topic Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!! in Selling

To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

polly.the.cat — Sun, 12 Oct 2014 10:35:19 GMT

Hello Fellow ebayer's, could some kind person explain to me in simple layman terms, the answer to my question, please. I have been a small Hobby Seller here on ebay since March 2009. Most of the time l am a "Dabbler Buyer & Seller", in saying that, a majority of my items l have Sold are in the hundred plus $'s per item.

How are the New ebay Rules re: Refund and returning payment for Postage going to affect me ?

If l Sell you a porcelain China Horse Figurine, it is packed 110% okay, arrives to you okay, you acknowledge that, then next week your grandchild brakes a leg off it, how is that my responsibility ???? Yet you have demanded "your" money back from me. Where do l stand now with ebay/paypal, under the new rules from the 1st Novermber 2014 ?? thank you.

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

lizzy6107 — Sun, 12 Oct 2014 10:48:33 GMT

20 views and no answers.. no one really understands. It's incomprehensible.

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

polly.the.cat — Sun, 12 Oct 2014 10:59:52 GMT

Well lizzy, that tells me that there are 20 more ebayer's that are just as confused as l am, out there. thanks anyway.

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

dazzledayz — Sun, 12 Oct 2014 11:12:20 GMT

The way I read this policy is that it will depend on the buyers honesty entirely.

If they leave immediate feedback and good DSR's you should be in the clear.

That would indicate the item was received in good condition and as described.

If however,they delay leaving feedback then they could always claim transit damage.

(and come up with some spurious reason as to why they delayed opening the parcel).

In this case you'd be up for a total refund plus cost of return shipping as eBay will nearly always take the buyers word for it.

I should point out however that this is the case ATM and has been for ages.

Most buyers are honest though and we've always been at the mercy of the unscrupulous.

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

lyndal1838 — Sun, 12 Oct 2014 11:16:24 GMT

It is not the least bit incomprehensible....I understand exactly what you are asking but as a buyer only I don't really feel qualified to answer you.

Frankly, the refund policy has opened a can or worms and there are still a lot more questions than answers out there. Sunday night is not the best time to find members on the boards...there will probably be more around tomorrow.

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

lizzy6107 — Sun, 12 Oct 2014 11:25:30 GMT

sorry, was meant to be tongue in cheek

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

polly.the.cat — Sun, 12 Oct 2014 11:29:49 GMT

Thank you lyndal, l take note of your suggestion, and will abide accordingly. thank you.

Plus Thank you to the two previous ebayer's input. cheers.

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

van_werkhoven — Mon, 13 Oct 2014 08:07:08 GMT

My understanding is that, if they are dishonest, you're screwed. They can claim whatever they want and get away with it.

This has actually been the case for a long time. The only difference now is, now more buyers will be aware of it.

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

lousbloomingarden — Mon, 13 Oct 2014 08:29:26 GMT

Correct, as Van- said....if they are dishonest your screwed. But the law of averages will prevail and you will get your fair share of problems with this new rule but I doubt whether theres going to be a landslide of returns and refunds as most buyers are pretty well behaved....I can see a lot of crystal balls coming out and feedback scrutinised before some sellers post their wares which will open the other tin of worms.

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

clobber-n-clogs — Mon, 13 Oct 2014 10:45:17 GMT

I have just been trying to find the info on which 'areas' of sales are going to be 'exempt' from the new policies re the replacement times etc for goods sold.

As both a hobby 'seller' of plants & buyer of all sorts of things, I'm mainly trying to find out where & how this leaves any Seller of plants? How can a Seller of plants be sure that a Buyer knows what they are doing, buying etc etc with their purchase, regardless of follow-up instructions & links they either send or include for their listings?

How can a Plant Seller be responsible for something that happens to plants months later after they are sold? There isn't just the possibility of a Buyer not 100% understanding what they are buying (I've had some doozies over the yrs) in the first place, but then there's the 'after care' once it's planted & then the weather etc etc .. some-one please tell me that plants are exempt from the new changes for these returns .. or where we stand once the changes become effective.

