topic Re: Managed payments-a joke? in Selling

Managed payments-a joke?

nurseedward2020 — Mon, 03 May 2021 22:16:58 GMT

Soooo ebay stated that MOST people will be better off with managed payments. Who so far has not been ripped off? 1 transaction on managed payments and $2.32 worse off than the old final value and paypal fee structure. Add that to the gouge of paying final value fees on postage. This is a money hungry platform.... im tired of it....

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

mtshed2014 — Mon, 03 May 2021 22:36:07 GMT

yes, I 100% agree with you.

They've been repeatedly greedy over the years but the latest moves , for me, are just too far.

I can't get over the fact they are permitted to act as a financial institution, yet have so poor support for customers, whether phone, chat or easily found information on website.
None of my Aus. bank accounts require me to pay an additional monthly subscription for decent financial reporting needed for tax time.
eBay staff truly believe because their website states funds are "available" , then that's what they are. They are NOT. They are held with eBay until finally received be sellers.
When funds land in Paypal most often receiver can use those funds immediately.

There's a few "differences" here that eBay have skirted around and I'm really thinking some may get reversed along the way, just like when they demanded all users have to accept PayPal payments years ago.

After many years with eBay I've started using alternate online sales sites. With the new platform slow to navigate it's all leading toward good reasoning to jump ship.

one of my recent sales with new pricing : item sold item for $89.95 including postage. eBay fees were $12.35 , which is 13.75% for ebay.

With the new platform is slow to navigate it's all leading toward good reasoning to jump ship.

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

mtshed2014 — Mon, 03 May 2021 22:57:29 GMT

inclined to say -

I know eBay and PayPal fees put together the fees are 'similar' to new structure however PayPal has, over the years, been very helpful with resolving buy and sell problems that arise. When matters escalate I have often spoken on phone with PayPal staff located all over the world - here in Aus., Asia and not too long ago in USA.

The ONLY time I can ever recall an eBay employee calling me from Australia was a couple of months ago - they called to urge me to complete the registration for managed payments.

That speaks volumes to me as nobody in Aus. eBay staffrooms has wanted to know me for well over a decade, at least not until their new charging system comes into play.

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

jellybirddesigns — Mon, 03 May 2021 23:32:56 GMT

Most sellers adjust their pricing to take into account the fees, including postage. If you price correctly, you should not incur any loss. If you do, then put forward your figures at tax time so that it can be taken into account and your tax liability adjusted accordingly.

Other online platforms such as Amazon and Etsy take a flat percentage of the sale as well, so it's not as if Ebay are doing anything unusual. And Amazon is EXPENSIVE - their fees are much higher than Ebay - something north of 17% if I remember correctly. I think Ebay is extremely reasonable for the kind of reach and exposure you get.

My final percentage of fees was around 13% before managed payments and has stayed the same since I changed over. The overall percentage will vary, depending on what category you're selling in, but some tech and small appliance categories dropped in mid April from 10.4% to 7.3%, so thousands of sellers benefitted.

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

manicstate — Tue, 04 May 2021 00:16:40 GMT

This ONLY suits the big sellers...like pretty much everything else these days, it's ALL geared to corporations!

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

k1ooo-slr-sales — Tue, 04 May 2021 00:29:08 GMT

@mtshed2014 wrote:
yes, I 100% agree with you.

one of my recent sales with new pricing : item sold item for $89.95 including postage. eBay fees were $12.35 , which is 13.75% for ebay.

it’s not a lot, but the fees on that $89.95 item are 9c less on Managed Payments than on the previous fee structure with payment by PayPal. There are differences between MP and the previous payment system, but the fees are slightly less.

Your figure of 13.75% is misleading. Before calculating the % you need to subtract 30c from the fees as there is a 30c ‘fixed fee’. Take 30c from your fee on that $89.95 item and the % is 13.4% . . . slightly less than the 10.89% eBay fee + 0.26% PayPal fee (total = 13.49%).

