on 07-01-2015 09:44 AM
This is going to be a heated argument.
A US Anti-vaccine campaigner wanting to come to Aus to give talks and some Dr's want to ban her.
This follow on from the mis representation of an anti Vacciner on a current affair show on the ABC the other night.
on 23-01-2015 01:38 PM
on 23-01-2015 02:00 PM
@secondhand-wonderland wrote:
@gleee58 wrote:I'm no health professional but I'd say it would be very uncommon for a child to die from either chicken pox or measles alone. I'd assume the child of which you speak possibly had either a compromised immune system or had contracted other infections as well as either chicken pox or measles.
That was my belief also until I learned more about the side effects of these so called harmless diseases. Measles, mumps and chicken pox all can cause serious side effects and not the child does not have to be immune compromised to be affected. The child I mentioned who died had no compromised immune system or infection. It was ruled a side effect of the disease. These side effects are the reason vaccines were introduced. Chicken pox and measles can attack the brain as well as the skin. I was working on an awareness campaign and was extremely shocked at the side effects experienced by some.
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It's not a nice topic I know but seeing as you bought it up, I have to ask, was the child that you spoke of vaccinated against chicken pox?
I'm guessing no...
No, they were not. The vaccine was not widely known about at the time. It must have been during the debate about whether to include them or not. The parents and medical staff interviewed for the project were wanting to share the information because the diseases were assumed to be harmless.
My question is - would the children with the worst side effects of the disease be the same children who might suffer a reaction to the vaccine?
I was horrified to learn that people die, go blind, have a stroke, or suffer brain damage as a result of measles or chicken pox.
on 23-01-2015 02:02 PM
I was really sad for my friend who had a perfectly normal developing child 1 day, reaching all her milestones, then, following her vaccinations, became very ill and eventually a wheelchair bound fully dependant adult. She is now 33.
I felt for my friend whose child had a similar reaction as an infant and is now a 42yo with brain damage.
Same when my sister in law's baby didn't wake up the day after he had his.
I have grandchildren who are on the autistic spectrum, no idea if it was caused by vaccines...................their parents are unsure as we don't know the cause as yet.
We chose on doctors advice, what vaccines our children had and didn't have as 3 of them had serious reactions. My youngest son was hospitalised after having chicken pox vaccination. His children had no reactions to theirs.
We don't know............. so we make the best choices that we can with what we have.
I intensley dislike the "better a live child with autism than ....."etc................ I know people who have children with severe autism and I can guarantee that 9 days out of 10, they would not choose autism.
Why are they scared to listen to her?
on 23-01-2015 02:04 PM
@lyne-flyn wrote:
My aunt got encephalitis as a complication of chickenpox...she was left with severe brain damage as a result. She is now 80 years old and it is so sad to see how her life was ruined because there were no vaccinations when she was a child.
I bet she would be advocating for vaccination if she had her life over.
One of the reasons the people I mentioned spoke out is because of the new wave of chicken pox parties that were doing the rounds at the time. The other reason was that when children presented to emergency depts with the illness or injury caused by the disease the cause was not recognized in time because the staff weren't aware of the side effects at most hospitals.
on 23-01-2015 02:08 PM
I was leaning towards the anti vaccine approach until I was involved with the project mentioned. The research I did convinced me that there was more reason for than against. A friend who is a health care professional watched her child admitted to hospital with osteomylitis after a vaccination and she still believes vaccination is safer than not vaccinating.
on 23-01-2015 02:26 PM
on 23-01-2015 02:26 PM
on 23-01-2015 02:32 PM
@gleee58 wrote:
@secondhand-wonderland wrote:
@gleee58 wrote:I'm no health professional but I'd say it would be very uncommon for a child to die from either chicken pox or measles alone. I'd assume the child of which you speak possibly had either a compromised immune system or had contracted other infections as well as either chicken pox or measles.
That was my belief also until I learned more about the side effects of these so called harmless diseases. Measles, mumps and chicken pox all can cause serious side effects and not the child does not have to be immune compromised to be affected. The child I mentioned who died had no compromised immune system or infection. It was ruled a side effect of the disease. These side effects are the reason vaccines were introduced. Chicken pox and measles can attack the brain as well as the skin. I was working on an awareness campaign and was extremely shocked at the side effects experienced by some.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
It's not a nice topic I know but seeing as you bought it up, I have to ask, was the child that you spoke of vaccinated against chicken pox?
