topic Re: Secondhand Dealer License in Selling

Secondhand Dealer License

what*alice*found — Mon, 17 Feb 2014 09:48:10 GMT

Hi All,

I've started selling second hand clothing on Ebay fairly regularly and I'm thinking of having a real go and making a proper business for you in the next few months or so.

I was wondering if I will need a secondhand dealer license? http://www.fairtrading.qld.gov.au/shd-pawnbroker-licence.htm

Does anyone else selling on Ebay have one or know much more about it?

I have sent an email to Fair Trading but I would be interested to hear any firsthand experience.

I don't want to break rules but I'm wondering if it is really necessary. I get all of my stock from second hand shops or yard sales.

Thank you 🙂

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

zelly888 — Mon, 17 Feb 2014 10:33:52 GMT

No you don't need a licence to sell second hand clothing,you mainly need a licence if you are selling high end items eg jewelry,watches,mobile phones,car accessories etc as these are considered to be a high risk of theft.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

what*alice*found — Mon, 17 Feb 2014 10:54:51 GMT

Thanks for your quick response. The QLD website doesn't mention any exemptions for clothes, but the NSW and VIC sites do, so I'm hoping it is just an oversight.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

lyndal1838 — Mon, 17 Feb 2014 14:23:04 GMT

I know several sellers in Queensland who sell clothing....none of them have secondhand dealers licences. It is not necessary.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

reloveddesigner — Thu, 08 Oct 2020 02:03:57 GMT

hello there

I just found your old post - what was the final outcome?

Office of Fair Trading in Queensland is unable to tell me!!!

I need to seek legal advice.

Crazy given I just want to sell 2nd hand clothes!!

cheers

Kym

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

roundaboutantiques — Thu, 08 Oct 2020 22:05:57 GMT

If you are purchasing secondhand items with the intention of resale - you need a Secondhand Dealers Licence. This has been the law for decades (our family were first licenced as Dealers in Qld in 1983 - and hold one of the earliest current licence numbers).

Unfortunately ebay participants and lots of people commenting here have no experience - they simply "follow" whatever the other bloke is doing - that doesn't make it "right" or legal and lawful.

The Office of Fair Trading has really cracked down in Queensland in the last year or so - and lots of people who had previously relied on a wing and a prayer are finding out compliance with the law is actually necessary.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

chameleon54 — Fri, 09 Oct 2020 23:52:19 GMT

@roundaboutantiques wrote:
If you are purchasing secondhand items with the intention of resale - you need a Secondhand Dealers Licence. This has been the law for decades (our family were first licenced as Dealers in Qld in 1983 - and hold one of the earliest current licence numbers).

Unfortunately ebay participants and lots of people commenting here have no experience - they simply "follow" whatever the other bloke is doing - that doesn't make it "right" or legal and lawful.

The Office of Fair Trading has really cracked down in Queensland in the last year or so - and lots of people who had previously relied on a wing and a prayer are finding out compliance with the law is actually necessary.

Your comments are correct for old school businesses who have a bricks and mortar store located in Queensland. The information that I looked at re. licences for traders in second hand goods all relates to physical B & M stores, but it makes no mention of internet websites. ie. displaying your licence at your shop, extra fees for multiple shops etc. One example ( of several ) is given below EDIT - Sorry, links not working

https://www.qld.gov.au/law/laws-regulated-industries-and-accountability/queensland-laws-and-regulations/regulated-industries-and-licensing/regulated-industries-licensing-and-legislat

https://www.qld.gov.au/law/laws-regulated-industries-and-accountability/queensland-laws-and-regulations/regulated-industries-and-licensing/regulated-industries-licensing-and-legislation/second-hand-dealing-and-pawnbroking-industry-regulation/work-as-a-second-hand-

While I am no expert in Queensland law, ( or any law for that matter ) I suspect ebay sales attract the same issues all government agencies are grappling with. ie. how to regulate a cyber industry, often not even registered in the country it is trading in.

