Post the next day, but the item took about six business days to reach him, because his postcode was outside of the Aus Post Express network According to Aus Post, so it became a regular Parcel Post delivery.

Prior to the receipt of the item, the buyer opened a INR case. While the case was open, I noticed that I couldn't do a partial refund in eBay for the Express Post cost, eBay only allowed full refund for INR cases. I went to PayPal and saw that PayPal has held that transaction, so I wasn't able to do any refund through PayPal either.

I called eBay and PayPal, and was basically bounced between these two companies, Paypal saying the case was opened outside of PayPal so they can't do anything (even though they put a hold on that transaction), and eBay saying for INR they can only do full refund, so partial refund needs to be done in PayPal.

In the end the item was received by the buyer, and the case was resolved. But has anyone else experienced something similar?

You probably need to make a change to your listings pointing out that Express Post in Australia can be very location dependent.

Perhaps something along the lines of "available on request".

I find that express works well(ish) where long distances are concerned.

Your express parcel will at least travel by air to the interstate portal (capital city of state).

Regular parcels will travel by road.

Deliveries from east coast to WA or SA will be significantly quicker though most likely not next day.

If the recipient is within the metro area delivery should be the day after arrival in the destination state portal (that bit is overnight).

If your customer is in any other city or town then there won't be a great deal of difference in delivery time (perhaps a day or two).

Typical of eBay to want us to offer this service but have no idea of how it actually works in Aus.

I refuse pont blank to offer it but will use it on customer request after letting them know about the above.

An example of the above:

Customer in a Perth suburb.

Overnight to CBD

She got it in 2 days.

The sorting centre is at Perth airport and she is halfway between there and the CBD ... go figure lol.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

mel1bah — Wed, 19 Oct 2016 05:09:43 GMT

Bit of a necro but stumbled onto this thread as I'm going through a similar situation. I have another account I use for business and I offer express post on most of my items, so I'm aware of the next day delivery guarantee. I bought an item on this account Tuesday evening, I paid an extra $18.60 to have it express posted (the listing contained free regular post), so I paid well above the cost of postage, as he would have deducted postage out of the standard purchase price.

By Thursday night the tracking hadn't updated and I'd not received the item. I contacted seller, no reponse, come Friday afternoon after 4pm still no reply, no tracking update and no item. I looked at his feedback and noticed postage time was his worst metric and he had previous history of charging people express delivery and the item mysteriously being delayed by Aus Post. Maybe I assume wrong, but this seemed a standard case of purchasing the eBay postage label on Wednesday but not delivering the product to Australia Post.

I lodged an item not received case and requested a refund. I needed the item for the weekend and now had to source it elsewhere at a large premium. Surprise, surprise, seller responds practically instantly, he was rude straight of the bat and of course blaming Australia Post. He also refused to provide any refund, even though I explained we were both within the next day delivery guarantee network and therefore he was entitled to a full refund of postage.

So now eBay has ruled in his favour, because as per usual they don't scratch the surface of a complaint. As far as they're concerned I lodged a missing item and the item was delivered... I've appealed the decision and have requested yet again a refund of my extra postage costs.

It's not the first time I've had to deal with sellers that really should not be in retail. I have not asked anything that is not reasonable yet have been greeted with brickwalls.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

*tippy*toes* — Wed, 19 Oct 2016 05:22:51 GMT

What exactly did the tracking say? There is a difference between creating a label (infomation received by AP) and lodging it over the counter. Maybe he dropped it in the yellow box and didn't get a lodgement scan? Plenty of sellers do that who use online postage, even though these days it's silly with the defective postage defect system.

I posted an express satchel last week that took 4 days to arrive. I posted within an hour of the buyer paying. Neither of us are in the network, but both in large regional towns. Normally when neither are in the network, it's always taken me 2 days to have one arrive, rather than over night. Sometimes AP just stuff it up and it's no fault of the seller. Thankfully for me, my buyer hadn't paid for express, so wasn't waiting for an overnight or 2 day delivery.

When you sent your seller the message, did you send a calm message, or did you go in guns blazing? Often a calm message gets better results. He has to contact AP to get a postage refund. Maybe he doesn't know that?

Did the item eventually arrive? Did the tracking show delivered? If yes to both, that's why they closed the dispute in the sellers favour. You can't demand a refund for INR if the parcel arrived, regardless of how late it is.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

clarry100 — Wed, 19 Oct 2016 05:38:38 GMT

Its not clear in your post if/not the tracking said delivered. It looks like you never received it at all.

If it did not say delivered then under the ebay MBG they should rule in favour of the buyer because ebay MBG requires proof of delivery which there was not.

However, if the tracking says delivered then they are certainly going to rule in favour of the seller as Tippy has explained. ie you have received your item just not as quickly as you paid for. In this case any refund will come from Aust Post to the seller and it would be up to the good nature of the seller to refund you the express post fee.

Good luck with it all.

Re: Buyer demanding refund for slow Express Post

curraone — Wed, 19 Oct 2016 05:43:09 GMT

As far as they're concerned I lodged a missing item and the item was delivered...