This 30c fixed fee on has a greater affect on the over fee % on low priced items and makes very little difference on higher priced items.

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

mtshed2014 — Tue, 04 May 2021 00:33:36 GMT

I note the figures you quote, the adage " you get what you pay for ", and then refer to your recent comment thread title :
"Sales down on eBay, but not on other platforms"

I manage multiple eBay sales accounts and the new format has lost me given where I used to refer to Paypal and bank accounts to monitor sales/purchases and payments, I now have to attend each selling account and navigate overview pages to decipher sales and payment statuses.

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

k1ooo-slr-sales — Tue, 04 May 2021 00:56:10 GMT

@k1ooo-slr-sales wrote:

This 30c fixed fee on has a greater affect on the overall fee % on low priced items and makes very little difference on higher priced items.

the last bit of my previous post will make more sense with examples to show the effect of the 30c on the overall fee.

On a $1 transaction the fees are: fixed fee (30c) + 13.4% (13c) = 43% overall fee

On a $5 transaction the fees are: fixed fee (30c) + 13.4% (67c) = 19.4% overall fee

On a $100 transaction the fees are: fixed fee (30c) + 13.4% ($13.40) = 13.7% overall fee

On a $500 transaction the fees are: fixed fee (30c) + 13.4% ($67) = 13.46%

On a $1000 transaction the fees are: fixed fee (30c) + 13.4% ($134) = 13.43%

As shown above, the higher the transaction value the closer the overall fee comes to 13.4%

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

mtshed2014 — Tue, 04 May 2021 01:58:28 GMT

Hello , I acknowledge the fees are similar but it's the service you get for the fees you pay that's of consideration.
Obviously eBay have done their best to take PayPal out of the loop where they can. It's amazingly miraculous that eBay's well-studied accountants crunched costs etc and low and behold came up with a costing very close to that of PayPal anyway....mere coincidence or was it a percentage number they had it their sights and worked toward ?

PayPal is a financial entity that charges for the service of fast, often international , money transfers. With charges also in line with assurances for both parties involved in the transfer. PayPal services are obviously widespread and not restricted to eBay.

eBay was not a banking entity before and today most people you would ask would say it's an online platform for buying and selling goods. They are now basing a fee structure on that of PayPal however do not offer the service and assurance of that banking entity , ( although on eBay only what managed payments offers may look similar ).

In relation to fees -eBay Australia does not miss out. For some years I manufactured and sold musical instrument item types that, in Australia, attracted the obligatory 10+% fees, whereas the very same item listed on eBay USA cost sellers 3.5%

USA :
Musical Instruments & Gear > Guitars & Basses Free 3.5% (maximum fee $350 per item)

Given individual item sales values often varied between $750-$3000 it can be said there's a considerable difference in fees charges on sellers from Australia to USA in this particularly category.
My eBay and PayPal fees were in the thousands per month and they were accepted, paid and accounted for at tax time willingly...but again...don't think eBay Aus. are shy to take what they can when they can, and be sure to know that if you are in the USA and have an issue and contact eBay USA for support, then they are there for you with gloves on.

Many of those product lines were exported to USA and some years back they were in fact listed for sale directly on eBay USA ,from computers located in Australia and other countries. eBay Aus. stopped that though, and it's not hard to work out why considering fee differences.

The core of my gripe is what you get for what you pay. I've used eBay long enough to understand how they operate , and how operations have changed. Be it my opinion, I have no doubt sellers get less for their $'s than 10 years ago....whether services or support.

Managed payments-a joke?

k1ooo-slr-sales — Tue, 04 May 2021 02:03:19 GMT

@nurseedward2020 wrote:
Soooo ebay stated that MOST people will be better off with managed payments. Who so far has not been ripped off? 1 transaction on managed payments and $2.32 worse off than the old final value and paypal fee structure. Add that to the gouge of paying final value fees on postage. This is a money hungry platform.... im tired of it....

can you give some more details about the transaction that cost you $2.32 more in fees on MP?