My best guess is the information provided by roundaboutantiques may not apply to internet based businesses simply because they do not have a physical premises.

It could possibly be another example of the law not having caught up with modern technology.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

gec2002 — Sat, 10 Oct 2020 01:49:35 GMT

In Victoria (may or may not apply to other states) there is no specific exemption for online trading, however there are provisions for certain Goods to be Exempt from the Act. These are low value goods which among others include clothing, kitchenware (pots, pans etc but not electrical or electronic appliances), most domestic whitegoods, cutlery and glassware, salvaged building materials, factory seconds, books, magazines and periodicals.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

sarahs_preloved_booksnbits — Sat, 10 Oct 2020 08:19:32 GMT

These were the exemptions where a second hand dealers licence is not required (from the QLD government website).

Licence exemptions

Second-hand dealing

You do not need a second-hand dealer licence if you:

sell weapons as a licensed weapons dealer
hire out second-hand goods
are a registered banking or life insurance company, trustee company, friendly society or building society
are a registered charity
are a community or religious organisation
are a local government.

You don’t need a licence if you only sell:

newspapers, books, pamphlets, periodicals or other printed publications
stamps or coins
goods or items that your customers returned to you for refund or exchange
motor vehicle batteries
used tyres
collector's cards.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

chameleon54 — Sat, 10 Oct 2020 10:21:07 GMT

3.0 INDUSTRY PROFILE Under the provisions of the SD&C Act, persons operating as second-hand dealers, collectors, and market entrepreneurs are required to hold licences. Similarly, thePBB Act provides that a pawnbroker must hold a license to operate in this State. Industry estimates of activity indicate that about 600,000Queenslanderss use the services of second-hand dealers and pawnbrokers eachyear33 . The estimated turnover from all transactions amounts to $45,000,000 perannumm which represents a significant role for the industry inQueensland’ss economy and social structure. A second-hand dealer carries on the business of dealing in or buying, selling or exchanging second-hand goods from a designated premises or locations. The types of articles which constitute second-hand goods and the operators covered by or exempted from the operations of the SD&C Act are defined in section 4.2 of this report. There are currently 2,492 licensed second-hand dealers in Queensland. A pawnbroker carries on business by advancing money on articles taken as a pawn or pledge in return for interest or in expectation of profit or reward. Despite changes to finance markets over recent years, pawnbroking is still an important source of funds for consumers unable to obtain finance from banks or financial institutions. There are currently 214 licensed pawnbrokers trading in Queensland. Of this number, 189 are also licensed as second-hand dealers. Second-hand dealing and pawnbroking are related businesses in that both involve the resale ofpree-owned goods and allow individuals to convert their assets into cash with relative ease. The second-hand sector provides a retail outlet for consumers who choose to purchase second-hand goods or who are unable or unwilling to purchase new goods. It also contributes to waste minimisation through recycling of used goods. The second-hand goods market contains a large and diverse range of buyers and sellers. Apart from those licensed dealers who deal in traditional second-hand goods such as furniture, antiques, and jewellery, licence holders engage in a wide range of activities including second-hand clothing shops and scrap metal merchants. Some licence holders deal in second-hand goods as an adjunct or ancillary service to their main business. Typically these licensees operate in retail businesses sellingwhitegoodss, electrical equipment and lawnmowers. Dealers compete not only with each other but also with private sellers who use such avenues as garage sales, markets and newspaper advertisements to dispose of unwanted personal property. The SD&C Act recognises the role of markets in the disposal of second-hand goods and the definition of a “second-hand dealer” includes an “entrepreneur” who is described as a person in charge and responsible for the running of trash and treasure markets, flea markets, antique markets or antique fairs. While it is not explicit in the legislation, the Honourable W. H.GlassonnMLAA, the then Minister for Lands, Forestry and Police, stated in his second reading speech on the Second- 3 Submission to the review from the Joint Committee representing the Cash Converters International Franchise Group and the Pawnbrokers Industry Federation Inc Review of the Second-hand Dealer and Collectors Act 1984 and the Pawnbrokers Act 1984 6 National Competition Policy Public Benefit Test Report hand Dealers and Collectors Bill on 6 March 1984, that it was intended that persons selling regularly at markets should be licensed but that persons selling on a once-only basis

