topic Dispute in Selling

Dispute

janlinac_41 — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 10:07:18 GMT

Evening,

Hoping for some help.

I have had a buyer open a dispute in Paypal , not EBay. The claim is that I sent the wrong size item. I had the buyer send me a photo with the item next to a ruler and it is clearly the correct size.

Question is whether PayPal can see the conversation that was already had on EBay where I tried to offer solutions ?

Any other advice would be most appreciated as well.

Re: Dispute

digital*ghost — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 10:28:19 GMT

PayPal rarely consider private messages when deciding a dispute, but you can include screenshots of them for good measure and they will likely be taken into account, but unlikely to be enough on their own to win the case.

Does the item match the full listing description? This will help you more than anything else.

Re: Dispute

janlinac_41 — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 10:57:22 GMT

Yes, the item is identical to description and photos on the listing.

Item comes in 4 sizes, and buyer is claiming wrong size was sent.

I got the buyer to send a photo of item next to a tape measure and it is exactly the size ordered.

Re: Dispute

digital*ghost — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 11:06:41 GMT

Ok - PayPal covers the buyer for items significantly not as described, and the word "significant" is actually, well, significant - slight variations to measurements should not count as significant in this case, if there are any variations between what is showing in your buyer's pic, and how the item was described.

If the buyer's own photo (hopefully already uploaded to the dispute) shows that the item they received matches with the description for the size they purchased, this is what I would be pointing out via the dispute console, with a typed message update plus screenshot of the relevant description info. I wouldn't include screenshots of messages unless the buyer indicated or admitted in their messages they bought the wrong size (meaning they are now just absuing the dispute option).

Re: Dispute

janlinac_41 — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 11:12:33 GMT

Thank you for the advice..

At this stage, the PayPal open case is still in the messaging phase between the Buyer and Myself, they are yet to esclate..

Just keep messaging saying give me a refund..

Would it be advisable for me to esclate ?

Re: Dispute

kopenhagen5 — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 11:23:34 GMT

Advisable to call PayPal.

They are very good over the phone and I am confident it will help your case.

Re: Dispute

digital*ghost — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 12:07:12 GMT

I'd be communicating mostly for / to PayPal at this stage, while keeping to the dispute messaging system. Keep it short, bullet point style of communication by pointing out exactly what you want the PayPal reps (who may have to decide on the outcome) to know.

Stuff like, for example, "I have carefully examined the photo provided by [buyer], and would like to note that it confirms the size of the item received matches the size of the item purchased, due to the following reasons...", and then I would cross reference what is shown in the photo, to the relevant part of the description, and so on.

Unfortunately PayPal are currently only offering an automated messaging system in place of their call centre at the moment, so it's unlikely you'd be able to talk to or with a CS rep directly to get their advice or guidance - I'm pretty sure it just scans your enquiry and spits back copy / pastes of whatever it thinks is the right policy or help page.

(PS, this is all assuming you are not on board with having the item returned for a refund - you will most likely have an option to accept a return of the item to refund the buyer, but it would be 100% of their original payment, including postage, and you won't be refunded any of the fees paid to PayPal. If you would rather not agree to that, personally I would not escalate unless I thought it necessary and / or I was confident I had laid out my statements and evidence well, and that it would be almost guaranteed to be decided in my favour, which is quite difficult to be certain of. There may be a reason the buyer has not escalated (not confident of success), or they may not know they need to, but escalation is more for the buyer than it is for the seller without knowing how it will go (that is, for a buyer dealing with a seller who won't help, they get PayPal to decide one way or another, it's the only way they'll have a chance of getting what they're asking for. On the other hand, for a seller, nothing will happen, or be forced to happen if the case doesn't escalate, so the only thing escalating will do is have it over and done with one way or another more quickly, since there is a period of 20 days after a case is opened where it can be escalated. After that 20 days, though, it will just time out if not escalated).

