topic Re: Member behaviour standards dropping? in Selling

Member behaviour standards dropping?

dodge_ute — Thu, 25 Mar 2021 21:52:17 GMT

A few months ago I decided to have a clutter clearout at home, an annual thing for me so decided to list about a dozen items for sale on Ebay.

My items are always listed at prices well below what other sellers ask for the same items.

This tactic used to guarantee a quick sale and lots of interest from buyers.

Despite this only half my items have sold and with one exception sold for absurdly low prices, practically free.

Worse still I have received lots of bogus "offers" from members who wanted the more valuable items for maybe 10% of their real value.

And lastly I have experienced a dramatic increase in non paying bidders for the items that did get a bid.

I'd summarise the situation such that the buyers/bidders that are cruising Ebay currently are there to steal and if they can't steal they sabotage auctions with bids they have no intention of honouring

This apalling behaviour on the part of so called buyers goes unchecked by Ebay who at worst issue a slap on the wrist to such deadbeats.

I no longer view Ebay as a useful way to sell anything 😞

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

digital*ghost — Thu, 25 Mar 2021 22:31:30 GMT

@dodge_ute wrote:

My items are always listed at prices well below what other sellers ask for the same items.
This tactic used to guarantee a quick sale and lots of interest from buyers.

If you try again, I would suggest a different tactic, these days low prices will bring out the tyre kickers, flippers and other bargain hunters who have no genuine interest in the item but rather in getting something for cheap, plus often gives people the impression there's probably something wrong with the item.

eBay has shifted away from a place of quick bargains to much more of a retail site, and I think you will find that genuine buyers are more attracted to listings where the seller has valued the item at a price that's good, but not at a point where people start to wonder why it was priced so low.

Auctions also tend to attract people with eyes bigger than their wallets (i.e. it ends in a week, I can pay for it then, then a week later something's come up, etc), so I would consider buy it now listings, with perhaps make an offer enabled if you have room to negotiate.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

dodge_ute — Thu, 25 Mar 2021 23:09:37 GMT

", I would suggest a different tactic,"

My selling tactic was not developed yesterday but as a result of trying all methods including your suggestions over the years.

Nothing I ever sold was sold with a buy it now button.

Items listed at true market value similar to other members prices were usually ignored by buyers.

Then I tried the low starting price tactic (years ago).

Buyers flocked to the item. True the cheapskates were hoping it would sell for the starting price but it rarely did.

And I do know Covid has cut buyer numbers and prices too but I allowed for that with my opening prices.

Nobody could imagine my items were cheap because they were rubbish.

Its simple. I'm not a greedy bugger. I aim for win/win.

My descriptions and pics are as explicit and accurate as you would find on any listing on Ebay.

No the problem is not with my seller tactics.

I stand by my conclusion regards member quality or rather lack of it.

Ebay is largely to blame. They let anybody join without checks or balances these days and once the bad guys are in they are free to loot and pillage.

Ebay sees to it that the crimes of the bad guys are kept secret.

Its outrageous that sellers can't leave anything but positive feedback.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

digital*ghost — Thu, 25 Mar 2021 23:19:09 GMT

My post was not a criticism of you or what you've been doing.

It was to point out that trends shift. Buyer needs, preferences and behaviours shift. If you don't want to entertain the possibility that shifting with them might work better for you, that's up to you, but a "no, I have decided everyone else is wrong" position is clearly not working for you. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

jellybirddesigns — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 00:34:35 GMT

In the early days of Ebay I did really well from auctioning. Whilst it still has its place on Ebay, I've changed direction and found it far better to just have my items with a BIN price and Immediate Payment activated. Haven't worried about a non-payer for 6 years and I get the price I want.

As an Aussie maker and seller of soft furnishings, my prices are well above the offerings of other similar sellers and my shop has grown each year since 2015. My time and effort is valuable and that reflects in the price of my items. I have had over 5000 transactions and produced approximately 10,000 handmade items - there is no way I would ever auction my items for minimum price.

If you put up something for a dollar and you only get one bid, you can hardly blame the buyer! It's just a plain waste of time and effort. Might as well just chuck it in the bin or donate it.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

imastawka — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 00:44:37 GMT

As an aside - you have 3 chairs relisted.

The pic shows only one angle of one chair and it's not even one of the chairs that is actually for sale.

This is against ebay policy.

If it's a 2nd hand item, You must have a pic of the actual item, so buyers can see what they're actually bidding on. And more than one would be ideal for furniture.

Picture policy | eBay

If your camera is not working - borrow one. Buyers don't always read your blurb

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

dodge_ute — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 01:10:11 GMT

Firstly I accept that the advice I received was well intended.

I'm not trying to sell new merchandise at full retail prices, buy it now.

I have been trying to sell used items so its apples and oranges.

I'd agree Ebay is rapidly changing from an auction site to a retail online store where you go to buy new items at retail prices.

