Do ebay simply find in favour of dodgy buyers/scammers or investigate for real?

[jeisner23]

So I sold a bunch of camera lenses mentioning they came from a deceased estate (which they did). 

A buyer with a long history of buying and reselling lenses, bought one of them and immediately complained of a missing part (an accessory I said wasn't included in the listing) trying to get half his money back and keeping the item, counting on me not knowing enough to know he was misleading me, I pointed out the clarity of the listing and he changed his story. 

He then claimed the auto focus was broken on the manual focus lens, pretending he was new to camera lenses and didn't know it was not auto focus based on my description. He lodged a return request saying this. I proved the listing was clear and not my fault he didn't know, he kept arguing until it was clear he was in the wrong and has changed his story again as to what is wrong, now pointing out he runs a business selling lenses and knows about this lens (complete change of story).

I fear he may return a different item (was using me to swap over his faulty one) or something else dodgy is going on as ther was so much dishonesty already. I have blocked him from buying on my auctions again but am concerned what ebay will do when I don't accept the return and let ebay investigate it?

I did contact the escalation team 3 times, lol. Twice I was told they will ALWAYS side with the buyer, it doesn't matter if he is lying, and once the guy knew about lenses and said he is clearly lying and not to worry about it, letting ebay investigate before I accept.

Has anyone been through the escalation proceedure when refusing a return, do they even do due dilagence or just find in the buyers favour. I am getting a bit sick of how buyer centric ebay has become, it seems to be the perfect place to scam sellers.


Interestingly I accidentally posted this on the US forum and was assured ebay will never contact you and just refund the buyer and let them keep the item if you let it escalate. I called ebay support and they once more denied this and said they "would never do that" but multiple people said on the ebay US forums that is what happened to them.. so who's telling the turth?

[jeisner23]

BTW the reason I originally didin't accept the return is I am out of pocket shiping both directions on a 'no returns' item when I was VERY clear what was included in the sale, and he started out by trying to extort $140 out of me for a $350 item.

[digital*ghost]

I've never had a dispute escalated so I can't say with experience what eBay will do, but the automated system is notorious for closing in the buyer's favour.

Has eBay gone through the message history? Getting someone on your side via phone contact is the best bet, and get them to email you anything they advise by phone so you have something in writing if they say something positive. It can take a bit of time and patience (or a lot, unfortunately ).

The other option is to call the buyer's bluff, but it's risky , especially as this may not be their first rodeo, so to speak. If worse comes to worse, though, you can advise them that any fraudulent behaviour will be reported to ACORN, who are a federal agency dealing with online fraud, and that a return will be opened and inspected in the presence of a legal witness to ensure there is no dispute over what was returned.

[maranock]

I recall a few posts about this sort of thing, particularly with camera lenses. I wonder if there is a particular lens scammer that is doing this to many sellers?

[jeisner23]

He seems to buy and resell lenses, based on his behaviour I presumed the game is to get a partial refund to make more profit from sellers he thought were not experienced with lenses. To be fair I have no definitive proof of that, but that is what he seemed to be trying at first and when I wouldn't play ball he had no problem misrepresenting the facts to get his way. 

Well just to fill in the result.

They found in my favour, and blocked him from leaving me feedback, and I blocked him from buying from me in the future, so that's a big relief (the feedback part).

10 minutes later he filed a paypal dispute and the whole process has to start all over again.. I told them they can investigate as I can't be bothered dealing with him again, I just don't trust anything he says at this point.

[digital*ghost]

Great news on the eBay front.

I suspect PayPal are likely to instruct the buyer to return the item to you, though, if there is no evidence provided the item was as described. If the buyer was just angling for a partial refund they may not follow through with a return.

[jeisner23]

I let it go through to a cliam and have heard nothing from paypal and no updates in the resolution centre..

They told me they would require evidence it was NOT as descriped, apparently a report from a camera store would be requried, not sure how that works but see what happens, at this point I'm over it, I said they could just do whatever they think is right and left it to them if I have to accept the return so be it..

[dazzledayz]

All lenses have a unique serial number which should be clearly visible in any pic of the front element.

I didn't think it was possible to open a PayPal dispute once an eBay dispute had been closed?

My feeling is you'll be ok with this one.

[lyndal1838]

Yes, you can open a paypal dispute after an ebay dispute is closed or has failed.....but you cnnot go the other way.

The order is....ebay dispute, followed by a paypal dispute and in extreme cases a bank chargeback if the payment was funded by a credit or Visa debit card.But none of them can be open concurrently.

[dazzledayz]

Thanks Lyndal, I always wondered about that.

Hopefully the OP will be ok with this.

I think PayPal set the bar for claims a bit higher than ebay don't they?