Does eBay actually want to know about misrepresentation or fraud by sellers?

[jomulv_0]

Having returned to eBay as a buyer after a break of a couple of years I find it is now virtually impossible to report a listing that is obvious misrepresentation or outright fraudulent. In the past I've reported obviously fraudulent listings and they've been taken down promptly. Now I find that with eBay's "report" button there is no category for fraud or misrepresentation and you get stuck with no way of actually reporting the misrepresentation. eBay wants us to report sellers evading eBay fees but is apparently unconcerned with fraudulent activity. Surely it is better to prevent a buyer being sold a pup in the first place than for them to have to seek redress afterwards.

The listing that prompted this is Pentax SP 10x50 Binoculars 65903 With Hard Carry Case

According to the specs listed this is "Fully Multicoated, Waterproof & Fogproof". If it was indeed a current-model Pentax SP binocular that would be correct, however the accompanying pictures are clearly of a 1960s-era binocular. Binoculars of that vintage had single-coated outer lenses but frequently the prisms and internal lens elements were uncoated glass. Fully Multicoated means that every air-glass surfaces is coated to reduce reflections, in practical terms this means a brighter image. To be waterproof and fogproof the binocular needs to be tightly sealed and filled with nitrogen or argon gas. No binocular of that era was waterproof and fogproof, as the many examples with internal dust and mould demonstrate. 

Now this misrepresentation could be seller ignorance but I doubt it. Firstly the specs appear to be correct for a Pentax SP binocular and lifted from a genuine listing such as this one

However, a glance at the pics shows that the genuine article in no way resembles the binocular he is selling. So I suspect deliberate fraud. The amount involved may not be great but IMO these petty cheats should not get away with it.

The listing has 1 bid on it and 1 day yet to run. So Ebay, what are you going to do about it?

[repentatleisure1952]

" So Ebay, what are you going to do about it?"

No member on the forums can answer for eBay.

However I guess they will continue to provide the eBay Money Back Guarantee to protect buyers...as they have done on those listings.

[springyzone]

I have no doubt you are probably right because you seem to know your stuff.

The seller's downfall could be they looked up the details they could find for that sort of binocular and just copied it, without taking into consideration that materials and manufacturing would surely have changed over the decades. They may not even know how old their binoculars are.

The details they give about the actual set on sale are a bit sparse.

But whether it is deliberately misleading or just sloppy advertising, I don't know, as the seller appears to be fairly new. If, as you say, the photos should have alerted the seller to the fact it wasn't an identical pair then yes, that is misleading and they should not have just copied it.

I'd say this is a hard one for ebay as it doesn't look to be a fake product or a banned product and they would not be sure if all the specs are accurate or not without a bit of research. 

I think sometimes ebay does nothing unless an ad fits clearly into the fraud category. You've only got to see what some of the Chinese ads are like to know some sellers infringe with impunity.

All I can suggest is that ebay isn't a bad place to buy, but you need to keep your wits about you, for sure, and ask the seller the hard questions. 

As tuckcase said, if a buyer received an item and found they were not as advertised, they would be best to open a 'not as described' claim on ebay. That, if nothing else, will teach the seller to take a bit more care because I would think the buyer would win their claim and the seller would end up out of pocket with paying postage 2 ways.

[k1ooo-slr-sales]

"Does eBay actually want to know about misrepresentation or fraud by sellers?"

probably not

[go-tazz]

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@jomulv_0 wrote:

Having returned to eBay as a buyer after a break of a couple of years I find it is now virtually impossible to report a listing that is obvious misrepresentation or outright fraudulent. In the past I've reported obviously fraudulent listings and they've been taken down promptly. Now I find that with eBay's "report" button there is no category for fraud or misrepresentation and you get stuck with no way of actually reporting the misrepresentation. eBay wants us to report sellers evading eBay fees but is apparently unconcerned with fraudulent activity. Surely it is better to prevent a buyer being sold a pup in the first place than for them to have to seek redress afterwards.

Now this misrepresentation could be seller ignorance but I doubt it. Firstly the specs appear to be correct for a Pentax SP binocular and lifted from a genuine listing such as this one

However, a glance at the pics shows that the genuine article in no way resembles the binocular he is selling. So I suspect deliberate fraud. The amount involved may not be great but IMO these petty cheats should not get away with it.

The listing has 1 bid on it and 1 day yet to run. So Ebay, what are you going to do about it?

