HELP! Buyer lying about empty box delivered, now friend has also made a purchase.

[savings.4.u]

Hi,

A buyer purchased an item from me on the 6/5/17 and when they received it messaged me saying that they received an empty box. They opened a return request for this. The customer told me that the package was sealed when they received it but the package was empty. I have provided Ebay with proof showing that the package was sealed when we sent it, and it would not make ANY sense that if someone stole the actual item out of the packaging that they would reseal the package.

Ebay has asked the buyer to fill in a Statuory declaration which they still have not done.

I also contacted Australia Post and they advised that the buyer needs to present to the local PO with the packaging, which the buyer is also refusing to do. Their reason being that they are too busy.

Now another buyer who is a repeat buyer (their first order was made on the 4/5/17)  and their second order on the 12/5/17 made when this return request was open  - has placed a message in the 'add message to seller' section of the invoice. This is what he has written : "Make sure everything is good its my second time order cos im satisfied with the first one". I found this message to be quite strange and I did a search on him, I found out that he is friends with the buyer who has opened the return request saying that he received an empty box.

I have emailed ebay about this but they have not sent me a response.

I highly suspect that if I send this second repeat buyer their item, they will try to cause problems by saying something is wrong with the item or it doesnt work or the box is empty etc etc.

I was thinking to video the item working as well as video the packaging of the item however, they could come back to me in a few weeks and make a claim and say the item is not working and Ebay would probably side with them.

If I refund them now that still leaves me open to receive a negative feedback from them.

I really do not know what to do in this situation, do any experienced sellers have any suggestions or has anyone experienced this situation?

Thanks

[bakeandfry]

My advice would be to report the buyer to acorn for trying to abtain goods by deception.
Also follow through on the aus post investigation.
Dont worry about your second buyer, there is nothing to worry about unless they give you something to worry about

[digital*ghost]

Edited to add: I feel like I should preface this with the disclaimer that while my experience was similar and I got the best outcome possible, it's unfortunately no guarantee that eBay will respond in the same way, but I certainly hope so. 

I'll address the second buyer to start with as I have some experience in that area (having been targeted by a buyer and a friend of that buyer via several different accounts after one of them lied about INR and didn't like it when I blocked them from buying again - on that note, make sure you add all IDs to your blocked list, if you haven't already. I implemented the phone verification block as well and it stopped a couple of their newly created IDs in their tracks). 

You need to be able to establish a link between the accounts that eBay can follow, something that leaves no doubt the two are associated in some way, as that will help you establish a defense if they make false claims or leave negative feedback. In my case, I was lucky because there was shared information between all accounts that bought (or tried to buy) from me, so the link was irrefutable, but I dug further just in case.

Armed with all of the information I had, I requested a callback from eBay and explained I had members who were purchasing my items with malicious intent. The eBay rep told me that I have the option to cancel their transactions if I did not feel comfortable completing them, I then asked about negative feedback and all they would say at that stage was that if the buyers did leave negs, I can report them and eBay would review them to see if they breached policies for possible removal. I then asked for all of this to be sent to me in an email, so if needed I could prove to eBay what the rep had told me.

I then cancelled the buyer's transactions, and cited privacy reasons when they queried why (as in, due to privacy concerns, I am not at liberty to discuss the reason for the cancellations, but that it was done on the advice of eBay Trust & Safety). 

I did get negs a little while later, but they were quickly removed as the previous interactions with eBay customer service left no doubt that they were malicious purchases. 

As to your current buyer claiming they received an empty box, I'm actually really (really) glad to hear eBay has requested a stat dec. I'm even more pleased to hear that the buyer is refusing to comply, and I hope that thwarts their efforts. If it doesn't, you still have recourse, I'm going to link to a previous post I made outlining the steps I would take (and have taken) with regards to buyer fraud if they wind up with a refund:

http://community.ebay.com.au/t5/Selling/Item-returned-broken/m-p/2056630#M153130

[savings.4.u]

Hi digitalghost, thanks for your detailed response. I typed in the buyers mobile phone accounts into facebook and found their profiles and it was through facebook that I could see that they were friends with each other. I have sent screenshots to eBay from facebook and also advised them the process which I went through to find out this information.

When you mentioned that you had information that linked the accounts, I have the facebook information which links them via their phone numbers listed on eBay, Im wondering if this will be okay.

I will definitely be taking your approach as I am quite hesitant to send the second buyer their order even if I video it, take photos, show the item as tested as working prior to sending it out etc. as it is just too suspicious for me and feels like a trap.

[savings.4.u]

The second buyers comment they left me in the invoice raised alarms for me. I feel as though they are trying to send me a warning with the comment they made if that makes sense?

I will definitely be looking into ACORNS as well, thanks.

[savings.4.u]

Bakandfry, I would love the Auspost investigation to continue however I was advised by Australia Post that the buyer needs to bring the package into them and fill in the form, however the buyer is refusing to go into Australia Post.

I will need to contact Australia Post again on Monday to see if I can get them to do an investigation without the buyers co-operation.

Also of note, the buyer with the empty box claim is a new eBay account which had 0 feedback prior to making their purchase with me. The account was only opened in the last few weeks and another thing of note is that since selling this specific item it seems to be attracting an undesirable buyer group because there were also 2 buyers prior whom were making claims that it didn't work (the item has a power button on it) and proceeded to take a photo of it 'not working'. I asked for video evidence of them plugging it into the PC with the power on and them pressing on the remote control, after that I never heard from them again. One of these buyers who disappeared after I requested this evidence also had 0 feedback, the account is new and the last part of the eBay user ID is similar however eBay said that it isn't the same IP address which doesn't really mean anything I guess in this day and age.

It really is discouraging, to see people behaving in this way to try and scam people.

[bakeandfry]

Fair enough about aus post investigation.
Im not shure if you are aware but you can block this second buyer from making further purchases from you if you have reason to belive they are purchasing for intent of trying one on you (by that i mean scam you or intent to scam you).
Stick to your guns on this, dont let negitive feedback deter you.
I have zero tollerance for people who try this stuff (scamming)
Here is the link to how you can block buyer ids

http://pages.ebay.com.au/help/sell/manage_bidders_ov.html#block

[digital*ghost]

I hope everything turns out well, I can definitely understand the frustration that comes with dealing with these kinds of scenarios (in fact, I actually withdrew the items my buyers were targetting from sale for several months - thankfully, while popular, they were a small fraction of my store overall - and even when I put them back up, for quite a while afterwards, whenever someone purchased them I would check to see if they were associated with the malicious buyers before sending. I'm not saying this as recommended behaviour, mind you, just an example of understanding the impact this can have on you, and your approach to selling on eBay). 

I have to say that eBay did ignore the off-eBay links I had established between the people in question, possibly due to the fact there were obvious on-eBay links.

Personally, in situations like this (where you have strong suspicions about another buyer) I would recommend any seller follow their instincts -  the potential for bad feedback be dam*ed. It might be easy for me to say since I got mine removed, but I've had several others that I had to cop and having a red dot doesn't make me feel anywhere near as bad as knowlingly being ripped off by someone and feeling like I can't do anything to stop it. 

[savings.4.u]

Yes as soon as the buyer opened the empty box claim I blocked them, and as soon as I saw the association I blocked the other one too.

I have contacted eBay again and see what they will say about removing a neg from the second buyer if they leave one for me cancelling their transaction as I am pretty sure they are going to create problems once they receive the goods.

[collect247]

The problem you will have with blocking the first buyer is that the block won't stand as the buyer has a transaction with you.

Your block will only work after a resolution and then it takes up to 60 days for the block to work.