topic Re: Buyer claims item not received in Selling

Buyer claims item not received

mae979902 — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 03:10:48 GMT

Hi folks, would appreciate some thoughts / advice on this one.

I recently sold a ring for $50. I posted it over the counter at AP in a plain envelope (the ring was inside a ring box & wrapped in tissue paper) for standard parcel delivery. I have a receipt with a tracking number. I was a bit rushed that day so marked it on eBay as posted but didn't upload the tracking number (silly me!).

The buyer contacted me first on Wed to say he hadn't received it. I checked the tracking & sent him the number in a message - it was still in transit. Yesterday he contacted me to say the postie knocked on his door & handed him my envelope which had been partially opened (clean looking cut on one end) with nothing inside. He sent me a photo of the envelope. The AP website says the parcel has been delivered.

I've looked for info on websites and made some phone calls. AP say he will need to lodge a complaint with them, taking in the envelope so they can invetsigate (I can't initiate it as I don't have the envelope). Paypal say a claim can be lodged under buyer (seller) protection. I've advised him to lodge a complaint with AP and perhaps initiate an item not received claim in the resolution centre.

Today he has said he doesn't have time for that, it wasn't safe to send the ring in a "plain un-reinforced envelope" and at the end of the day he's paid for something he didn't receive. He's asking me to just refund him today.

I've sent items through AP for years with no issue. The other items I sent around the same time seem to have all arrived without incident. My feedback is excellent and I feel like I'm being held to ransom with the looming threat of negative feedback.

From my perspetive, although I don't believe he's lying, I have proof of it being sent and tracking to say it's been delivered. I want to help him resolve this but it's now got difficult if he refuses to do anything.

Lots of lessons for me in this one but could use some words of wisdom to consider please. Anyone?

Re: Buyer claims item not received

kopenhagen5 — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 03:18:29 GMT

I also bought a coin which was sent in a plain envelope and when I received it, looked like it was jammed in the sorting machine and a small hole in the bottom corner. No coin of course.

Seller refunded, suggest you do the same and only send things like that in small padded envelopes.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

lozyginns — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 03:35:27 GMT

Sounds dodgey, put the claim through and insist he has to follow it up, if it did fall out it maybe at the local post office, sounds like he may have done it, doesn't like the ring and wants his money back without the hassle, delivery contractor will be able to tell you, follow the case through, people lie because its easy.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

black*poppy — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 04:03:11 GMT

I agree with lozyginns. While it may be true that the ring is lost, the fact that you can prove delivery (I'm assuming - but could be wrong) that you would win a paypal dispute. While I agree that you probably should refund since it seems your packaging is at fault, as you are not obligated to the least the buyer could do is chase it up through AP. That would seem to me to be the decent thing to do, if he wants you to do the decent thing.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

dotm2004 — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 04:06:44 GMT

If he really cares .... he'd follow it up with A/Post.

You need to go through the 'procedures' first, with eBay and A/Post. Anyone can say an item isn't received. I sympathise with you 😞

Re: Buyer claims item not received

sprinklespowerpuff — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 04:15:21 GMT

Hi, Mae. I buy lots of jewellery from here and o'seas and never had this happen to me, ever, in all the years I've bought from Ebay sellers. Sounds real suss to me. I think he's trying it on. Has the ring but angling for the money back as well. If the ring was in a ring box even less likely it was lost from going through the sorting machine. The fact that the opening was a neat clipped cut rings alarm bells for me as one would think that it would be a torn, irregular opening. Just my opinion but I would be very suspicious if I was a seller.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

cherry*135 — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 04:56:02 GMT

The ring (in box) was posted in a plain paper envelope though. The quality of paper envelopes is pretty low these days, they split very easily without much pressure.

OP any reason you don't buy postage online with eBay postage labels? The postage costs are lower than parcel rate over the counter. Plus the tracking number is loaded automatically into ebay records and buyer receives tracking number notification.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

cmcoins2000 — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 05:03:28 GMT

This one sounds 'smelly'.

Envelope cut - easy.

AP says it is delivered - do you think an employee of AP would deliver such an item.

They have stickers for all sorts of 'accidents' that can occur through 'human error'.

You know where you sent to - I would be calling and telling them the story - did they deliver such an item.

Almost bet on the answer.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

hughbearindia — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 05:36:53 GMT

My advice would be to just follow the correct process. You have a tracking number so you can prove delivery. Initiate an investigation through the AustPost website (follow the endless links). If the buyer initiates a Paypal claim, escalate it to a dispute and provide your tracking number as proof. From my experience, Aust Post will stand by their proof of delivery and generally Paypal will find in your favour.

You don't know whether the buyer is lying or not so you really have to stick to the facts.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

donnamccwynnum — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 05:58:45 GMT

Hi All

I do sympathises with you

Perhaps ,, tell the buyer ,,,you are going to speak to the deliver person

first thing Monday morning

see if he umm and errs

YES to keep are postage costs down we all post in plain envolpes

howsoever I post in padded envelopes ... cost me more but

piece of mind

Re: Buyer claims item not received

mae979902 — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 06:13:37 GMT

Thanks for your comments everyone.

