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Posts: 12
Registered: ‎07-12-2017
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Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

Hi Folk
In a nut shell: I ordered 4 items from an o'seas seller, 2 items on May 24th and and identical order in mid June.

 

Both items are small, & light. (a sheet of stickers & a luminous straw) 

 

With BOTH orders the stickers came, but the second item (the straws) must have been posted in a separate envelope as they didn't arrive. I left positive feedback for the stickers & waiting patiently for the second item. The buyer initiated contact with me, asking if I had received the straw. I said 'no' & he stated it had been returned to them because of "customs problems". He offered to refund or re-send. I accepted a refund for the May 'straw' and said I would wait longer for the June 'straw' to see if it arrived. It eventually came & I left positive feedback. I then left neutral feedback for the 'missing straw' (My comment was:Item didn't arrive due to 'shipping problems'. Seller willing to refund.)

 

The seller sent me a message which contained: 

"Also it would be nice of you to give us positive feedback and all of 5 stars after you receive the money.
You know your kind support really means a lot to us,if you don't like, you can ignore this feedback instead of negative or any low DSR."

 

After a 2nd request, buttering me up saying how nice I was etc, I replied:
"I think I left neutral feedback didn't I? Yes I am a nice person but I am an honest person and so i didn't leave negative feedback I don't think but probably left neutral feedback because the item never arrived and so I didn't think it warranted a "positive" feedback."

 

In reply to their 3rd request I said:
"No, I think the neutral feedback is fair. The item never arrived, so I didn't have a 'positive' experience in this instance. I am not willing to change it. sorry. "

 

In reply to their 4th & 5th requests I have said:
I'm sorry, I won't be changing my mind.Please stop contacting me about this issue. Thanks Smiley Happy"

 

I've just received a 6th request. I;m not sure what to do now! They are pleading with me to change it:


no , my friend 
i really need you help 
we have refund the money to you 
and the product has shopped out , it just has lost or delays on the way 
we have lost too much 
and the neutral feedback will hurt our selling 
would you mind do me the favor , if yes , we will send the request link to you 
thank you for your understanding and support 
have a nice da y
thank you

 

 

This buyer's stats are 97.6% rating, with 314 "REVISED FEEDBACK" where buyers have revised neutral or neg feedback for them. They've had 3 name changes since being a member. (Not sure if that is significant?) Member since 07-Jan-15.

 

Am I being unfair? I usually give positive feedback in 95-98% of cases, but I do leave a few neutral feedbacks when I feel it's warranted, and the very odd negative, which as a buyer I believe is my right, otherwise why have a feedback system?!  I have only just started reading the forums in the past few days and didn't realise until last night that a neutral or negative feedback acts like a 'demerit' against the seller. However I stand by the decisions I have made in the past to contact sellers when an item arrives damaged or isn't working etc. I sometimes open a 'return' case usually just contact them direct and alsert them to the fact the item is defective etc..

Opinions please. 

Community Member
Posts: 2,196
Registered: ‎05-18-2013

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

[ Edited ]
in reply to aussie-rose

I'm sure that a neutral feedback doesn't affect a sellers rating score at all anymore and if they sell a lot then it will disappear before to long anyway.

Community Member
Posts: 16,558
Registered: ‎02-27-2008

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

[ Edited ]
in reply to aussie-rose

Just ignore the messages and delete them without reading them.

Add them to your BBL and tick the box to block comms.

 

Looks like a Chinese seller, let them sink.

They don't care about anyone except themselves.

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Community Member
Posts: 9,984
Registered: ‎11-01-2006

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to aussie-rose

While you are perfectly entitled to leave any feedback you want I would never leave a neut because a seller's item was lost in the post and they offered an immediate refund. What more could the seller do? I would not have left any feedback and if I did it would have been a pos..

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Community Member
Posts: 2,675
Registered: ‎06-24-2013

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to aussie-rose

I believe you are entitled to be left alone. I can understand a couple of messages but after that, it is just overkill so I'd be leaving the feedback. If you give in, they will just think harrassment works.

 

Was the feedback fair? It's all subjective really but I personally would not have left any feedback at all for the straw, considering they fully refunded you and made first contact with you about it.

My perspective is that a neutral is for where the seller has been less than helpful or the item a bit faulty, but it's come through.

If i got nothing & had to fight for a refund etc, or an item was seriously not as described, perhaps a neg.

 

 

On the whole though I doubt it will make a big difference to their selling ability.

Community Member
Posts: 21,065
Registered: ‎07-23-2006

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to aussie-rose

I am with PJ on this one.

The seller contacted you and offered an immediate refund when you told him you had not received the straw.  He could not do much more.

Maybe it was not a positive experience for you but was it really the seller's fault that it was lost in the mail?

I would not have left any feedback in this case.

