Item said Not recieved Ebay/Paypal Charge Back

[queenslander-one]

I have today had a Paypal chargeback for an item said not recieved by Ebay/Paypal. Have advised the FOS as Paypal under Ebay's instruction have removed money from my account when I had Proof of Postage. (Photograph of item correctly addressed and Postmarked by my Postmaster. Waiting to hear the outcome.

Copy of my response to Ebay/Paypals removal of funds below.

Hi I sent the buyer a photo of the item posted at the Post office on the 5th Feb to his Paypal Address (Please see my Ebay emails sent) or can supply again to Ebay.

Also under Australian law item 101 of Australia post rules. 101 Articles carried by post to be taken to be Australia Post’s property.

Quote For the purpose of any legal proceeding or action in relation to an article carried by post or under the control of Australia Post, the article shall be taken to be, while it is being carried by post or under the control of Australia Post, the property of Australia Post.

In Australia, the seller is not legally responsible for delivery, only postage, therefore proof of postage is what is required Also under Paypal rules.

What is proof of shipment? • The date the item was sent; and

•An official acceptance by the shipper, such as a postmark or online status. (Status that shows the item was delivered is also acceptable.) It must also include either: •The recipient’s delivery address, showing at least the state, city and postcode (or international equivalent); or •A receipt from Australia Post showing at least the recipient’s suburb, city or postcode (or international equivalent).

If money is removed by Ebay from my Paypal account over this correctly sent item I WILL be lodging a complaint with the Financial Services Ombudsman. Ebay if it wants to provide an insurance service for so called non delivered items can but not at my expense.

Will see how I fair

[crazyplacecostumes]

I'll be waiting to see how you go.

You may wish to block out your buyer's name / address though 🙂

[5kazam]

Good on you for taking them on!!!

We all know that what eBay/PP are doing is illegal in Australia, and I'm pleased to see that someone is standing up to them.

I, too, will be interested as to how this pans out.

[dylan11235813]

If it is for a chargeback I doubt you will have any issues with paypal. I have been told by paypal themselves that an image of the postmarked letter is suitable proof of lodgement, that is all paypal need for Australian sellers I believe. I would report the member to ebay and the police as well (if it is for unauthorized use of CC).

A chargeback has nothing to do with ebay, but they should remove the members account, not likely though. I had an ebay member commit fraud (against me and 2 other sellers) about a year ago now and they are still registered users.

[5kazam]

I think the difference is - eBay's policy states 'delivered to buyers address' (totally in contravention of Australian Law).  PP's policy is proof of postage.  Two completely different policies - you'd think they would have come up with something that backed each other!!

And OP has stated that eBay instructed PP to remove the funds.  So it is an eBay thing.  Maybe the use of the word 'chargeback' was not in the CC sense of the word.

[dylan11235813]

Oh OK, I just assumed it was for a sprific chargeback for a credit card. Even though the eBay's policy states 'delivered to buyers address' this can still be considered met once handed to the postage service. As in deemed delivered, ebay just seem to be twisting the words around to suite them and handing it to the postal service is the same as handing it to the customer (who resides at the address)

[phorum_junkie*]

If it is a Paypal dispute you need proof of posting, a photo may be accepted but it is not actual proof without a tracking number that is in the system. If it is an ebay dispute you need proof of delivery and deemed delivery does not enter into it, ebay's policy applies and you have agreed to abide by that when you listed.

[transport-posters]

The exact same tthing happened to be at the end of January.  Short version is that the seller claimed they did not receive the item and I had tracking showing delivery to their post code.  eBay ruled in their favour and refunded them the item cost plus postage cost.

I appealed the case and just a few days ago the ruling was reversed in my favour and I'm to get the money back.

So there is hope!

[queenslander]

Good to see you back up Ebay at every oppertunity. But Ebay needs proof of delivery goes against Australian law.

Australia Post Policy

101 Articles carried by post to be taken to be Australia Post’s property

Quote

For the purpose of any legal proceeding or action in relation to an article carried by post or under the control of Australia Post, the article shall be taken to be, while it is being carried by post or under the control of Australia Post, the property of Australia Post.

In Australia, the seller is not legally responsible for delivery, only postage, therefore proof of postage is what is required.

[5kazam]

Quote : "If it is an ebay dispute you need proof of delivery and deemed delivery does not enter into it, ebay's policy applies and you have agreed to abide by that when you listed."

PJ you obviously haven't read the bit in eBay's policies that states 'in accordance with Australian Consumer Law'.  That overrides anything else that eBay states in its policies.