Anyone remember the Folbigg case?

Was a while ago. Kathleen Folbigg was sent to gaol for life for murdering her 4 babies over a 10 year span. They all died of suffocation or undetermined causes.


 


I recall the case well. She was convicted on the basis of her diary entries where she 'admitted' she felt responsible for the deaths of her babies and she felt she wasn't good enough as a mother. She also wrote about her awful relationship with her husband - he used to call her fat, he played around and she was terrified he was going to leave her.


 


He is the one who found her diary and handed it over to the police with an accusation of murder.


 


She has always said she was innocent and has appealed the case a few times. Now she has forensics experts agreeing with her.


 


Who knows what's true. But it will be interesting to see where this ends up.


 


ONE of Australia's top forensic law authorities believes the convicted child killer Kathleen Folbigg would walk free from jail if granted a retrial today - because of inaccurate evidence presented at her original trial.


Gary Edmond, a legal expert in forensic science at the University of NSW, believes a recent review of case material demonstrates that Folbigg's trial was tainted by unreliable, misleading and now outdated medical evidence.


 


''It is quite likely that experts provided evidence at the trial which they might not give today - and this needs to be reconsidered because you can't have someone remain in jail just because they were prosecuted at a particular point in time … especially if the science has moved on,'' he said.


 


''In the past few years, there have been startling revelations about problems across forensic science and medicine which should give us even more pause for what has gone in the past, particularly in controversial areas.''


 


Folbigg is serving a reduced sentence of 25 years after she was convicted in 2003 of murdering her children Patrick, eight months, Sarah, 10 months, and Laura, 19 months, between 1991 and 1999, and the 1989 manslaughter of her son Caleb, aged 19 days. While the causes of death were never determined, a picture emerged during the trial of an emotionally fragile mother with a personality disorder - whose damaging diary entries were interpreted as literal admissions of guilt.


 


But Folbigg has always maintained her innocence and Professor Edmond argues that with no scientific evidence proving any of her babies were murdered, the diary extracts alone are ''insufficient'' to keep her in jail, adding: ''They add verse but, you also have to say, they're pretty ambiguous.''


 


Once, four infant deaths in the same family automatically pointed to murder but as the legal academic Emma Cunliffe has demonstrated through six years of extensive research, that is no longer the case.


Doctor Cunliffe has written to the NSW Attorney-General, Greg Smith, attacking the medical research presented at Folbigg's trial as incomplete and misleading.


 


Dr Cunliffe cites at least eight similar cases worldwide in which mothers, in recent years, have been accused of infant murders - many of them multiple crimes. They include the Melbourne woman Carol Louise Matthey, who was charged in 2005 with smothering four children over five years. ''All the other women subjected to that form of prosecution have either been acquitted by courts of appeal or have had the evidence against them excluded by judgment,'' Dr Cunliffe said. ''Folbigg is the last one standing.''


Dr Cunliffe and Professor Edmond are not the only voices calling on Mr Smith to reopen the case. Professor John Hilton, who conducted the autopsy on Folbigg's second child, Sarah, in 1993, agrees a review is ''warranted''.


 


Professor Hilton, who was called by the prosecution as a witness in the Folbigg trial, said: ''We live in a changing world. Medicine and science never stand still - they progress. Now obviously, I sit on the medical and scientific side of all this … but it seems to me the conviction stood, or was based on, the diaries … which were open to multiple interpretations.''


 


He added: ''If you read the court transcripts, you will see that my evidence was hardly favourable to the prosecution's case.''


 


He added: ''While homicide was a possibility, there was no pathology evidence to support it.''


Of Folbigg's diary extracts, Professor Cordner said: ''It is well recognised that self-blame is a common response to infant death.''


 


While all of Folbigg's legal avenues have been technically exhausted, a spokeswoman for the Attorney-General confirmed on Saturday an application for review can be lodged under the Crimes (Appeal and Review) Act 2001.


 


How the case against a mother unfolded


 


FEBRUARY 19, 1989 Caleb dies; aged 19 days. Originally thought to have died of Sudden Infant Death Syndrome. Now deemed to have died of suffocation.


 


FEBRUARY 13, 1991 Patrick dies, aged eight months. Originally believed to have died of a blockage of the airways due to an epileptic fit. Now deemed have died of suffocation.


 


AUGUST 30, 1993 Sarah dies, aged 10 months. Originally thought to have died of SIDS. Now deemed to have died of suffocation.


MARCH 1, 1999 Laura dies, aged 19 months. Cause of death not determined.


 


APRIL 19, 2001 Kathleen Folbigg is arrested at home after a two-year police investigation.


 


MAY 21, 2003 Found guilty of murdering Patrick, Sarah and Laura and of the manslaughter of Caleb; found to have inflicted grievous bodily harm on Patrick in 1990.


 


OCTOBER 24, 2003 Sentenced to 40 years' jail with a non-parole period of 30 years.


 


FEBRUARY 17, 2005 Sentence reduced by 10 years and her non-parole period by five years. Appeal against sentence dismissed.


 


DECEMBER 21, 2007 Loses a second appeal in the NSW Supreme Court. Will be eligible for release in 2028, at age 61.



Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/new-science-would-let-folbigg-go-free-20130202-2dr7y.html#ixzz2JmMij2Ic


 


 

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Anyone remember the Folbigg case?


one wonders  why she went on havin more babies? after 2 deaths, I wouldn't have been able to face it once more:_|



 


Or if a person like that who couldn't cope with babies.. their constant need for attention, the crying, having to give up their own life (unable to just get up and go out when you please when have a baby/child)  etc and did kill 2 of them, why would they want more of the same?

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Anyone remember the Folbigg case?