---

They are a newbie seller and obviously not experienced with selling this type of item.

It looks like they are pre-fill item specific details that eBay have a habit of adding automatically and the seller

only put in that bottom line (so they may believe that the info is correct due to eBay adding them).

Maybe contact the seller and let them know that the items specifics are incorrect and don't match that particular

pair of binoculars.

This looks like seller error and IMHO it's not a fraudulent listing.

To report fraudulent listings you can use the report link on the item page,(above the item number).

Then use the drop down boxes: Listing practices > Fraudulent listing practices > You suspect that a listing is

fraudulent, >Continue > Send report.

[brerrabbit585]

Ebay staff wouldn't be experts on binoculars and you can't expect them to spend hours on researching your claims, and they wouldn't pull a listing just on your say so.

[jomulv_0]

The issue is not that eBay should know the ins and outs of binoculars. The issue is that I know yet I have no way of alerting eBay or the buyer who is about to get cheated. The obvious conclusion is that eBay doesn't want to know because they profit from buyers paying inflated prices for misrepresented goods. Says volumes about eBay's ethics or rather the lack thereof. If I had any other way of communicating with eBay I wouldn't bother posting here, I only do so in the vague hope that eBay staff monitor these discussions and might take action (fat chance!)

As for the seller making an innocent mistake, pull the other one. The photos of the genuine listing show a rubber armoured modern binocular totally unlike what they're selling. Are they blind? In the past I've contacted sellers pointing out they have falsely described their item. It's either been ignored or I've received an angry response. I no longer bother. BTW I could cite numerous cases of misrepresentation just in the current binocular listings alone, since I've recently looked those over. I'm not likely to be deceived but an innocent newbie could be. Then there are those sellers describing the item with the weasel words "in wonderful condition for its age" to describe something that is anything but.

I mentioned that I have previously reported obvious cases of fraud to eBay. These weren't penny-ante chisellers like the one I cited, but involving hundreds of $. I reported them to eBay and they got pulled before a buyer had been defrauded. If I saw a similar case today I have no way of alerting eBay. Yet I can report a seller trying to evade eBay fees. That right there tells you Ebay's priorities - their own pockets first and seller fraud nowhere. (I realise that buyer fraud is a hot topic, but I don't have any personal experience there)

[imastawka]

Did you not read go-tazz's post #5?

He told you in detail how to report the item to ebay.

Ebay do not read the boards.

You would be surprised at the number of sellers who come to the boards

complaining that a buyer has only looked at the pictures and bought.

And that they haven't read the description at all.

How do you know the bidder in this case hasn't done the same?

[springyzone]

If I were you, I'd still have a go at writing to the seller. Point out the fraudulent aspects and that this is not allowed and that you will be reporting it.

You've struck a newbie seller here who might be bluffed or at least made nervous. If they did it on purpose at least they will know they didn't get away with it.

It is a shame you can't click on the bidder name and private message them, as you once could have. Ebay cite privacy reasons and I guess that's true to some extent but I found it useful in the past.

When it comes to misrepresentation & home sellers, yes, you often can get them using words and phrases I personally would not use. I have come across that myself recently (on small furniture items), where people write that it is in ';excellent condition' but you can see the top is all stained and with scratches.

I don't think anyone will ever stamp that sort of thing out completely because some of it comes down to personal opinions.

My personal pet hate on ebay descriptions at the moment though is 'in used condition.' It tells me nothing.

[countessalmirena]

@jomulv_0,

You and I probably start from opposite ends. I usually assume good faith on the part of others, until events prove otherwise, or unless evidence shows otherwise.

That being the case, I'm assuming that the seller in question has made an honest mistake. I'd be contacting the seller with something like this:

❝Dear [seller],

I came across your listing for the binoculars (item number xxx], and it was apparent that there was some sort of mistake! It might have been that the item specifics automatically being filled in your listing were generated incorrectly - but I can see that you are a fairly new seller and that the mistaken details are very likely a genuine error. That being the case, I would so much rather let you know privately about those mistakes so that you can edit the listing, rather than contacting eBay to report the incorrect listing and request its removal. (All of us can make genuine mistakes!)

The errors are [details about the errors].

Do you know how to edit the listing? If you have any problems, I would be happy to talk you through it, or you can post on the Community Discussion Boards for help. You can also read through the eBay Help page for revising a listing.

Best regards,

[name]❞

If that produces no result (give it a day or so), you can always report the listing as per go-tazz's post.