The reason I am asking is that, on the face of it, you may have miscalculated, misinterpreted or misread your fees.

.................................................................................................

Also, and this is not directed at your post, those who say that eBay are greedy and money grabbing with this Managed Payments system are not taking into account that eBay are forwarding GST collected in fees to the ATO. PayPal transactions did not have GST applied (happy to be corrected if I am wrong).

Under the old fee structure eBay fees were 9.9% and GST was 10% x 9.9 = 0.99% of transaction amount.

Under MP the eBay fee is 12.18% with GST of 1.22% of transaction amount + 2.7c GST on the fixed fee.

More, as a % of fees, is being paid to the ATO/government rather than eBay being money grabbing.

I know all these low % figures might not seem much . . . but on every one million dollars transaction amount, eBay used to hand over $9,900 to the ATO as GST on $99,000 in collected fees.

Under MP, on every one million dollars transaction amount, eBay hand over $12,180 to the ATO as GST on $121,800 in collected fees.

This is a windfall of $2,280 for every million dollars in transaction amount that the government is receiving in increased GST collected (as PayPal fees were un-taxed).

**For the purpose of doing ‘easy maths’, I have not tried to estimate how many 30c fixed fee charges would be involved in one million dollars transaction values**

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

mtshed2014 — Tue, 04 May 2021 02:59:27 GMT

re that $89.95 , and 9cents....that item sold on the 2nd May and I haven't received anything.

had it have been PayPal payment I would have those moneys in my account and for my use.

PayPal offers a faster, global service for a fee...whereas eBay Aus. has forced an extra charge upon their members for less of a service. It's not hard to work out why so many people on here aren't happy with the situation.

If you go to your regular bank and say you want to transfer $100 from one of your Aus. bank accounts to another of your Aus. bank accounts , and they say it will take 4 days and they'll charge you 3% or more , would you be impressed ? Last I looked all of my online banking charges ZERO for bank transfers.

and I have to say - if you think eBay have done this entirely so they can gather more $'s in form of GST to pay Aus. govt , and are doing so at their / eBay's cost ...well.... my time would be better spent listening to K-pop.

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

k1ooo-slr-sales — Tue, 04 May 2021 10:34:51 GMT

@mtshed2014 wrote:

and I have to say - if you think eBay have done this entirely so they can gather more $'s in form of GST to pay Aus. govt , and are doing so at their / eBay's cost ...well.... my time would be better spent listening to K-pop.

I don’t know why you would think that I think that eBay are doing this to give more GST to the government? That is preposterous!

Nowhere did I say that . . . the point I was making was that members often speak of the fees as ‘eBay’ fees when reality is they are ‘eBay fees inclusive of GST’ . . . and for those* that claim that eBay are now getting the 2.6% fee that PayPal charged are being misleading i.e. the eBay component of the total fees has not increased by 2.6% because there was no GST charged on the PayPal fees.

* and I’m not saying that you said this

터무니없는 것보다 K-POP을 듣는 데 더 많은 시간을 보내야 할 것입니다
teomunieobsneun geosboda K-POPeul deudneun de deo manh-eun sigan-eul bonaeya hal geos-ibnida.

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

mtshed2014 — Tue, 04 May 2021 19:45:21 GMT

I refer to eBay and GST due to the time you spent to post the following :

" More, as a % of fees, is being paid to the ATO/government rather than eBay being money grabbing.

I know all these low % figures might not seem much . . . but on every one million dollars transaction amount, eBay used to hand over $9,900 to the ATO as GST on $99,000 in collected fees.

Under MP, on every one million dollars transaction amount, eBay hand over $12,180 to the ATO as GST on $121,800 in collected fees.

This is a windfall of $2,280 for every million dollars in transaction amount that the government is receiving in increased GST collected (as PayPal fees were un-taxed). "

The topic posted is "Managed payments-a joke?"

