Scammed and seller won't refund - no recourse in eBay

[souraji]

Seller had advertised a product (LED light with Motion sensor), item location in Australia.

It arrived within a couple of days, however it was a basic light with no motion sensor. When I wrote to him, he asked for pics which I sent. Then he went quiet.

I opened a item not as described and return request.  So he agreed to the return, refused to pay postage and on top of that, gave an overseas return address (to which shipping is pretty expensive).

eBay does not have a place where I can return this. He is working the system.

Should I close the return and open a case on PayPal? Or what else can I do?

[sandypebbles]

Is this the seller who you have left the neg for?  That seller is registered in China

Did you open an actual item not as described DISPUTE or just a return request?

The seller cannot issue a return label because he is not in Australia 

And he has gone quite as he knows eBay only give 30 days for a dispute

I can't say about the 'return' as I have never done one

Fellow members with experience in such things will be able to give excellent advice, but if you opened and followed up an item not as described dispute, I am not sure what say the seller has other than to refund you

[padi*0409]

Do not close the return, reply to it that item location was given as Sydney in the listing and that is the only place you'll return it to. As soon as you can ask eBay to step in.

The listing is deceiving in that it implies that there is a motion sensor when there's not.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/224026003242

Edit. G'day sandy, I'm slow off the mark again.................

[souraji]

Thanks for the quick replies...

He has changed it slightly, the description title was (may still be for all I know)

48W LED Ceiling Oyster Light with 35cm PIR Motion Cool Warm White 5000K SV

I also sent him a message along with payment saying that this says PIR Motion and to confirm (which he ignored)

He shipped from within Australia (item location Australia)

Yes, I did leave a negative feedback for him, something I hate to do. But this is the 3rd straight dud on eBay (not the same item, the others were a laser (never received - 4 months on), and electronics components (3 months not received) and I was in a foul mood.

I'll leave the case open, but when I go to the page the only options are "mark as sent" & "close this request"... there does not seem to be a place where we can ask eBay to step in (see attachment)... and there doesn't seem to be likely... and it's going to cost me more than the item to ship it to china

This may be a new way to scam on eBay

[sandypebbles]

It may have been shipped from a warehouse here, but the seller himself is registered in China, as shown on the feedback page

I am still confused re the return request /case  Vs the actual item not as described dispute

Rather than return request, what does it say in the actual item not as described dispute?

[tazzieterror]

Hey souraji,

Jump onto eBay's chat support, and ask to be connected with the returns department (proably called something else but they'll know who you mean).

Tell them you've opened a return request for an item not as described, the seller has agreed to the return, but you're yet to receive a return shipping label from the seller, and can eBay please provide you one instead.

I've peronsally not encountered a situation where an item has shipped from Australia but the return address is overseas - that does sound like an inconsistency that eBay have over looked, or a loophole that the seller is trying to take advantage of.

See what eBay says about them supplying you with a return label - if they agree to do so, ask - out of curiosity - "do you charge the shipping cost back to the seller for this?" 

If for some reason eBay won't agree to provide a shipping label, query them as to why, given the seller has agreed they've not supplied the correct item (as per the INAD return request being accepted), and the item shipping from within Australia.

Don't accept their verdict if they are refusing to give you a label - say something like "well that doesn't appear to be in keeping with your MBG - I don't accept that" and come back here so we can work out what to do next.

Good luck!

[gutterpunkz05]

The seller does not hide the fact that they are located in and operate from Hong Kong  with shipping from warehousing in  Hong Kong  and  Australia, even state that they operate solely on Hong Kong business hours.

The Australian warehouse may be operated by a third party/agent that is not authorised to accept returns.

[countessalmirena]

@souraji,

You need to ACT QUICKLY. The returns process under eBay Money Back Guarantee is automatic (driven by bots) and has a strict timeframe for actions. If you've been instructed in the request/dispute to return the item, you have no time to waste because buyers have to comply with the MBG timeframe.

Since the issue is that the seller hasn't provided a way for you to return the item, you need to contact eBay CS to get a human involved in this. Either a way of returning must be provided which has the seller forced to pay for the tracked postage, OR you must be refunded in full without having to return the item.

Because eBay phone support is down at present (due to the COVID-19 pandemic), your only option to contact eBay via chat support.

Link is at the bottom of the Help page.

🗪 Chat with us

            We're available from 8am to 8pm AET

            Monday to Friday, and 9am to 7pm AET

            Saturday and Sunday.

You'll have to explain very clearly, and ask to chat with a supervisor (if one is available) if the chat support person cannot help.

State that the seller refuses to provide you with return postage label - and has specifically stated that he/she refuses to pay for your return postage - and that eBay return postage label can't be used as it's not a domestic return.

Point out also that the seller had stated - in the listing - that the item location was within Australia. (Go to the original listing and take a screenshot in case you are asked to provide evidence  - although the CS rep should have no problem viewing the original listing themselves.) Explain that on the basis of these two things, you ask eBay to step in and action the refund without your being required to return the item, since the seller is refusing to provide an acceptable solution with regard to the return postage AND the item location was misrepresented.