Community Member
Posts: 391
Registered: ‎05-17-2007

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to aussie-rose

aussie - rose - yes, you are being unfair.

Seller is Chinese, that's true - but does that mean they don't deserve a recognition of fixing (or offering to) your delivery problem.

Anyone who pleads with you to reverse the bad f/back  - after not really doing anything wrong in the first place deserves a little courtesy to revise it - as it shouldn't have been left in the first place.

 

You saying you "didn't have a great experience" can only matter if the seller did something that is withing their control - and postage isn't one of them. No seller can control the outcome of anything once it has been entrusted to a third party.

 

And - whichever one of you said: "let the bad f/back stay, they are Chinese, they don't think of anyone else but themselves"

I don't belive you said that!

Who do you think all buyers think of (whatever their nationality & ethnic origin)?

 

OP, reverse your f/back to reflect that seller did whatever he could to help. Even though neutral f/back doesn't mean anything much - it means a great deal to this seller - and that's all that counts.

Community Member
Posts: 12
Registered: ‎07-12-2017

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to lyndal1838

Thank you for your feedback. I can accept that I may have 'accidentally misused' the feedback system. I'm a big girl and willing to learn & improve etc and I want to play nice and be fair.

 

Given that, however, do you feel it's unreasonable of the seller to keep contacting me? What would you do in this situation? Eat humble pie and reverse the neutral or would you see that as only encouraging them to continue their habit of hassling people in the future as they will "eventually' give in and reverse the feedback? I saw the 314 "reversals" and am reading into that figure that a whole lot of people have been presuaded to reverse their feedback.

 

I appreciate your frank feedback, even if it makes me squirm to think I may have been a little unfair in some of my feedback. 

Community Member
Posts: 511
Registered: ‎03-06-2008

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to aussie-rose

I agree with PJ, Lyndal and fixnwear. You should not have left neutral feedback for something out of the seller's control, and that they in fact resolved by providing a refund. Yes, they may be a nuisance asking so many times for you to revise it and if I were you, I would.

Community Member
Posts: 12
Registered: ‎07-12-2017

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

[ Edited ]
in reply to fixnwear

Thanks for taking the time to give your opinion. Smiley Happy I asked for honest feedback so although I want to "hasten to add that I really am a nice person" etc etc...I am willng resist that urge & to listen & learn. 

Do you think this seller is artifically inflating their feedback ranking by having so many reversals, or is that a pretty normal amount of reversals for an active seller? 

 

Here's their last 12 month's stats:

27,990 Positive       336 Neutral        689 Negative

 

 

Is changing ID names considered a "red flag" that seller is trying to hide something? (I realise they just might not like their old name, rather than trying to hide something.)

(BTW..."I hasten to add" I didn't mention the nationality of the seller. Actually they are not from China.)

Community Member
Posts: 391
Registered: ‎05-17-2007

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to aussie-rose

OP, the part of nationality wasn't directed at you, it was to do with someone else's comment.

But where ever they are from - no matter - they are still human beings - and how on Earth can a fact that they have heaps of f/back reversals has anything to do with your case and your decision and choice of the f/back?

I can only guess at the reasons, probably similar situations as this one, non receipt of the goods and blaming the seller, don't know, don't care - but if I personally had such a fervent plea to change the f/back I would listen! Not only change it but would apologise as well for mistakenly thinking it was somehow their fault And causing them grief in the process. I don't think I would like the feeling if I did any of that and then not make it right.

Community Member
Posts: 24,436
Registered: ‎08-21-2013

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to aussie-rose

aussie-rose wrote:



(BTW..."I hasten to add" I didn't mention the nationality of the seller. Actually they are not from China.)


Your feedback is to a seller based in China.  A neutral doesn't  give a defect

or decrease the percentage.

 

But I wouldn't have left any feedback at all.     You got your refund.

 

Ignore their messages.  They'll give up.

Community Member
Posts: 21,065
Registered: ‎07-23-2006

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to aussie-rose

None of the Asian sellers you have bought from have particularly good feedback....surely you looked at the comments before you purchased?

Looking at the neutrals you have left for Asian sellers shows that you buy anyway, even when the feedback is a warning that you may not be happy.

 

I think you have been very lucky with your seller contacting you first and offering the refund even before you contacted him.  Even if it was not positive for you the seller really does not deserve poor feedback for refunding before you had to open a dispute.  In cases like this I find leaving no feedback is a satisfactory solution.

Asian sellers are very protective of their feedback and will usually ask several times for a revision, especially in cases like this.

 

There are too many buyers who have the attitude of "Oh they're Asian, they deserve a negative".   While I agree that some Asians are out and out shonks, I don't think this is one of them.

 

A seller changing his name is not in itself anything to be worried about....anyone can see that it has been changed by looking at the history and there will be an icon on the account for a month to tell you that there has been a change.   The worry is when sellers keep disappearing and opening new accounts.

