Displacing Indigenous Australians

[donnashuggy]

I'm extremely confused, are they or aren't they?

[raptor_rebooted]

From what I see you argue about thousands of year old guff in the bible and would deprive the aboriginal people of their culture and beliefs which are all tied up with the spiritual connection with their lands".

i don't think so unless you can show me

the post/s

[rabbitearbandicoot]

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@gleee58 wrote:

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@rabbitearbandicoot wrote:

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@the*scarlet*pimpernel wrote:

You people have had thousands of years to to adapt to living in and maintaining homes, working for a wage etc. and you expect the aboriginals to adapt and assimilate overnight. 

 I believe the people should be allowed to stay in their remote communities and whatever the cost is of looking after them, well they're probably owed that much in rent anyway

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I believe that people should be allowed to stay in their remote communities if that's what they want.

BUT ...  how many thousands of years is the Government supposed to pay that rent until they adapt?

How many hundreds of generations of people have to apologise for England deciding to send settlers / convicts to Australia?

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Do you read what you write before posting?

DO you call yourself Christian?

How are the government paying their rent for them to live on their own lands?   Here's the thing, it's not been hundreds of generations nor has it been thousands of years, since the English arrived with their convicts and rejects.   

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I must confess, I do not for the life of me, understand how someone can read a couple of sentences and then turn them around - am I speaking / writing in a strange dialect?

Where have I said anything like 'the government paying their rent for them to live on their own lands?'. 

Where have I said anything like "it's been hundreds of generations {since the English arrived ...}" or anything like it's been "thousands of years, since the English arrived with their convicts"?

I quoted scarlet's post so that anyone could see which phrases I was responding to ie "You people have had thousands of years to  adapt" and "they're probably owed that much in rent anyway".

I can see that I must be more careful in future and bear in mind that, no matter what I say, and no matter how clear I make my point of view, that someone will read something ENTIRELY DIFFERENT into it and put their own twisted interpretation on it.

Please forgive me .

PS let me just say something else, and I will quote directly again from scarlet's post:"You people have had thousands of years to adapt to living in and maintaining homes, working for a wage etc. and you expect the aboriginals to adapt and assimilate overnight".

I have no expectations on when or if the Aboriginals should or should not adapt and assimilate. It is entirely up to each individual.

[rabbitearbandicoot]

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@*julia*2010 wrote:

From what I see you argue about thousands of year old guff in the bible and would deprive the aboriginal people of their culture and beliefs which are all tied up with the spiritual connection with their lands".

i don't think so unless you can show me

the post/s

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there is NO SUCH POST except in someone's imagination.

[gleee58]

Where have I said anything like 'the government paying their rent for them to live on their own lands?'. 

right here:

BUT ...  how many thousands of years is the Government supposed to pay that rent until they adapt?

We are talking about people living on their remote lands remember.

[rabbitearbandicoot]

scarlet wrote: " I believe the people should be allowed to stay in their remote communities and whatever the cost is of looking after them, well they're probably owed that much in rent anyway"

Me: "BUT ...  how many thousands of years is the Government supposed to pay that rent { reimbursement} until they adapt?"

 I took scarlet's statement to mean that we owe / should have paid them rent for the whole of Australia, being the bad invaders that we all are.

Both of those statements (hers and mine) indicated the Government's support for the remote communities being reimbursment to THEM of the rent we owe - not the other way around.

I MAY have got the meaning behind scarlet's statement wrong, but, I doubt it very much.

In any case - HOW does that constitute an attack on their culture or beliefs?

[polksaladallie]

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@gleee58 wrote:

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@donnashuggy wrote:

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@idlewhile wrote:

Remote communities are a blight on the advancement of aboriginal children, their parents  should be encouraged to take their children where they can expect to participate in 21st century life, have a fighting chance to break the welfare mentality, the sit down money, that has seen the ruin of indigenous Australians, not just rot in drug an alcohol ridden communities being sexually abused by drunken family members, can all that be argued against? no it can't.

Closing the gap means trying to change the mind set of aboriginals, that sitting in the dirt, in far off remote camps is not the way that closing the gap can ever be achieved.

The disgraceful Greens and Labor beat up of this important subject just highlights the cynical use of anything (aboriginals, disabled people) is never too low for them to sink.

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What about drunken whites? Maybe you should listen to what they have to say and educate yourself:

https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=812357422151569&pnref=story

They were treated as slaves till about 1970, maybe if they were back paid some of their wages by the government they would not need any handouts

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How many of the communities in question are DRY?  

