The Importance of Scrutinizing Seller Information

[sterling001]

Recently, I was looking at an Argyle pink diamond on eBay being offered for sale by a vendor based in Thailand.

The certificate displayed was issued from a large, reputable organization. So far, so good. I went to the website of the certifier and punched in the ID number and sure enough the certificate was displayed. Still all good...until I noticed that information about the fluorescence noted on the certificate on the website of the certifier was missing from the certificate displayed by the vendor on eBay...

Then I noticed spelling and grammatical errors in the disclaimer located at the bottom of the certificate displayed by the eBay vendor. Mistakes that this large, reputable diamond certifier would be very unlikely to make. I concluded that this was quite probably a photograph of a fake certificate. 

Buyer beware.

[gutterpunkz05]

Maybe, but in this day and age, fake certificates can be simply recreated as exact replicas.  Master forgers are no longer required.

[sterling001]

I completely agree with you. When I say, "fake certificate" it's to be understood as a computer generated replica of a real certificate which resides in an online registry of a very reputable, well known diamond grader/certification company. The real certificate happens to be able to suit a stone the shonk is trying to sell, but for some inexplicable reason the disclaimer at the bottom of the certificate contains abominable use of English. ? And, information in the original certificate has been removed. ? They probably just expect the potential buyer to check up on the certificate, see that it's the same amount of carats, cut, clarity and color and leave it at that. They don't expect one to studiously compare the certificate they've displayed with the real online certificate in the online registry of the diamond certifier. Admittedly, aspects of this particular case have me somewhat puzzled. 

[sandypebbles]

And as said on your other post about this

Too many buyers do not care. They do not read listing descriptions, look at photos, look at feedback 

And many don’t, can’t or won’t open a dispute when thing go pear shaped

Have a look how many hundreds of times it has been posted about warranties on eBay meaning nothing, and even more posts from buyers who bought something from a dodgy sellers overseas demanding the warranty be honoured 

[sterling001]

Thank you for your reply.

This post is about a different and specific aspect regarding purchasing Argyle pink diamonds on eBay, i.e., fraudulent certificates.

Yes, I appreciate what you're saying. However, there's zero harm in alerting people whom are trying to avoid problems. The solution is definitely not silence/no sharing of information. However, I do understand that there are users who just couldn't care less about being ripped off. And then there are those who care a great deal about not getting ripped off. 

[springyzone]

until I noticed that information about the fluorescence noted on the certificate on the website of the certifier was missing from the certificate displayed by the vendor on eBay...

Then I noticed spelling and grammatical errors in the disclaimer located at the bottom of the certificate displayed by the eBay vendor. Mistakes that this large, reputable diamond certifier would be very unlikely to make

Sometimes I think it is great that a lot of scammers are obviously not fluent in English, as the mistakes they make often give the game away. You are right, big companies such as ebay, banks, diamond certifiers and so on would usually have proof read documents to within an inch of their life.

I think you were more astute than most buyers on ebay in that you actually went to the website of the certifier to double check the ID number, and not only that, you compared it in detail.

Unfortunately,  a lot of buyers on ebay just see it as a platform where they can pick up bargains. They don't check up on any information, nor do they even do a basic check on the seller or the seller's feedback. I suspect a lot of them don't know how to do that or even that you can do that.

And some people don't seem to think things through. They buy something from overseas and state that the ad says it came with a 2 year guarantee or whatever. How did they imagine a claim would work if something went wrong? Had a friend who was in that situation with a camera and she was shocked she had to return it... overseas, at her expense. She was at least lucky they honoured the warranty, I guess.

I read in your other thread about how the colour of the pink argyle is paramount and how buying online can be risky as the lighting can misrepresent the colour in photos. Probably make it look more intense than it is.

That is interesting information although I do think most people should be aware that it can be hard to show exact shades on a computer monitor. Mind you, if a certificate says a shade is #9 when it is really #4 (or is it vice versa?), I doubt many customers would have the specialised knowledge to dispute it, not unless they went to an Australian jeweller to have it assessed.