Re: Dispute

janlinac_41 — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 12:39:59 GMT

I provided a full explaination that the claim is false along with numerous photos to support my claim.

Within about 20 seconds of submitting my response, the case was closed in favour of the buyer...

How could anyone have reviewed in that time ?

Re: Dispute

digital*ghost — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 13:20:07 GMT

It doesn't sound like anyone did 😞 Do you have an option to appeal?

Re: Dispute

11dustyattic — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 14:15:06 GMT

@janlinac_41 wrote:

I provided a full explaination that the claim is false along with numerous photos to support my claim.

Within about 20 seconds of submitting my response, the case was closed in favour of the buyer...

How could anyone have reviewed in that time ?

That shouldn't have happened. I'm not surprised it ended that way, paypal are useless atm without phone contact available, but the speed they did that has to be a mistake. Try messaging them. My experience with that wasn't great, they just didn't reply, but worth a try

Re: Dispute

11dustyattic — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 22:15:09 GMT

I'll just add, unless their phone line is open again

Re: Dispute

padi*0409 — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 23:00:53 GMT

@11dustyattic wrote:

I'll just add, unless their phone line is open again

Looking at the "help" link it doesn't appear to be functioning yet.

Re: Dispute

11dustyattic — Thu, 20 Aug 2020 23:05:32 GMT

@padi*0409 wrote:
@11dustyattic wrote:

I'll just add, unless their phone line is open again

Looking at the "help" link it doesn't appear to be functioning yet.

Thanks. It's a shame because I always found paypal to be very fair, being able to speak to them made a big difference

Re: Dispute

janlinac_41 — Fri, 21 Aug 2020 09:06:35 GMT

I received a reply from PayPal they just closed the case without regard for the evidence provided.

The interesting part is they refund the buyer , but do not deduct it from me under their Seller Protection Plan. PayPal wears the cost..

I think because the value is low (Under $10) , it is cheaper just to cover the refund.

Re: Dispute

11dustyattic — Fri, 21 Aug 2020 10:12:40 GMT

@janlinac_41 wrote:

I received a reply from PayPal they just closed the case without regard for the evidence provided.

The interesting part is they refund the buyer , but do not deduct it from me under their Seller Protection Plan. PayPal wears the cost..

I think because the value is low (Under $10) , it is cheaper just to cover the refund.

Okay. That's a good result for you 👍

Re: Dispute

janlinac_41 — Fri, 21 Aug 2020 11:15:58 GMT

Except for the negative feedback that the buyer has now left, and even though I have photographic evidence from the buyer that the correct item was sent and exactly as described, that doesn't breach the Feedback Policy, so it can't be removed.

Found that very disappointing...

Re: Dispute

davewil1964 — Fri, 21 Aug 2020 11:44:09 GMT

I suppose it depends on whether you prefer to keep the money or wear a red dot. Which will be progressively less relevant if you continue to sell. Or after 12 months.

Re: Dispute

digital*ghost — Fri, 21 Aug 2020 11:50:24 GMT

@janlinac_41 wrote:

Except for the negative feedback that the buyer has now left, and even though I have photographic evidence from the buyer that the correct item was sent and exactly as described, that doesn't breach the Feedback Policy, so it can't be removed.

Found that very disappointing...

Did she ask for or demand a replacement without returning the item via any of her eBay messages (assuming there was communication before the dispute)?

If so, you could argue the FB is malicious because the buyer wanted something they were not entitled to and didn't get it (refund / replacement without return) - it's a 50/50 shot, so probably one worth taking.

Re: Dispute

tazzieterror — Fri, 21 Aug 2020 12:19:05 GMT

Further to digi's comments above, was the feedback left after the dispute was resolved in her favour, or while it was still active?

If during, you can also try arguing that she was using the neg into pressuring you do make a refund.

Re: Dispute

janlinac_41 — Fri, 21 Aug 2020 12:22:50 GMT

Negative Feedback was left the following day after her refund was approved by PayPal.