Seller threatening legal action over EBG refund

[skaterfrost]

In mid August I purchased a nearly 70 year old camera which was described as perfectly functional. Upon receiving the camera and testing out the lens, 4 of the shutter speeds were sticky/ didn’t work. I then took videos of each shutter speed not working, uploaded them to YouTube and sent the seller the links as proof the camera wasn’t fully functional. I asked for a $150 partial refund to cover the cost of repair of the lens. The seller just kept telling me they refused to believe the camera didn’t work, and was not willing to offer the $150 partial refund, so I opened up a case on eBay. Ebay asked me to send the item back, which I didn’t want to do so I closed the case with comments saying that I wanted to keep the camera, and decided to just cop the cost myself. However a few days later I recieved a full refund from eBay, which I decided was the EBG refunding me and then did nothing more about it. Now, over a month later the seller has messaged me suggesting they will report the camera as stolen to my local police. I’ve had no message from eBay or anything at all. Just needing some advice on what to expect. Thankyou

[lyndal1838]

At a guess I would think you will be hearing from the police if you do not return the camera to the seller.

No matter where the refund came from, you cannot keep the money and the camera.

All your actions would suggest to the seller that you were just wanting the item for free....he is not prepared to be scammed.

[skaterfrost]

Thanks for your reply, I’m just trying to figure out what to do/expect as I genuinely don’t know. It’s curious to me that I have not heard from either eBay, or PayPal, or why I didn’t receive this message a month ago when the dispute was opened/closed. After reading the EBG it did say sometimes eBay initiates a refund on the sellers behalf without needing the buyer to return to item when it is significantly not as described. Should I wait to hear from eBay? Thanks again

[lyndal1838]

Just rereading your original post I see that ebay told you to post the item back but you closed the case instead.

That suggests to me that ebay has assumed that the item was returned and they have taken the money from the seller and given it to you.   The seller must be furious with you and I do not blame him.

There is already evidence on the boards that ebay and paypal notifications are a bit erratic so perhaps not finding out where the refund came from was not a good idea....and not returning the camera was a very bad idea.

If it were me I would make up my mind what I want to do....if you want the camera repay the seller.  If you want the money send the camera back to the seller.  And send him a very apologetic message.

[love_of_cars]

This is an interesting case in that it may explain why eBay often appears to side with the buyer in these cases.  In this case the buyer indicated they wanted to keep the item but may not have made the right action to indicate this to the (automated?) eBay system.

The seller must be like many sellers who come onto this forum to seek help and/or vent about a buyer who has appeared to rip them off, and is now doing what they feel is left as an option to try and get the item or the money back.

What I worry about for you now is that there may be a very slight possibility that the money you received back may be taken back by the seller who puts a claim in through whatever channel they can.  I've had this happen before, where the funds poing-ponged twice after a claim and change of mind by the buyer to cancel the claim.

So in the end, it is a delicate situation and I think the best thing you can do is to fully communicate with the seller and explain everything as clear as you can and be calm and friendly about it all, insist you want to do the right thing by everyone.  And try and find an agreement on what both of you will and won't do, so you can both move forward and not have to worry about it once it's settled.

[twyngwyn]

Hi...I would alert the seller to this thread, so that the seller will understand your dilemma and you might come out of this with a clear conscience & a thankyou

[sugar249]

you have the came4ra and you have the money.  Ypou shouldnt have both,  no wonder the seller is threatening to report you.   I don't blame them

[springyzone]

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@skaterfrost wrote:
In mid August I purchased a nearly 70 year old camera which was described as perfectly functional. Upon receiving the camera and testing out the lens, 4 of the shutter speeds were sticky/ didn’t work. I then took videos of each shutter speed not working, uploaded them to YouTube and sent the seller the links as proof the camera wasn’t fully functional. I asked for a $150 partial refund to cover the cost of repair of the lens. The seller just kept telling me they refused to believe the camera didn’t work, and was not willing to offer the $150 partial refund, so I opened up a case on eBay. Ebay asked me to send the item back, which I didn’t want to do so I closed the case with comments saying that I wanted to keep the camera, and decided to just cop the cost myself. However a few days later I recieved a full refund from eBay, which I decided was the EBG refunding me and then did nothing more about it. Now, over a month later the seller has messaged me suggesting they will report the camera as stolen to my local police. I’ve had no message from eBay or anything at all. Just needing some advice on what to expect. Thankyou

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I think a little bit of the blame here should rest with ebay and also the seller. From what I can gather, this was a camera that did have faults so it wasn't fully as described. A partial refund on the part of the seller might have been a reasonable response, although whether $150 was OTT I don't know. But a partial refund of a negotiated amount may have stopped this problem before it even happened.

And then ebay. It seems the buyer added in comment box that they wished to keep the camera and drop the claim. Now ebay seems to have a very automated system because precisely no one took any notice of that message, probably no human even saw it. But what I would like to know is why the ebay system issued a refund when there was obviously no uploaded proof anywhere of the return tracking number or of the item having been returned. I have heard of this happening to sellers before and it is just wrong, in my eyes. I don't know of anywhere else where you get a refund before you return a product.

In my opinion, the seller should be contacting ebay. In a fair world, ebay would bear the brunt of the mistake, but I know this isn't always a fair world. Getting a full refund though should have set off some alarm bells for the buyer as he was getting back more than he asked for, although I can understand ebay advertises a money back guarantee and some people may take that at face value without checking terms and conditions..

I think the seller is a bit gung ho. He should first have sent a message to explain that he had had funds deducted and ask you what you wished to do- to either refund ther money immediately or return the camera asap. Then go from there.

In the circumstances, what I would do is contact the seller, explain the situation and say what you are going to do-either return the camera or refund the money. I presume refund the money would be the choice.

[janeababe]

The law is very precise.... and in saying that, technically, the camera was not and is not, stolen! 
It was sold and posted to you. You can not steal an item you bought, pd for, and had posted to you and received by you. 

Also, the local police have got better things to do than worry about a eBay sale gone haywire! I think you will find that they will just tell him to deal with it through eBay. 

That being said, you now have both the funds and the camera, so I can understand the sellers anger about this. 

You already stated that you would keep the camera and bear the costs of repair, so just take one on the chin and send the money back. 

Let the seller know, it's coming from you, and not eBay. 

good luck 😊

[swamp-stalker]

The police won't investigate as there is no criminal act, only a stuff up by ebay, if reported to the police they will advise the seller to take civil action. You may have an issue if the seller goes down this road, as they have your details and that's all that is needed to take out a small claims summons. If you have both the item and the money and you have made no attempt to rectify the situation then no doubt the court will rule in favour of the seller and there is the very real likelihood, that the seller's costs (legal, personal) will also be awarded against you.

I would start a dialogue with the seller and try to come to a reasonable agreement, sitting back and keeping both camera and money is the worst thing you could do.