Any other plant sellers, hobby or otherwise, have concerns?

ps. yes, most buyers are honest, but there are even plant buyers who'll try all sorts of things to cover their own 'losses' after good healthy plants have 'failed' due to their own faults.

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

digital*ghost — Mon, 13 Oct 2014 11:05:28 GMT

At this point in time, eBay's Money Back Guarantee is applicable for up to 30 days after the last ETA date in the listing, so a buyer won't be able to make a claim via eBay months after the sale. (eg if a listing states the estimated date of arrival is between October 15-18, then the claim period would be 30 days starting from the 19th).

There is some talk about PayPal's extension to 180 days (from 45), but this is currently available only to buyers in the UK, and will be available to buyers in the US after mid-November. If you sell to a US or UK buyer, then yes, they will be able to open a dispute via PayPal (not eBay) for up to 180 days.

I do not know if PayPal will extend the claim period to 180 days in Australia, but I presume they intend to at some point.

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

cq_tech — Mon, 13 Oct 2014 15:25:01 GMT

Firstly, as a "hobby" or private seller, under Australian Consumer Law you're not required to offer a refund policy, regardless of what eBay may say, although naturally, if an item was damaged in transit you would feel obliged to reimburse the buyer for his or her loss, and I don't have a problem with that at all as I'd do the same thing myself. However, if somebody accidentally damages the item after it has been safely delivered, it would be wrong of them to expect you to be responsible for their loss and I would flatly refuse to do so.

The problem is determining when said damage took place, and as your items are valued at a hundred dollars or more, I'd assume that you're posting them registered or with signature on delivery, in which case if the item is damaged during transit, the buyer would lodge a claim immediately, the very same day they signed for the delivery. Therefore, if you receive a claim for damage which is dated any later than that upon which it was delivered, it would be fairly safe to assume that any damage has been caused by themselves and that they're making a false claim which, as a private seller, you would be fully entitled to reject.

You would clearly have a fight on your hands with eBay but if you can prove to Paypal that the item was intact when it was delivered, they're not in a position to accept the buyer's claim because they can only arbitrate on INR or SNAD disputes, and nothing else. I'm expecting that it will take a test case in by one of the Consumer Tribunals or the ACCC before it can be determined that eBay have no legal right to impose these draconian and illegal conditions upon private sellers, but I nevertheless believe that in the fullness of time, eBay will be forced to revoke or alter these conditions so that they ultimately fall into line with Australian Consumer law.

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

digital*ghost — Mon, 13 Oct 2014 23:24:57 GMT

@digital*ghost wrote:

I do not know if PayPal will extend the claim period to 180 days in Australia, but I presume they intend to at some point.

Well, I guess I missed the memo... Just to correct myself here, PayPal are providing 180 days to claim effective November 18. (Except for purchases made via Gumtree - no buyer protection there).

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

Anonymous — Mon, 13 Oct 2014 23:40:30 GMT

2 words.. ONLINE THEFT

Everything ebay seem to be doing is catering to the dishonest (crooks) who want to get goods for free

theres no other explanation

Re: To Be or Not To Be !!!!!!!

polly.the.cat — Wed, 15 Oct 2014 09:52:35 GMT

Very well put cq_tech, l think you have hit the hammer on the head. Why dont' we use the Old Aussie Honour System ?????

Just give the "Buyer" our Bank details, and let them Deposit an amout of money ($$$'s) that they feel like paying for the said item delivered to their Door. End of problem, ...just give Ebay/PayPal what is left. !!!!

In the USA they have what is called a W2 Form, (same as our Yearly Tax Form), Only has two questions on it.

Your Name & Address: Bert Simpson, 1143 Snow Street, Washington D.C. 21114

How much Money (Income) did you earn Last Tax Year ? $49, 538

Total Amount is: $49. 538

SEND IT IN TO: INTERNAL REVENUE SERVICE

P.O. BOX 1600

WASHINGTON D.C. 20000

& You all thought things were bad here !!!!!! You ain't seen nuffing till EBAY/PAYPAL have finished sing !!!!!!!