If I was to step into the middle of EVERY bank transfer you do to another Australian bank, and charge you 2-3% (or whatever that figure is ), for a service you most often do for free.......would you consider my motives to me "money grabbing" , or motivated by $'s ?

As for GST...so what ? a fee is a fee, as is the GST that is accounted for on items we sell....it's there and it's part of the total paid and/or charged.

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

mtshed2014 — Tue, 04 May 2021 19:55:27 GMT

Generally speaking the more we make the more GST we pay and as you show above eBay are making more $ on their new fee structure and so pay more GST.
eBay used to hand over $9,900 to the ATO as GST on $99,000 in collected fees.
Under MP.....eBay hand over $12,180 to the ATO as GST on $121,800

So if eBay are collecting more fees per $1000000 then where are those extra fees coming from .....the sellers pockets ?

Are you an online seller k1ooo-slr-sales ?

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

mtshed2014 — Tue, 04 May 2021 20:32:15 GMT

I'll go right back to the start k1ooo ...

I stated I agreed with the seller who posted the topic.

I then, after a few paragraphs of reply, wrote down a recent sale fees structure with eBay :

one of my recent sales with new pricing : item sold item for $89.95 including postage. eBay fees were $12.35 , which is 13.75% for ebay.

You have chosen to quote those two lines for reply, whilst omitting the bulk of my comment. You've also assumed I've shown those figures to prove it is more expensive than a PayPal inclusive option, which the omittance of those paragraphs could be construed to allude to. I did not use that 13.75% in a direct $ comparison to what I may have been charged if PayPal was involved, yet you've used those couple of lines as reasoning to elaborate on GST components & PayPal fees etc.

I showed that breakdown as an example of what % eBay are charging on a sale.

To clarify though I have spent some time to better express the fact that my concerns are relative to the services and their associated fees and the benefits ,or lack thereof, they may provide to those paying the fees. Given this my conclusion is that I agree with the person who posted the comment.
I believe the new managed payment system of eBay's to be a joke, and i'll go out on a limb and say quite possibly on the verge of illegal.

Nowhere in your reasoning do I see you accounting for the millions of dollars that used to be transferred between buyers and sellers via standard Australian bank transfers before managed payments, and thus before attracting any bank transfer fees whatsoever.

Not all things that were bought on eBay were paid for via PayPal.

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

k1ooo-slr-sales — Wed, 05 May 2021 01:37:43 GMT

@mtshed2014 wrote:
Generally speaking the more we make the more GST we pay and as you show above eBay are making more $ on their new fee structure and so pay more GST.
eBay used to hand over $9,900 to the ATO as GST on $99,000 in collected fees.
Under MP.....eBay hand over $12,180 to the ATO as GST on $121,800
So if eBay are collecting more fees per $1000000 then where are those extra fees coming from .....the sellers pockets ?
Are you an online seller k1ooo-slr-sales ?

my comments about GST were an ‘add on’ to my reply to the Opening Poster. It was simply a comment about the breakdown in fees and the fact that eBay have not increased their fees by the 2.6% that we used to pay to PayPal.

As for my reply to your post . . . I was pointing out that your 13.75% fee figure could be misleading. Yes, your fees on that one transaction as a % of the transaction total were 13.75%. You paid 13.4% final value fee + a 30c fixed fee. I then went on, in another post, to show the effect of the 30c fixed fee on fees as a % of transaction total.

Yes, I am a seller on eBay, across 3 IDs. I have sold about 70 items in the last 8 months. I am now on Managed Payments on all 3 accounts. I haven’t had a sale on Managed Payments yet as I was only registered yesterday on the 2 accounts that currently have listings. I found the registration process easy, but accept that for others it has not been easy. I did not have to give eBay my bank account password.

I was selling on this account in the months before Christmas 2020. I had Buy-Now listings that were set at a price that allowed for any fees that I had to pay (my buyers paid all of my fees as part of the buy-now price). However, I took advantage of some fee offers from eBay and only paid $1 final value fee on a $1,000 sale. That would be 0.1% of transaction total. I did have the 2.6% + 30c fee on PayPal ($26.30). Total fees on the sale were just 2.73% of transaction total.