To summarise the advice I received all I have to do to sell my stuff is advertise my items at drastically higher prices with a buy it now button.

So when my auction listings end in a few days I will do that but firstly I must wait for the two current non paying bidder cases to expire/finalise.

Will the items sell at four times the current price and to a buyer who will actually pay???

If anything sells using your method all proceeds from such sales will be donated to the RSPCA.

I'll let you know how much the puppies got.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

countessalmirena — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 01:29:02 GMT

@dodge_ute,

I'm a buyer only. From that perspective, I would encourage you to take note of the suggestions posted in this thread. I agree with imastawka's comments about your listing for 3 chairs.

You need to upload photos of the actual chairs you are selling. That's not negotiable. You should ideally include several photos showing all three, different angles, etc.

Also, the line in your description about ❝Relisted because of delinquent non paying prank bidder❞ is not a good idea. I realise that you are frustrated by non-paying bidders, but that sort of comment (in my opinion, as a buyer) only puts off genuine buyers. Buyers do not care about the personal details of your relisting; it's irrelevant and unprofessional-looking.

Your mentioning that the Pello chairs are currently retailing for $79 each is good. That's a strong selling point.

Mentioning other chairs that look very similar is not a good selling point. In particular, you're almost steering people away from your chairs by mentioning the "more expensive Poang"!

It's irrelevant that the Poang ❝has a more complicated all timber frame and is available in a range of colours❞. You are not selling the Poang. Don't even mention the Poang. Just describe your chairs, fix the photo issue, and you should hopefully get some interested buyers.

Have you set up your Buyer Requirements? This will help to weed out some of the persistent bad buyers.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

dodge_ute — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 01:33:42 GMT

"if your camera is not working - borrow one. Buyers don't always read your blurb"

I have a new camera and will replace the pic in question not that it will make any difference to the outcome.

I'd agree so called "buyers" frequently don't read, remember nor understand the item description and whose fault is that?

I blame the morons that can't/won't read the description.

Don't suppose you noticed that many of the members that list similar used Ikea items for sale have borrowed the pics of new stock from the Ikea website?

I at least borrowed a good pic of an identical used item and told the buyers it was not my item but was identical and in close to new condition.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

imastawka — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 02:06:48 GMT

I'm not here to check all listings of IKEA chairs.

But you're here, so I checked yours.

Just make sure you take close up pics of any stains / tears etc.

I'd take the Countess' advice re mentioning the other brand - they might go looking and forget about yours.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

dodge_ute — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 02:26:40 GMT

Yes you are right about the frustration. I totally lost it after copping my fifth non paying bidder in as many weeks, a dozen insultingly low "offers" and knew that Ebay would do everything it could to protect the reputation of the mongrels concerned.

The pic you mentioned will be replaced.

My half brother (not a very nice person just ask his two ex wives) keeps reminding me I'm too honest for my own good and for the commercial world I probably am but I have a conscience unfortunately so when I list something for sale the policy is full disclosure.

There is a very good reason I explained why Ikea makes two very similar looking chairs and it has entirely to do with honesty.

Before I list anything for sale I research what other members are selling, what they charge and what they say.

In multiple cases I saw members selling the cheaper Pello chairs like mine but either called them Poang chairs or else didn't mention the model name at all in the hope the buyers would not notice they were the cheaper budget model until after they got them home.

You see I deplore dishonest sellers.

What is to most people "creative marketing" is deceitful behaviour to me.

I'd rather not sell something at all than sell it by "creative marketing" as has been done to me countless times.

Unfortunately "setting buyer requirements" is pointless as Ebay does all in its power to sanitise the reputations of the bad guys.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

gutterpunkz05 — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 02:53:26 GMT

Re the chairs, you are not going to like this but, Ditch the first line of your item description from the relist.

That type of comment, only reflects poorly on you as a seller, prospective buyers do not need to know why the item is being relisted and what you think of the non payer, they do not even need to know the item is being relisted.

Non payers and low offers are a part of life for all sellers, but it is not a general reflection on ebay buyers standards. While you may perceive an increase in such buyers, I certainly have not, but then again I no longer list with short term auctions and do not have best offer enabled.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

dodge_ute — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 03:20:05 GMT

"Ditch the first line of your item description from the relist."

OK line deleted.

I removed "make offer" from each auction as it expired as it only attracts the thieves.

Mind you half of the miserable offers I got from the thieves were illegal messages received over the Ebay message system. Thieves are persistent creatures. If they can't get in through the doors they will try the windows..............

Call it a coincidence if you like but I have had more grief from Ebay "buyers" in recent months than in the previous decade.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

gutterpunkz05 — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 04:57:52 GMT

There is nothing illegal or even wrong with sending a message to a seller, whether that is to make an offer, request bulk discount, etc. Not enabling best offer, does not eliminate offers but it definately does not invite offers. Unsolicited offers can be dealt with on there individual merits, accepted, declined, ignored, or if you find it offensive you can simply block the buyer from any possible purchase or additional messages.