 

The very reason that you can see the number of feedback revisions is so you can get some idea of the satisfction level of his buyers.  Did you even look at those statistics before buying or are you trying to justify your own actions now that they have been called into question.

Community Member
Posts: 12
Registered: ‎07-12-2017

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to lyndal1838

Nope, not trying to 'justify' anything. I came here and was honest in the details of the situation and in my 'motivation' or thought processes and asked for feedback, and didn't whinge about the answers given and have tried to learn and understand the various points of view. Why would I even bother posting my original question (and expose myself to scrutiny) if I was just wanting to 'justify' myself? I could have remained quiet and self-justified my actions til the cows came home!

 

Yes I sometimes read the feedback, not always though. I do watch out for low ratings, but I am wondering from your reaction to the sellers I have bough from if you consider a "98%" to be low and 'risky'?? I assume that a seller with 100's or 1000's of sales will have the occasional unhappy customer and so some negatives don't alarm me. I know things get lost in the post or arrive damaged so negative comments like that aren't a huge sign to me that the buyer is a 'risk'. It's inevitable that someone will get their knickers in a twist (whether justified or not) and leave negative feedback. I thought 97 upwards was a pretty good sign that things were pretty ok with the seller. If I'm mistaken, then again, polite & candid feedback is approciated.

Thanks for your explanation regarding name changes - it clears things up. Ta Smiley Happy

 

I'm still a tad confused about the revisions though - if his buyers were satisfied wouldn't they have left positive feedback in the first place? Do customers elect to reverse feedback of their own volition very often? As I'm not a buyer I have NO idea of what goes on in the department. Your experince would be appreciated.

Community Member
Posts: 21,065
Registered: ‎07-23-2006

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to aussie-rose

aussie-rose wrote:

Nope, not trying to 'justify' anything. I came here and was honest in the details of the situation and in my 'motivation' or thought processes and asked for feedback, and didn't whinge about the answers given and have tried to learn and understand the various points of view. Why would I even bother posting my original question (and expose myself to scrutiny) if I was just wanting to 'justify' myself? I could have remained quiet and self-justified my actions til the cows came home.

 

Yes, I have to admire you for your reaction to some of the posts here...you have accepted criticism very well.

 

 

 

Yes I sometimes read the feedback, not always though. I do watch out for low ratings, but I am wondering from your reaction to the sellers I have bough from if you consider a "98%" to be low and 'risky'?? I assume that a seller with 100's or 1000's of sales will have the occasional unhappy customer and so some negatives don't alarm me. I know things get lost in the post or arrive damaged so negative comments like that aren't a huge sign to me that the buyer is a 'risk'. It's inevitable that someone will get their knickers in a twist (whether justified or not) and leave negative feedback. I thought 97 upwards was a pretty good sign that things were pretty ok with the seller. If I'm mistaken, then again, polite & candid feedback is approciated.

 

Most of the regulars on the boards would say that it is risky to buy from a seller with less than 99.5% positive.  For some of these Asian sellers to end up with 98% it means they have hundreds of unsatisfied customers.   It is definitely something to look at...and see if the negs are for items not arriving or being damaged in the post.  If the bad feedback is all for similar problems then the chances are you will have a similar experience.

 

I have to admit I have bought from Asian sellers with bad feeback if I want the item badly enough.  Sometimes it has gone pearshaped but mostly I have been lucky.   If I have ignored the feedback and had my fingers burned I just don't leave any feedback for that transaction.

 

I recently bought 3 large pegs with hooks on them....they all arrived broken....the peg part had separated at the spring.  I can probably fix it with another set of hands.  lol   I just ignored it...didn't even notify the seller.  It was a $2 purchase from a seller with iffy feedback.

On the other hand I bought a number of fancy cardboard gift boxes from a seller with excellent feedback....overall a $20 purchase, including a couple of flock covered ring boxes.   The ring boxes were fine but the others were squashed flat and totally unusable.  They been packed in a plastic satchel with no other protection.

 

I notified the seller immediately and had a full refund within a few hours.  I left good feedback.  Two weeks later another package arrived containing a new order of the cardboard boxes....as well as the 2 ring boxes that were OK.  I immediately repaid the seller.  I had compensation in the form of 2 extra ring boxes.  I have to wonder if the order would have been resent if I had expressed my dissatisfaction in the feedback I left.

Thanks for your explanation regarding name changes - it clears things up. Ta Smiley Happy

You're welcome.  One other thing to note....if the seller changes their name only the feedback history continues.  If they start a new account they loose all previous feedback.  That is a worry as you have no way of knowing how bad it was on the old account.

 

I'm still a tad confused about the revisions though - if his buyers were satisfied wouldn't they have left positive feedback in the first place? Do customers elect to reverse feedback of their own volition very often? As I'm not a buyer I have NO idea of what goes on in the department. Your experince would be appreciated.