Not all aboriginal people are drunks and not all communities allow alcohol.

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(c) Excessive alcohol consumption

In 2003, alcohol was associated with 7% of all deaths and 6% of the total burden of disease for Indigenous Australians. Excessive alcohol consumption also accounted for the greatest proportion of the burden of disease and injury for young Indigenous males (aged 15–34 years) and the second highest (after intimate partner violence) for young Indigenous females.

In the NATSIHS 2004-5, Indigenous peoples aged 18 years and over were found to be more likely than non-Indigenous people to abstain from drinking alcohol.

Of those who did consume alcohol in the week prior to the survey, one in six Indigenous adults (16%) reported long-term (or chronic) risky/ high risk alcohol consumption, up from 13% in 2001. In non-remote areas, the proportion of Indigenous adults who drank at chronic risky or high risk levels increased from 12% in 2001 to 17% in 2004–05.

While rates of risky/ high risk drinking were similar for Indigenous peoples in remote and non-remote areas, people in remote areas were nearly three times as likely as those in non-remote areas to report never having consumed alcohol (18% compared with 6%).

https://www.humanrights.gov.au/publications/statistical-overview-aboriginal-and-torres-strait-island...

[i-need-a-martini · Accepted solution]

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@rabbitearbandicoot wrote:

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@i-need-a-martini wrote:

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@donnashuggy wrote:

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@*mrgrizz* wrote:

they can stay where ever they wish, just the funding is being withdrawn.....as in pay for it yourself

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Funding for?

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Funding for schools, medical, social services, communiity services - the usual stuff that the govt is happy to fund for any OTHER community.

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There are 274 remote communities in WA alone. There are not enough Doctors, Nurses, Teachers and Social Workers in the bush TOWNS - where do you propose to find another 274 of each to maintain services to each of these remote communities? Then of course, each one of those has to have facilities - so operating room, exray centre and on and on. Next we'll be sending a Doctor, Nurse, Teacher and Social Worker to each Cattle station and / or Farm in the outback for FREE. Totally unsustainable and totally unrealistic.

OK, the people want to stay on their Ancestoral Land, but practicalities must come into it somewhere.

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I can't believe 4 other people kudo'd such an ill informed post.

Rabbit you clearly have no idea what happens and what type of services are given to these communities. Do you seriously think each community gets doctors, teachers, scial workers, xray centres? No one is that naive to believe that surely.

But your analogfy to a cattlestation is a good one because they are also 'settlements'. They also get provided services. In fact they get the same services offered to indigenous communities.

How do you think a child gets educated on an outback cattlestation? How does mum get to hospital when a baby is due? Who do you think pays for a doctor and nurse and all the equipment when farmer has an accident on his land? How dose the post get delivered? How does the phone get wired up?

If we can't afford to provide basic services to 274 indigenous communities then it should be the same for anyone else who live in an isolated community. 

Would you be agreeing with the policy if it also affected outstations, cattlestations, farms?

No I didn't think so.

[bushies.girl]

Most of those people be working, paying tax, paying a medicare levy, paying to build their houses, paying to see a doctor, paying to be in hospital, paying to have their essential services connected/installed.

Kids living there are able to be educated via home schooling, via the net, all paid for by their parents.


They are not provided with all this for NOTHING

[i-need-a-martini]

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@bushies.girl wrote:

Most of those people be working, paying tax, paying a medicare levy, paying to build their houses, paying to see a doctor, paying to be in hospital, paying to have their essential services connected/installed.

Kids living there are able to be educated via home schooling, via the net, all paid for by their parents.


They are not provided with all this for NOTHING

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Internet??? You're kidding right lol?

School of the air operates (for FREE) via satellite broadcast for most remote communities. As well as the satellite, the govt pays for modems, computers, printers, teachers, facilities, workbooks etc.

And whilst many on a cattlestation work, many - don't kids, mums, extended families.

And that is pretty much the same with indigenous communities. They are mostly women and children. Many of the men work on above mentioned cattlestations and come back into the communities for special occasions.

The communities I have stayed at have been predominantly women. In fact, with the exception of elders, there aren't many men at all.

But that is really beside the point. That is like saying we should stop al services to Murwumbah as their unemployment rate is 10%. that compares to 15% for indigenous people by the way. Or lets stop all services to Palm Island in Qld because a whopping 50% don't pay taxes (as they are unemployed).

[bushies.girl]

OK what ever you say, cant be bothered arguing with you