From a Queensland government review into second hand dealers licences. The important bit is that it ONLY APPLIES to dealers who have a premisess that they sell from. This includes market stalls, BUT NOTONLINEE SALES ONLY. If you have a physical bricks and mortar premisess that you sell both in store and online that would fall under the act, but if you don'tt have a defined premises that is open to the public, THE ACT DOES NOT APPLY.ie. According to this report, QueenslandEbayy sellers who dont have a defined premises open to the public do not require a second hand dealers licence.

edit - Unfortunately it looks like all of these government links are blocked. Should be enough info in the link title to google it yourself.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

chameleon54 — Sat, 10 Oct 2020 10:22:23 GMT

sorry for the typos, looks like my computer keyboard is worn out.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

davewil1964 — Sat, 10 Oct 2020 10:55:38 GMT

Buy a secondhand one from a licensed secondhand dealer?

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

chameleon54 — Sat, 10 Oct 2020 12:17:58 GMT

e-Bay Q. 37 e-Bay and other internet based sales platforms appear to be increasing and surely this would be a good way to dispose of stolen property without the need to be registered? Answer Internet sales of second-hand goods are not specifically covered under the current legislation. However, if this is found to be the platform where persons are disposing of prescribed items, acquired for the purpose of resale, then investigations may be undertaken by Police to determine the source of these items and / or whether or not this person is acting as a second-hand dealer. If so, he or she would have to be registered and comply with other provisions of the legislation.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

chameleon54 — Sat, 10 Oct 2020 12:35:46 GMT

Another link to SAPOL this time that does not work. This one specifically discusses ebay sales and second hand dealers licences in South Australia. The crucial bit is the statement at the start which says " Internet sales of second hand goods are not specifically covered by this legislation " ie The legislation is not applicable to ebay sales. It only relates to physical stores open to the public. There is a seperate section of the act relating to market stalls and garage sales.

The piece does go on to say though that if perscribed items are sold and found to be stolen, police may investigate and may at their discretion, require the seller to comply with the second hand dealers act. I,m not sure how they would enforce this as they have already addmited that the act does not cover goods sold online. It only relates to sales in the physical world.

While every state is different, It appears when one actually checks the legislation and government information on second hand dealers licences, they only relate to physical stores or physical transactions at markets or under some circumstances, garage sales..

It highlights the importance of doing your homework first before posting derogatory comments about the advice given by regular posters to these forums doesnt it..

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

heihachi_73 — Sat, 10 Oct 2020 23:21:03 GMT

I gather the second hand license rule exists primarily for businesses like op shops, pawn shops (Cash Converters etc.)

If it's just a person selling things on eBay, it would (or should) fall under a virtual garage sale or the like. Otherwise the entire country would be up Ship Creek. I can't imagine the government enforcing an ABN on someone or putting them in jail for selling a pair of pants.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

lyndal1838 — Sun, 11 Oct 2020 00:24:11 GMT

@heihachi_73 wrote:
I gather the second hand license rule exists primarily for businesses like op shops, pawn shops (Cash Converters etc.)

Not necessarily.

Way back in another life we owned 3 camera stores and a mini lab.....99.99999% of our sales were new items but we had to have a second hand dealers licence to cover the few second hand trade ins that we wanted to resell.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

reloveddesigner — Mon, 16 Nov 2020 21:12:58 GMT

yes agree and exactly what I thought

I think the Act is from 2004!

I'm contacting my Local member to see what they can assist with.

Re: Secondhand Dealer License

reloveddesigner — Mon, 16 Nov 2020 21:17:51 GMT

I found your comments really helpful so thank you.

Not sure who you are referring to re "derogatory comments"...