Burqa 'confronting', says Tony Abbott.

[i-need-a-martini]

OMG!

And most of the country thinks this numbskull is suitable PM material??

And if that isn't bad enough when asked about Mr Kings proposed radical new policing system in which criminal suspects (only suspects mibnd you. Which i think means all Muslims in Mr Kings world)  would be injected with satellite trackable micro chips shot from a "high powered sniper rifle" his response was:

"I'm just not going to get into the micro-detail of policing," Mr Abbott said.

Micro detail? That is policing? How about "I'm not going to comment on what is obviously a ridiculous statement by King"? That would have been a more appropriate response Mr Abbott.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/federal-election-2013/burqa-confronting-says-tony-abbott-as-h...

[**meep**]

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@para-sights wrote:

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@**freethinker_bob** wrote:

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Pay attention this time. I'm referring to covering our whole face to interact with one another in a friendly manner. It doesn't happen anywhere in our evolutinary history.  Are you comparing wearing make up to covering the entire face???? 

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Isn't it happening now, we can't see ANYONE on here that we are interacting with LOL

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yes, everyone has always been very friendly, polite and respectful towards each other. 

[para-sights]

LOL. I agree that facial recognition plays a great percentage in non verbal communication but the voice plays and awful lot too. My Aunty who was blind due to an accident before I was born could always tell my mood by my voice, even if I tried to fake it LOL

[i-need-a-martini]

As I said, I don't know why a woman would wear a burqa. Religion? Culture? Oppression? Freedom? Tradition? Who knows.

But in regards to interaction, perhaps the interaction with the average stranger they pass on the street is of little importance to them in comparison to how they interact with their families and close circle. How different is that to our interaction with strangers we pass on the street? Do we say hello to every person we pass every day? Do we even look at every stranger we pass? Of course not. We interact with those we know or have a connection to. 

And we seem to forget that these women do not wear their burqas at home and in their own environments - they take them off at the hairdressers, in clothes shops etc. It is not a full time garment. It doesn't stop women from interacting with those around her. It just stops YOU and I fro interacting with her unless we know her.

So of course interaction is difficult. It's even difficult sometimes when I see my neighbours across the road in hijabs - I often joke that I have to wave hello to any woman I see in their front yard cause I have no idea if I am waving to my friends or some other random relative wearing a hijab cause I can't see them under all that fabric. 

But lack of interaction is not oppression and interaction doesn't always rely on seeing someones face.

[crystal-gems]

It wasn't so long ago when women covered their hair when going to church.....it was expected that they wore a hat.

[nevynreally]

Lovely post.

And entirely irrelevant. I find the full burka confronting. I have the right to. As does every other citizen of this country, opposition leader or not. Feeling this way about the burka does not make anyone racist, sexist, or any other ist. Just uncomfortable and I feel okay saying so.

[the_bob_delusion]

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@i-need-a-martini wrote:

As I said, I don't know why a woman would wear a burqa. Religion? Culture? Oppression? Freedom? Tradition? Who knows.

But in regards to interaction, perhaps the interaction with the average stranger they pass on the street is of little importance to them in comparison to how they interact with their families and close circle. How different is that to our interaction with strangers we pass on the street? Do we say hello to every person we pass every day? Do we even look at every stranger we pass? Of course not. We interact with those we know or have a connection to. 

And we seem to forget that these women do not wear their burqas at home and in their own environments - they take them off at the hairdressers, in clothes shops etc. It is not a full time garment. It doesn't stop women from interacting with those around her. It just stops YOU and I fro interacting with her unless we know her.

So of course interaction is difficult. It's even difficult sometimes when I see my neighbours across the road in hijabs - I often joke that I have to wave hello to any woman I see in their front yard cause I have no idea if I am waving to my friends or some other random relative wearing a hijab cause I can't see them under all that fabric. 

But lack of interaction is not oppression and interaction doesn't always rely on seeing someones face.

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If you want to be part of the human race, I think interaction is important.  If you don't know why a woman wears a burqa. Do some research Martini. When you do, give me a good reason  why everyone shouldn't just cover their face and why a society cannot work if everyone did it. 

[**meep**]

I have been hearing about faceless men quite a lot lately....

[i-need-a-martini]

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 If you don't know why a woman wears a burqa. Do some research Martini. 

On what bob? On why a woman wears a burqa? Didn't I give enough reason when I said Religion? Culture? Oppression? Freedom? Tradition? Who knows.

And whilst I agree that interaction is important, you can still be part of the human race if you can't interact. Aren't blind people part of the human race? They are simply interacting in a different way to the way you interact with the world.

And what is the point of saying give me a good reason  why everyone shouldn't just cover their face and why a society cannot work if everyone did it. Thats just a dumb statement because we are talking about such a miniscule minority. But I suppose if we ALL were wearing a burqa, then our society would continue but along a different route. Voice inflection and tone or gestures count for much. Look at Italy as a good example - an entire conversation can be had with hand gestures alone.

I'll also remind you that in certain regions of the world, ALL women DO wear burqas and yet those societies manage to work for them.

I think you simply applying your mode of behaviour and trying to apply it to anothers without thinking it through properly.

[acacia_pycnantha]

A burqua or niqab limits communication between people because the expressions of the eyes and/or the mouth are not visible.

Non verbal communications are very important and it may be that some people choose voluntarily to wear such garments to deliberately  limit their social interactions. I can respect their right to choose this.

What I cannot respect is cultural or religious or family or peer pressure exerted on women to adopt these forms of dress when going out in public.

I note that Saudi Arabia has recently passed laws outlawing domestic violence. it's a start and is to be applauded.

Psychological violence against women is more difficult to detect and much more difficult to enact laws against.

[*crikey*mate*]

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@i-need-a-martini wrote:

I am wondering how many people who say they find burqas confronting have actually been confronted by a woman wearing one?

Very few I imagine.

I live in a strongly muslim area and I have rarely seen a woman in a burqa. 

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I don't live in a strongly muslim area. I do see burqas occassionally, however at uni, there are a few around as well as other variations, most predominately in my commerce/business classes. I'm not sure I've noticed any in law or criminology.

In saying that, in some of my business classses was a young muslim girl. (20 by now I would say - we ended up in a few classes together over the years).

She lives at home with her parents and brother, wears clothes that don't stand out in our area and whilst not skimpy, could easily be worn to the beach. strappy dresses and tank tops kind of thing.

She has a diamond in her front tooth. Several piercings including two on her face and three tattoos.

She has a 5 pm curfew, even if there is a class that goes later or a meeting for a group assignment - she just has to miss it.

She was allowed to mix with boys at uni, but couldn't do group assignments with them.

If she has not married a boy of her choice by 25, her father will find someone for her to marry.

Apparently she is supposed to find herself a husband at uni.

At 18 her father grounded her, took her car keys off her and thus prevented her from attending uni that week. She willingly accepted that that was her punishment for being late in picking her younger brother up from school.