Good luck with your pink diamond hunting & glad you are alert to the ebay scams, which sound quite elaborate with these diamonds. I wonder how many people have been ripped off and don't realise it.

[sterling001]

springyzone wrote:

I read in your other thread about how the colour of the pink argyle is paramount and how buying online can be risky as the lighting can misrepresent the colour in photos. Probably make it look more intense than it is.

That is interesting information although I do think most people should be aware that it can be hard to show exact shades on a computer monitor. Mind you, if a certificate says a shade is #9 when it is really #4 (or is it vice versa?), I doubt many customers would have the specialised knowledge to dispute it, not unless they went to an Australian jeweller to have it assessed.

Ever since Ben Affleck proposed to Jennifer Lopez in 1992 with a gigantic Argyle pink diamond the popularity and mystique of Argyle pinks has skyrocketed. Ever since the Argyle diamond mine closed in 2020 the price of Argyle pinks has gone berserk. Suddenly larger lighter stones (sixes, sevens and eights) are now sought after whereas in the past they weren't considered as worthy of investment. 

GIA consider anything under 0.20 to be melee.

https://blog.brilliance.com/diamonds/what-are-melee-diamonds

The Thai and Indian diamond dealers on eBay are mainly selling pink diamonds in the melee category and/or larger heavily included (flawed) ones. Single tiny diamonds, say, 0.05 carats in weight from Argyle are not laser inscribed and don't come with individual certificates. The o/seas eBay dealers advertise their pinks as being "Argyle" but never use the Argyle 1-10 scale. Instead, they'll state something like "fancy" or "fancy intense" or "fancy light," etc. They do give the warning that there can be variations in colour due to how different computer monitors display. However, the reports I've received are that the photos displayed are of, say, a "5" but when the stone is received it has the tone of a "9". The point being that you won't need a jeweller to realize the difference, and computer monitors don't have that degree of variation. Therefore, in my opinion, there'd be a case for return or reimbursement on the basis of an inaccurate description. And, as mentioned previously, dealers can state that a tiny diamond emanated from the Argyle mine till the cows come home, but they never have any proof that it actually did. It may be an Argyle pink diamond, it may not be? You'll need a certificate from a reputable firm like GIA if you want to resell it as a genuine Argyle pink. 

 

[domino-710]

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@sterling001 wrote:

 Therefore, in my opinion, there'd be a case for return or reimbursement on the basis of an inaccurate description. 

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Of course there would - and a buyer can be just as unscrupulous.

Receiving the ' real thing ' - could keep the ' real thing ' and return a ' fake .

Sending with proof of postage - tracking showing delivered - no proof whatsoever of what that package contained.

Don't consider buying valuable stones on eBay - simples.

[countessalmirena]

Family member has a gorgeous pink sapphire. If I were looking for a pink stone, I might go down that route rather than a pink diamond, primarily because with the latter one is paying for rarity and perceived status as much as for the quality of stone - and I would want my money to pay for quality (including beauty) above all.

There’s no denying the intrinsic beauty of Argyle pink diamonds – that’s not the issue. And … yes, domino, I’d want to see it in person before spending that much money on a stone.

Pearls are more irresistible to me than diamonds, though.

[sterling001]

Firstly, you're off topic, because I'm not talking about buyers diddling sellers, which - by the way - can happen in a plethora of transactions involving all sorts of merchandise sold on eBay. 

This is more a discussion where I'm educating you about Argyle pink diamonds, what to expect to find for sale when o/seas dealers are offering stones, and pointers which will lead to you asking those dealers salient questions, and getting satisfactory answers before you make your purchase/s.

domino-710 wrote:

Don't consider buying valuable stones on eBay - simples.

Your bold assertion above is simply not correct. It's a blanket statement, and it denigrates every genuine, reputable gemstone retailer operating on eBay. For example, the largest dealer in Australia, based in Sydney, for wholesale Argyle pink diamonds sells on ebay (or was last time I looked). One could buy online from him with the utmost confidence. There are other dealers operating on eBay whom are equally as trustworthy.