I'm guessing no...
No, they were not. The vaccine was not widely known about at the time. It must have been during the debate about whether to include them or not. The parents and medical staff interviewed for the project were wanting to share the information because the diseases were assumed to be harmless.
My question is - would the children with the worst side effects of the disease be the same children who might suffer a reaction to the vaccine?
I was horrified to learn that people die, go blind, have a stroke, or suffer brain damage as a result of measles or chicken pox.
Well as far as I know people can have their blood screened prior to having a vaccination to determine their level of risk. It is a good question though.
How many people though? I guess my question is do more people suffer serious side effects from those diseases compared with those that suffer adverse events following the immunisation to prevent those diseases?
on 23-01-2015 02:47 PM
@secondhand-wonderland wrote:
@gleee58 wrote:Thanks, sure is a good question.
I know someone who lost a child to either measles or chicken pox, can't remember which. I just remember the shock of hearing about the death caused by what we thought were harmless diseases that all kids got.
I'd rather a living child with autism than a dead child.
I'm no health professional but I'd say it would be very uncommon for a child to die from either chicken pox or measles alone. I'd assume the child of which you speak possibly had either a compromised immune system or had contracted other infections as well as either chicken pox or measles.
The chicken pox vaccination always has me a bit baffled because everyone I know that has had the immunisation has still contracted chicken pox at least once in their life. Most commonly when they are young children, yet schools still want to administer it again when children are in year 7. Why would you need to get a vaccination for something you have already had, and have built up an immunity for?
I'd rather a compulsory screening test that determines the level of risk to an individual which can be conducted before a series of vaccinations. If you or one of your family members were at a higher risk you would want to know. One size does not fit all when it comes to pharmacuticals.
How do you think the people that do have vaccine damaged children (and there are a lot of them these days) feel when people in the HCI fob them off when they say that their child was a perfectly normal, developing child one day and due to the adverse event following the immunisation their child is no longer the same. Children have been known to stop talking, convert back to crawling, cry and scream for days on end, high fevers for days on end, lose eye contact and any desire for physical contact.
And just as a disclaimer for the link I'm about to post, I neither agree nor disagree but I recieved an email recently introducing me to the movement #hearthiswell it's parents from all over the world who believe they have vaccine damaged children:
http://www.nextworldhealthtv.com/page/27480.html (they are short 1 minute videos that play one after the other)
Measles is a serious and highly contagious viral disease which causes fever, runny nose, cough and sore red eyes, followed by a rash. Measles can sometimes lead to dangerous complications such as pneumonia. About one person in 1,000 who contracts measles will develop inflammation of the brain. For every 10 children who become affected in this way, one will die and many will have permanent brain damage. Measles still causes deaths in Australia. A rare condition called SSPE can develop several years after a measles infection. SSPE rapidly destroys the brain and is always fatal.
Measles can be caught through coughs and sneezes from an infected person before that person realises they are sick.
http://www.health.vic.gov.au/immunisation/factsheets/mmr.htm
There were 4 deaths from varicella in Australia between 2003 and 2005.
http://www.myvmc.com/diseases/chicken-pox-varicella-zoster-virus/
Measles, a viral respiratory infection, killed over 500,000 children in 2003, more than any other vaccine-preventable disease. The measles death toll in Africa is so high – every minute one child dies – that many mothers don't give children real names until they have survived the disease. Measles weakens the immune system and renders children very susceptible to fatal complications from diarrhoea, pneumonia and malnutrition. Those that survive may suffer blindness, deafness or brain damage.
on 23-01-2015 02:48 PM
I was reading this website the other day. They are compiling a register of polio survivors in Australia.
http://www.polioaustralia.org.au/australian-polio-history/
It has loads of interesting information about the history of polio in Australia. Apparently between the 1930's and 1960's 40,000 people contracted 'paralytic' polio, that represents only 1% of everyone who caught the disease meaning that 4 million people in Australia had polio over the course of just a few decades I think based on the percentages given, 4000 of them would have died.
The survivors are now experiencing ongoing symptoms later in their lives.