Dishonesty - Non Payment

[clubesquire]

We work so hard at being fair and honest and if there's one thing that really irks me it's dishonesty in the form of non payment after winning an item. And then, no matter how many 'nice' emails you send enquiring about payment status, they're all rudely ignored even after you offer assistance. Some of it is deliberate, I'm sure, although the buyer in question has 80 odd positive feedbacks.

I know we can't leave Neg, but I do notice some sellers stating in a re-listing, 'Re-listed due to non paying buyer.'

I'm wondering, but again think I know the answer, what would happen if you put the non paying buyers name (eBay name) after that statement? It just gives me the irrits no end that we can't identify to other sellers those who have no honour and conscience.

Grrrrrrrrr!!

Melina.

[k1ooo-slr-sales]

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@clubesquire wrote:

We work so hard at being fair and honest and if there's one thing that really irks me it's dishonesty in the form of non payment after winning an item. And then, no matter how many 'nice' emails you send enquiring about payment status, they're all rudely ignored even after you offer assistance. Some of it is deliberate, I'm sure, although the buyer in question has 80 odd positive feedbacks.

I know we can't leave Neg, but I do notice some sellers stating in a re-listing, 'Re-listed due to non paying buyer.'

I'm wondering, but again think I know the answer, what would happen if you put the non paying buyers name (eBay name) after that statement? It just gives me the irrits no end that we can't identify to other sellers those who have no honour and conscience.

Grrrrrrrrr!!

Melina.

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that would be a really bad idea.  It goes against eBay policy and would most certainly see you get sanctioned by eBay and maybe even have your selling privileges revoked for a short time (for first offence).  The non-payer would almost certainly report you to eBay.

Bad idea, don't do it.

[*tippy*toes*]

You could also end up in court.

What is the point of adding "relisted due to non payment" to the description? Buyers don't give a toss how many times it's been relisted, they just know they want to buy it now. Having that statement is certainly not going to encourage anyone to buy it. For me, I'd hit the back button because you've come across to me as being a tosser and would not be someone willing to help if there was an issue with the transaction. 

For non payers, use the tools that eBay gave you. Open and close an unpaid item dispute to issue to buyer with a strike. Stop sending demand for payment emails. It could come back to bite you. Once you close a dispute they can''t leave you feedback. If they get upset with the hounding for payment emails, they may well pay with the sole intention to trash your feedback. With your low score, it could hurt you badly having a negative feedack.

Set up buyer requirement blocks to block people with 2 or more unpaid item strikes. That weeds out the serial pests. Don't be tempted to leave them feedback. Why increase their score? Close the dispute and move on.

[k1ooo-slr-sales]

Melina, I did go looking for the eBay policy that would cover the situation you described but only found the policy that mentions not including personal identifying information such as name, address etc.

I didn't find any policy that specifically states that you cannot include a member's eBay ID, but I did find this:

http://pages.ebay.com.au/help/policies/item-description.html

This policy relating to listing descriptions clearly states that:

I would think that including the statement that the item is being relisted due to non-payer, even if you did not put the non-payer ID in the description, would violate the listing description policy as that statement has nothing to do with the item or terms of the sale.

You may be able to include the following statement in your terms and conditions of sale "Winning bidders, or Buy-Now buyers, are expected to pay within eBay's guideline of 4 days.  If you are unable to meet this payment guideline please send a message ASAP indicating a timeframe for payment"

[digital*ghost]

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@clubesquire wrote:

I'm wondering, but again think I know the answer, what would happen if you put the non paying buyers name (eBay name) after that statement? It just gives me the irrits no end that we can't identify to other sellers those who have no honour and conscience.

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I understand the temptation to 'call-out' buyers if they've messed you around in one way or another, but one thing I would ask is what impression would that give to proespective buyers looking at the relisted item? 

A lot of things sellers do are knee-jerk reactions to temporary situations that can ultimately have a detrimental effect of their selling. I'm guilty of it myself, originally my terms of sale were getting longer and longer all the time, because some buyer would do something and I'd put a clause in there accounting for it thinking it would set clear boundaries for all of these individual situations. 

But it doesn't, ultimately it made me look like a difficult seller to deal with that had rules for every little possible aspect of a sale, and was focussed on what I didn't want buyers to do rather than advertising the benefits of purchasing from me. 

In the end, I cut out all that stuff and worked out "silent" terms of sale, as in policies and procedures for dealing with situations that can arise, but aren't a matter of public interest (and let's face it, who your NPBs [non-paying buyers] are, really aren't all that interesting to buyers, and often it speaks more about you or the business than it does about [ebay user 123]). 

So, I sat down and thought about relatively common situations (non paying buyers, claims of non-receipt etc etc), decided what I am prepared to do in each of those situations, and when they crop up I don't even have to think about it much, I just follow my procedures and retain focus on the customers who are actually buying / paying, because they deserve more of my time and attention. 