From Return postage for buyers:

❝Who pays for return postage

If you're sending an item back because it doesn't match the listing or it arrived damaged or faulty:

• The seller pays for return postage.
• The seller should provide a way for you to return the item, or offer you a refund.
• You'll need to send it back using the postage label or other method provided by the seller.❞

From the same help page:

❝Sending items internationally: eBay return labels are only available for items returned within Australia. If you or the seller are overseas, you'll need to buy your own international postage or make alternative arrangements.❞

From eBay's Money Back Guarantee help page:

❝In some instances, we may not require that an item be returned to the seller. For example, we may refund the buyer and seek reimbursement from the seller if:

• The seller has not responded to a return request, chooses not to accept a return request for a not as described item, or has not provided a return postage label or another return method
• The item location was misrepresented
• It's hazardous to send back the item
• The item no longer has a value.❞

(Rubrication mine.)

Quote these within the chat to explain your situation.

Remain courteous at all times.

Ask the chat support person to look at the messages where the seller refuses to pay return postage.

Provide all information requested.

Good luck.

[countessalmirena]

You need to ACT QUICKLY. The returns process under eBay Money Back Guarantee is automatic (driven by bots) and has a strict timeframe for actions. If you've been instructed in the request/dispute to return the item, you have no time to waste because buyers have to comply with the MBG timeframe.

Since the issue is that the seller hasn't provided a way for you to return the item, you need to contact eBay CS to get a human involved in this. Either a way of returning must be provided which has the seller forced to pay for the tracked postage, OR you must be refunded in full without having to return the item.

Because eBay phone support is down at present (due to the COVID-19 pandemic), your only option to contact eBay via chat support.

Link is at the bottom of the Help page.

🗪 Chat with us

            We're available from 8am to 8pm AET

            Monday to Friday, and 9am to 7pm AET

            Saturday and Sunday.

You'll have to explain very clearly, and ask to chat with a supervisor (if one is available) if the chat support person cannot help.

State that the seller refuses to provide you with return postage label - and has specifically stated that he/she refuses to pay for your return postage - and that eBay return postage label can't be used as it's not a domestic return.

Point out also that the seller had stated - in the listing - that the item location was within Australia. (Go to the original listing and take a screenshot in case you are asked to provide evidence  - although the CS rep should have no problem viewing the original listing themselves.) Explain that on the basis of these two things, you ask eBay to step in and action the refund without your being required to return the item, since the seller is refusing to provide an acceptable solution with regard to the return postage AND the item location was misrepresented.

From Return postage for buyers:

❝Who pays for return postage

If you're sending an item back because it doesn't match the listing or it arrived damaged or faulty:

• The seller pays for return postage.
• The seller should provide a way for you to return the item, or offer you a refund.
• You'll need to send it back using the postage label or other method provided by the seller.❞

From the same help page:

❝Sending items internationally: eBay return labels are only available for items returned within Australia. If you or the seller are overseas, you'll need to buy your own international postage or make alternative arrangements.❞

From eBay's Money Back Guarantee help page:

❝In some instances, we may not require that an item be returned to the seller. For example, we may refund the buyer and seek reimbursement from the seller if:

• The seller has not responded to a return request, chooses not to accept a return request for a not as described item, or has not provided a return postage label or another return method
• The item location was misrepresented
• It's hazardous to send back the item
• The item no longer has a value.❞

(Rubrication mine.)

Quote these within the chat to explain your situation.

Remain courteous at all times.

Ask the chat support person to look at the messages where the seller refuses to pay return postage.

Provide all information requested.

Good luck.

[souraji]

Thanks for that reply. That clears up many things. Things are progressing now. I tried to contact eBay CS but still haven't been able to.

Meanwhile after back and forth with the seller, he has now provided a local return address (by message not on the return platform). He has also sent another message saying that he will refund the postage as well once he receives the item. However looking at his deceptive listing practices, I don't think that is going to happen as he'll leave me hanging and I'll have had to bear the local shipping. My questions:

1) Will eBay accept it as returned if I ship to the return address he provides via messages?

2) Will eBay step in to recover postage to me for wrongly described item?

I've no problems sending it back locally as what I've got is useless to me...

It's not lost on me that I am resorting to asking questions that should be easily asked off eBay on the community forum (on which eBay lets volunteers do its hard work) but I can't contact their customer service so far. All replies are appreciated. Thank you for your support guys.

[digital*ghost]

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@souraji wrote:

1) Will eBay accept it as returned if I ship to the return address he provides via messages?

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eBay's request and returns process is largely automated, and they allow a 5k radius for returns in order for something to be considered as delivered - if the official return address, as provided within the case system, is in another country, they will match that data to the data on the tracking, which will not show delivered to the official address, so in this case I wouldn't do anything without contacting eBay first.