The buyer has now sent another message. If I refund the $ by 8pm tonight he'll leave + feedback and consider the case closed. He says if I run an online business it's one of those things that happens - best to just move on and everyone stays friends (!)

I don't run an online business, I'm a busy mum who sometimes uses eBay to sell off unwanted items.

I had considered just refunding this and getting on with life but I don't appreciate his deadline or the implied threat. I'll think I'll be asking him to open a case in the resolution centre and follow due process.

Like I said, lots of lessons for me here.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

lizzy6107 — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 06:25:19 GMT

A lesson for everyone, and a sure sign of things to come.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

kopenhagen5 — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 06:25:39 GMT

And tell him you are a mum selling unused things from home.

He may become a little more co-operative.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

ajarnjenny — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 06:48:12 GMT

I agree with Helen. A postman who handles mail all day every day, would know if the envelope was empty and would not deliver it without a comment.

And I am sure that post employees would not risk their job with benefits and great super to steal a $50 ring.

Your buyer is trying it on.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

lozyginns — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 06:51:08 GMT

DO NOT BE THREATENED, report them to ebay, black mail with feedback is against policy.

AND WHEN HE LEAVES BAD FEEDBACK WEAR THAT LITTLE RED TAG WITH PRIDE.

if you give up now, will you give up everytime this happens, is so vinnies will take your stuff whithout you losing money

sound like he knows hes in the wrong. get him never say die.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

cherry*135 — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 08:42:26 GMT

. I'll think I'll be asking him to open a case in the resolution centre and follow due process.

Wise move. Just tell the buyer you prefer to follow correct procedures.

Big W sell packs of 5 small bubble mailers, works out at around 60c each, if you are considering using more secure packaging.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

cq_tech — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 09:01:04 GMT

I have no words of wisdom but I do have a few comments. Under Paypal's Terms & Conditions you should qualify for Seller Protection so tell your grubby little scamming buyer to get stuffed and lodge his claim, and that you will quite happily be bound by whatever Paypal decides.

I must say that it was awfully big of him to offer to leave you positive feedback if you refunded his money before 8pm tonight though, and I'd also hope you'd be letting Paypal know what a magnanimous gesture he made.

When you eventually receive the inevitable negative feedback, it's worth contacting Customer Service and requesting that they remove the defects and negative feedback on the basis that the buyer's dodgy Paypal claim was quite rightly rejected.

Re: Buyer claims item not received

mae979902 — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 10:05:34 GMT

Thanks so much everyone for all your advice and support.

I sent a very polite and carefully worded message asking him to lodge a claim. Not surprisingly, he posted negative feedback on me within minutes instead.

Obviuosly this is upsetting for me because of my so far perfect track record but Lozyginns; you made me laugh out loud with your words of encouragement - thanks, I really needed that 🙂

The fight's not out of me yet - I'll see if eBay will help - but it's also not really the end of the world. (And yes, big re-think on the packaging & postage options)

Thanks again....

Re: Buyer claims item not received

lizzy6107 — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 10:09:05 GMT

Well done and very brave

You are doing it for all sellers when you don't cave in.

He sounded so suss..

be sure to name him in the feedback if you respond, so we can add him to our special buyers list.

Ebay are going to be over their heads with the dramas come tomorrow. No one will be able to keep up with the scammers, and all the sellers will be constantly onto customer support. Hope they are ready!

Re: Buyer claims item not received

lalala-au — Fri, 31 Oct 2014 10:09:52 GMT

Hmm why would the postie hand it to him, was it sent registered post??? I have never had a standard postal parcel or envelope handed to me by a postie, I only ever get the postie handing me something because I have to sign for it. Did he ask the postie why is the letter torn open? What did the postie say? I certainly would of blasted the postie if he handed me a torn open letter that was empty. I would be asking him to check his bag and get the phone number of the local post office so they could search there as well.

He has time to message you but doesn't have time to fill in a form on the net with Australia Post??? I think he doesn't know how to handle this with Australia Post, might be a good thing to email him the link to the form and explain to him to just click on the link and fill in the form for Australia Post it is really that easy these days and they do respond.

Personally I wouldn't worry about getting negative feedback from him even if you refund him he still could leave negative feedback and pretty soon I think many many sellers may get negative feedback with the new policies coming into play tomorrow. And I think many honest sellers like myself will not let Ebay push them around, and would rather get negative feedback than be scammed, ripped off or taken for ride.

Times are a changing just remember if he leaves you negative feedback just reply to the feedback calmly and honestly. You can just say I did my best to solve this issue, even sent the link for you to fill in form with AP. That way people can see that your not a horrible seller to deal with and you tried to help and are not nasty or spiteful but professional, logical and calm to deal with. Good Luck!!!