Buyers are sent an automated reminder 48 hours after they purchase something (unless you switch them off), so the vast majority of the time they are fully aware that they have made a purchase that is now requiring payment, so for me I found it to largely be a waste of time to attempt to contact them (I used to, with the reminders switched off, but stopped doing so as I'd rather spend the time on other things; however rather than ask for payment, I'd generally say payment hasn't been received as yet, and I wanted to confirm how they would like to proceed with the transaction. Most people replied to that, and if they didn't it was a 99% sure bet they'd never contact or pay). 

[lm-entertainment]

i know auctions are important for people who sell particular items or other forms of payment for "buy it now" items - but i had my share of non-paying bidders until i'd simply had enough of forever waiting for people to make payment.

i changed my listings all to "immediate payment required" with paypal - and as someone else says here, you'll never have another non-paying bidder again. i've never looked back and wouldn't have it any other way now. sure, i might miss the occasional sale here and there - but the simple fact is, the item will still be there x amount of days later if no one else has already purchased it when the buyer is ready to purchase and pay immediately. 

unfortunately, as others have said - i think it's best to just ignore them and move on, without calling them out - as difficult as that is. it's not actually going to achieve anything by calling them out in your listings apart from maybe make you feel a little better. no one else will take notice of it - best to just block non-paying bidders and never have to deal with them again, or do as suggested and turn immediately payment required on :] 

[springyzone]

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@clubesquire wrote:

We work so hard at being fair and honest and if there's one thing that really irks me it's dishonesty in the form of non payment after winning an item. And then, no matter how many 'nice' emails you send enquiring about payment status, they're all rudely ignored even after you offer assistance. Some of it is deliberate, I'm sure, although the buyer in question has 80 odd positive feedbacks.

I know we can't leave Neg, but I do notice some sellers stating in a re-listing, 'Re-listed due to non paying buyer.'

I'm wondering, but again think I know the answer, what would happen if you put the non paying buyers name (eBay name) after that statement? It just gives me the irrits no end that we can't identify to other sellers those who have no honour and conscience.

Grrrrrrrrr!!

Melina.

---

What is your motivation in wanting to put that, it is the core of the matter here.

* Is it simply to explain to  potential buyers why it is relisted?

I've seen a lot of listing where they say "Re-listing due to non-paying buyer."

It has never turned me off a seller or item & I assume they do this if it was an auction item that got quite a few bids or a lot of interest & they are trying to explain to those others why it is back on the market again.

But it isn't necessary to do it. If others saw the ad before, it will be self explanatory that it is back on the market because someone didn't go ahead with the purchase. For any others, they think it is a fresh item & what the seller is doing is alerting them to the fact it has history & they'll rush in to look at your completed listings to see what it sold for last time. You don't necessarily want that to happen as in their mind that previous sold amount will become a 'top' sort of price, over which you obviously couldn't sell to the winner or maybe even with second chance offers.

No buyer is interested in who stood you up payment wise. It's not useful information. 

* Would you do it to get back at the non payer, to try to name & shame (this is what i think is your motivation, frustration/revenge)

The non payer may never even see it as they are just ignoring you, have decided they didn't want it & have moved on anyway.

The best way to hurt the non payer & give them a nasty jolt is to carry through with an unpaid item strike each & every time someone doesn't pay, ignores polite messages. Don't let it drag on-4 or 5 days after a sale-bam!

If they collect a couple of those strikes in a shortish time, they will find themselves blocked by quite a few other sellers. You're going to be cramping their buying style big time. How good is that?

The best revenge is to get even, make them suffer some consequences.

[clubesquire]

Yes, thank you. All good advice.

I must admit, I was very cranky when I wrote the first post. A knee jerk reaction. We've had two in a row. eBay is a bit of an eye opener to the character of some who breath the same precious air. I guess I'm still cranky, but will get over it. As you say, what's the point. We've plenty of good customers to take good care of.

As always, thank you and forgive my compulsiveness.

Melina.

[springyzone]

If you think ebay is bad, you'd go into terminal shock with some you strike on gumtree.

[rusty-shed]

Unfortunately if you are going to sell on ebay, you will have to get used to this sort of thing. If you sweat it every time a buyer does not pay, or claims item not recieved, or item not as described or asks ten questions and then does not buy the item, you will find the site too hard on the nerves to continue.

As Digi mentioned, set up some standard procedures that you work too, follow through with them and then move on.

Some of mine are

*   Dont send payment reminders, ebay does that automatically. Just go straight to non payment dispute. They either pay or I close the case right on four days, get my fees back and relist. I dont even contact NPB.

*  I add a little extra to my postage cost to cover item not recieved cases. Normally if they appear genuine, and a reasonable postage time has occured, I just refund straight away. It doesnt happen often and the money from my self insurance is waiting when it does occur.

* If a potential buyer looks like trouble I just ruthlessly block them. Better a blocked buyer than an agro buyer.

* Once blocked I never let them buy again, even if they send pleading messages.

* Occasionaly I get item not as described cases, or I send the wrong item. When that occurs if the item is not too valuable, I just let them keep it and send the right item or refund. I dont want to stuff my buyers around having to return an item due to my mistake. My stock does not owe me much and most of the time I just write it off. Usually its my fault, not the buyers.