Making an offer, ridiculous or not, does not make a prospective buyer a thief, delinquent, mongrel, etc etc

This also applies to non payers, in fact how does a non payer, or a member making an offer relate to a thief in any text.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

dodge_ute — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 05:20:46 GMT

"There is nothing illegal or even wrong with sending a message to a seller, whether that is to make an offer,"

About 12 months ago a "person" sent me an offer using the Ebay message system.

Their offer was rejected by me however Ebay happened to monitor the conversation as they do randomly and read the riot act to both of us.

Ebay told me it was illegal to use their messaging system to negotiate financial deals outside of the normal bidding process and that if I participated in any similar discussions in future I would be suspended.

Exactly what was said to the initiating party is unknown.

If you need to ask why I view an Ebay member who sabotaged my auction, tried to extract an unreasonably low price from me on an item or caused me considerable trouble by ANY means a MONGREL etc etc then you would not understand the answer.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

gutterpunkz05 — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 07:42:39 GMT

You do not seem to be across ebay policies, it is ok to send messages, as long as they do not contain

contact details, or attempt to complete a purchase/sale outside of ebay. making unsolicited offers is perfectly fine as far as ebay is concerned.

I would suggest familiarising yourself with all the ebay policies as they currently stand.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

dodge_ute — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 08:13:16 GMT

Your typical Ebay dodgy offer which as of a year ago was sternly advised to me as illegal was of this kind of format, they don't vary much..........

The offer is always low.

They are hoping you are desperate enough to take anything they throw at you.

"G'day mate, I'll give you $XX cash for your...(insert item name here).........

You don't need Ebay, cancel the auction, you won't pay any fees....

I can pick it up tomorrow afternoon.........."

I did of course ask Ebay why they threatened me with suspension because somebody else suggested a dodgy deal??

"I rejected their offer what was I supposed to say??"

ANSWER.

"You don't reply. You don't engage with them. Better still report the offence to Ebay"

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

gutterpunkz05 — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 08:51:40 GMT

You just do not seem to get it, as above the style of message you advise, explicitly deals with

completing a sale outside of ebay, and as such and as by ebay policies, you should not have replied and ebay were correct to issue a warning. As stated you just do not seem to understand the policies.

Anyone can send you a message and tell you they will offer %10 of your asking price, or for that matter 10 x your asking price. They can not supply contact details or in anyway indicate an intention to complete the sale outside of ebay.

It is really not that hard to understand.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

countessalmirena — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 11:22:03 GMT

I truly believe you've done the best thing for yourself by removing that relist line.

Re: Member behaviour standards dropping?

countessalmirena — Fri, 26 Mar 2021 11:55:53 GMT

@dodge_ute, if you are going to auction the chairs, in my view your starting price should be the chairs at the lowest price that you are truly willing to accept.

(Don't bother with a Buy It Now price if you're going to auction the chairs, because the Buy It Now option will completely disappear once someone's placed a bid. Your starting price is your reserve price, and you should never end up selling at a loss, or at a price that will frustrate and annoy you later because you know it was too low.)

If you're going to list them as Buy Now rather than in auction format, set a price that you'd like to get for the chairs and that is reasonable. You might want to think about what price range you'd be willing to accept, so that if someone does make an offer, you'll know instantly whether it's within your price range and you can accept, reject, or make a counter-offer instantly.

If any offer comes through with even a possibility in the wording that it could be interpreted as suggesting an outside-eBay transaction, instantly report the buyer. Read through this eBay Help page - Report an issue with a buyer.

❝When to report a buyer

You should only report a buyer if you think they're violating our policies. Here are a few examples of when to report a buyer:

The buyer is demanding something that wasn't offered in the original listing
You believe the buyer is making a false claim
You believe the buyer is misusing eBay Money Back Guarantee or the returns system
They've asked you to complete a sale off eBay
They're abusing the bid retraction process, repeatedly bidding and then retracting bids
They're messaging you more than what would be considered normal, with no intention of buying the item

How to report a buyer

If you think a buyer is violating our Abusive buyer policy, you can report them to us by selecting the button below.

❞

There are pitfalls in selling on eBay, I agree - but there have also been some improvements with the ability to report specific bad behaviour on the part of buyers who are blatantly breaching eBay's policies. Mind you, eBay apply their sanctions and warnings very heavy-handedly, with a tendendy to interpret an innocent communication or a straight-by-the-rules reply to a bad offer as a breach. Before the pandemic hit, you'd have been able to phone eBay CS and sort things out on the phone in a polite and patient conversion. Now... in the midst of the global COVID-19 crisis... we have only Live Chat. It's better than nothing, and as long as you plan what you're going to say in the chat, with point-by-point objectives and the necessary evidence, it can achieve the same outcome.

You should probably also read through eBay's Offering to buy or sell outside of eBay policy page. It goes into a good amount of detail.