 


Or if a person like that who couldn't cope with babies.. their constant need for attention, the crying, having to give up their own life (unable to just get up and go out when you please when have a baby/child)  etc and did kill 2 of them, why would they want more of the same?



 


She was ill, and ill people do not make sound choices.

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Anyone remember the Folbigg case?

Or if a person like that who couldn't cope with babies.. their constant need for attention, the crying, having to give up their own life (unable to just get up and go out when you please when have a baby/child)  etc and did kill 2 of them, why would they want more of the same?


 


I'm not sure that is fair.


 


We only know this through her diaries. The candor with which you would pour your thoughts into a diary are a reflection of your thoughts at that given moment. Her notes in the diary range from negative to positive within sentences. She was simply putting thoughts on paper without analysing them. Anyone who keeps an intensive diary like this would understand that your thought processes often have little to do with reality and your words are often affected by other things - arguments with husband, lack of sleep, too much wine, reflecting on your past or thinking about your future etc.


 


The other thing that is fairly obvious now and it has been mentioned in some news articles is that she was suffering from depression. 


 

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Anyone remember the Folbigg case?

OMG


 


This was a lawyer's question to the ME


 


"Q. Do you agree that she died from a cessation of breathing?


A. Yes."


 


Between that and cardiac arrest - I'm dumfounded.


 


I mean, once you stop breathing (and don't resume), you die.


 


and every death is the result of cardiac arrest isn't it? i.e - if the heart stops beating, you die....


Some people can go their whole lives and never really live for a single minute.
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Anyone remember the Folbigg case?

Or if a person like that who couldn't cope with babies.. their constant need for attention, the crying, having to give up their own life (unable to just get up and go out when you please when have a baby/child)  etc and did kill 2 of them, why would they want more of the same?


 


...I'm not sure that is fair.


 


...She was ill, and ill people do not make sound choices.


 


Fair comments. My response was mainly to Gill's post... why put yourself through that 4 time s (whether the babies died of natural causes or by murder/manslaughter)?


 


Her foster sister and others that knew her, tell of her short fuse etc.

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Anyone remember the Folbigg case?

NSWCCA 23 (17 February 2005)


http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/cases/nsw/NSWCCA/2005/23.html


 


Was the 2003 case an appeal to  reduce  the length of the sentence?


 


and the 2005 case an wanting Special Leave to Appeal due to a miscarriage of justice?



 


 


The 2003 case is the sentencing


 


The 2005 case was about appealing the length of the initial sentence handed down


 


Some people can go their whole lives and never really live for a single minute.
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Anyone remember the Folbigg case?


 


Or if a person like that who couldn't cope with babies.. their constant need for attention, the crying, having to give up their own life (unable to just get up and go out when you please when have a baby/child)  etc and did kill 2 of them, why would they want more of the same?



 


Having read her diary entries, it seems there were numerous entries where she was afraid that her husband would leave her and she would be left alone.


 


I'm pretty sure that I've heard of people having babies in the hope of keeping a marriage together.


Some people can go their whole lives and never really live for a single minute.
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Anyone remember the Folbigg case?


 


Agreed, the mother knows.


 


Not commenting on guilt or not, but she certainly had a very bad childhood. In her diary she laments the loss of having any family - parents,siblings of her own that would care about her.


 


On 8 January 1969, Folbigg's biological father, Thomas John Britton, murdered her mother, also named Kathleen, by stabbing her 24 times. Following her father's arrest on the day after the murder, Folbigg was made a ward of the state and placed into foster care with a couple.



On 18 July 1970, Folbigg was removed from the care of the foster couple and placed into Bidura Children's Home.



In September 1970, Folbigg moved into the home of Mr and Mrs Marlborough, a couple who also provided foster care and expressed a desire to adopt Folbigg. While living there she was treated, particularly by Diedre Marlborough as a slave and not allowed to spend time with friends often.


 


She was not told of her mother's murder by her father until 1984, in fact she was not told that she had always been a ward of the state, always believing she had been adopted by the Marlborough's.


 


Kathleen completed her Trial HSC in 1985 at Kotara High School, until life at home became unbearable and she was forced to leave home and school, finding work and then met Craig Gibson Folbigg in 1985. The pair formed a relationship and bought a home in the north-western Newcastle, New South Wales suburb of Mayfield in May 1987. They married in September that same year.


 



 


So, abused by her father etc.... placed in a foster home where they couldn't cope with a 2 yo???  then placed in another where she was treated like a slave....I can't imagine a 2 to 3 yo that would not react to being loved in a positive way, especially an abused one.


 


I put a lot of weight on her foster sister not supporting her innocence after the trial but now, I am thinking I was wrong, given the childhood she has had.


 

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Anyone remember the Folbigg case?

I recall reading a book on this quite a few years ago, she was a very strange woman always wanting the attention on herself - does that mean she is a killer?  Maybe not but I always believed she was guilty and I still do. 

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Anyone remember the Folbigg case?

diary entries:


 


Some entries spoke specifically about her treatment of her children: I feel like the worst mother on this earth. Scared that she [Laura] will leave me now. Like Sarah did. I knew I was short-tempered and cruel sometimes to her and she left. With a bit of help.


 


She's a fairly good-natured baby - thank goodness, it has saved her from the fate of her siblings. I'm sure she's met everyone and they've told her, don't be a bad or sickly kid, mum may, you know, crack. They've warned her - good.


Other entries showed some remorse: My guilt of how responsible I feel for them all, haunts me, my fear of it happening again, haunts me.


When I think I'm going to lose control like last time I'll just hand baby over to someone else ... This time I'm prepared and know what signals to watch out for in myself. Changes in mood etc

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