That $1,000 sale was made during an eBay “get 10% of sale back as a voucher” promotion (max $50 per sale). So, I got $50 from eBay to spend on anything on eBay.

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

k1ooo-slr-sales — Wed, 05 May 2021 02:07:58 GMT

@mtshed2014 wrote:

You have chosen to quote those two lines for reply, whilst omitting the bulk of my comment. You've also assumed I've shown those figures to prove it is more expensive than a PayPal inclusive option, which the omittance of those paragraphs could be construed to allude to. I did not use that 13.75% in a direct $ comparison to what I may have been charged if PayPal was involved, yet you've used those couple of lines as reasoning to elaborate on GST components & PayPal fees etc.
I showed that breakdown as an example of what % eBay are charging on a sale.

I only quoted the portion of your post that I was responding to. If I quoted your whole post it might lead to my post becoming a ‘scroller’ that ends up longer than it need be.

“yet you've used those couple of lines as reasoning to elaborate on GST components & PayPal fees etc.”

NO I DIDN’T. Go back and have a look. The GST comments in one of my posts was in reply to the Opening Post and not your post, and were not aimed at anyone in particular, and certainly not aimed at you. The only way my GST comments could be in reply to you would be if you and the OP are the same person. But, the fact is my GST comments were NOT part of a reply to your post about the 13.75% total fee post (screen capture shown in spoiler to avoid this post becoming a scroller).

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

gutterpunkz05 — Wed, 05 May 2021 02:16:32 GMT

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBuZEGYXA6E

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

k1ooo-slr-sales — Wed, 05 May 2021 03:37:34 GMT

@mtshed2014 wrote:
(4 lines of post removed to shorten the length of my post)
So if eBay are collecting more fees per $1000000 then where are those extra fees coming from .....the sellers pockets ?
(One line omitted because I am not commenting on that line in this reply)

the ‘extra fees’ you speak of are coming from the seller’s pockets . . . BUT, they do not add to the total amount of fees a seller pays as a cost of selling on eBay. It’s all swings and roundabouts . . . pay extra eBay fees BUT there are no more PayPal fees . . . nett overall result is an ever so slight reduction in fees.

Also, savvy sellers factor the fees associated with selling into their pricing structure. For Buy-Now items just add the amount in fees to the Buy-Now price. For auctions, sellers can recover part of their fees through the ‘Postage and Handling’ amount on the item . . . just don’t say this in the listing! Simply add $1 or $2 as a handling charge for the listing to offset some of the fees charged. When quoting the P&H charge you do not have to give a breakdown of how much is for postage and how much is for handling.

On one of my listings I charge $4 for P&H made up of $1.40 for a rigid mailer, $2.20 for stamps! 40c to cover the fee on postage . . . BUT I don’t say anything about the 40c being for the fees on postage in my listing. It’s not misleading, it’s just me covering the total cost of having postage on my item. If I charged $3.60 I’d be 36c out of pocket due to fees on postage . . . so $4 is a fair P&H charge.

Re: Managed payments-a joke?

mtshed2014 — Wed, 05 May 2021 03:49:59 GMT

as I listen to K-pop I think this may be what you'll experience soon k1ooo :

1, when you sell and item and the buyer pays with PayPal you will then be paying eBay sales fees + PayPal transaction fees just as you always have ( sometimes I get the feeling people think that PayPal fees have gone LOL )

2, when you sell an item and the buyer chooses to pay with bank transfer YOU WILL THEN BE CHARGED A NEW FEE THAT YOU'VE NEVER BEEN CHARGED BEFORE.

Possibly better not to compare managed payment fees to that of PayPal fees, but rather managed payment fees to that of NO FEE on bank transfers.

This would be more appropriate, and is why I am in agreeance to the post that this is ... "A JOKE"

might get into k-drama on Netflix later too 🙂