I think you have partially answered this question yourself.   You have left less than positive feedback and are now questioning whether you have done the right thing.

Buyers can not change the feedback themselves...the seller has to send a Feedback Revision Request.  As sellers only have a limited number of these available to them, depending on their turnover, they do not send them to a buyer unless the buyer has indicated that they will revise the feedback.

Some years ago a lot of buyers were leaving very unjustified negative feedback, especially for Chinese sellers.  That was when ebay introduced the system.  They tended to use feedback as a message sytem and would leave negative  comments like "I have not received my item".  When the items turned up they would want to change it but could not do so.

 

Personally I (and some of the others who have joined this thread) think that you left an unjustified neg when you receive a full refund without even having to ask the seller.  To my way of thinking your feedback is a perfect candidate for revision and the seller should not have had to beg as he did.


Having read the responses here, how do you feel now about the seller's request for you to revise your feedback?

 

 


 

Community Member
Posts: 6,639
Registered: ‎07-28-2015

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to aussie-rose

Just to clarify further on what Lyndal said about the feedback %, it's high volume sellers where we suggest not to buy under 99.5%. If it's a smaller seller with a lower turnover, 1 negative could knock them back to 80%. If that one neg wouldn't stop you from buying because it looks like the buyer was unreasonable, then there would be nothing wrong with buying from them with only 80% feedback.

 

Like Lyndal, I have bought from Chinese with atrocious feedback, but was fully aware when I purchased. I always check feedback for anyone I buy from. I am a repeat buyer with one, who I think currently has about 94% and is high volume, so pretty bad. The items I buy are $1 with free postage and I generally buy 2 at a time (although last time I bought 4), so if they did go missing, I wouldn't lose any sleep over it. I've only found 2 sellers with this exact item, both high volume Chinese sellers, both with appalling feedback. I can't complain though. They post within 2 days and each time they have arrived in under 2 weeks.

Community Member
Posts: 16,558
Registered: ‎02-27-2008

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

[ Edited ]
in reply to kopenhagen5

Let me clarify my earlier post. It was based on facts that I have been privy to or witnessed personally.

 

(Just in case anyone thinks I was being racist)

I deal with many different races of people offline and online and the word racist is over used and incorrectly used.

A racist is someone having prejudice against a race of people for no other reason than being of that race or one considers a race superior for no other reason than of that race.

I consider everyone an earth person.

 

Chinese sellers on eBay and other online sites throughout the globe are causing consumer confidence damage and blatantly conning/lying to innocent buyers.

Normally I don't like to generalize as I have, however the problem is so large that many online service providers are having to take special measures to combat the issues.

 

I personally have never seen so many cases from a single country of buyers being promised resolutions only to be denied after appeasement given. And believe me, I am involved in many industries.

Blatant disregard for rules and local laws are very common.

As well, personal friends and work colleagues (all Chinese) have advised me not to deal with Chinese business people referring to them as one of the most selfish people on the planet with only care for themselves or the greater China. In other words, if you are not Chinese you don't matter.

 

It is with these facts in mind I suggested to the OP to ignore the unsolicited harassing demands and if the feedback is still an indication of the OP's personal experience of that transaction, let it be.

 

I normally don't let issues get to me, but the behaviour of Chinese business people really upset me with the amount of damage that is being done around the globe. (And don't let me get started on Sth. China Sea or Tibet)

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Community Member
Posts: 12
Registered: ‎07-12-2017

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

[ Edited ]
in reply to lyndal1838

Lyndal,
Once again, thanks for taking the time to explain! It will help me and many other who read it in the future! Smiley Happy

 

I understand now why there can be so many reveisions, and it's not necessarily a sign of anything underhanded etc. 

 

How do i feel? Concerned, remorseful, repentant & 'mildly chastised' Smiley Happy but I am not upset over the feedback & advice I have received and am learning from it and hopefully will understand the system better for the future transactions I do.

 

I wasn't going to post my 'decision' on what I did about the neutral feedback  I left regarding the 'missing straw' as I wasn't looking for a 'pat on the back' - i came here to hear both sides & then weigh it up privately...but, to show what a good student I am and that I have learnt from this....you'll be pleased to know I have contacted the seller & invited them to send me a 'revision of feedback' form as I had sought advice and can see that my actions were incorrect. Smiley Happy

 

Thanks again!

Community Member
Posts: 511
Registered: ‎03-06-2008

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to aussie-rose

Good on you.

Community Member
Posts: 21,065
Registered: ‎07-23-2006

Re: Am I being unfair? Seller has sent SIX requests to reverse neutral feedback.

in reply to aussie-rose

Congratulations on being such a receptive student....it is a rare commodity here on the boards.  Most members who ask similar questions only want justification for their own actions, which is why I asked if that was what you were wanting.