Linking Hijab to Oppression of Women

[***super_nova***]

Only 44seconds video

The Problem of Linking Hijab to Oppression of Women

[***super_nova***]

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@*julia*2010 wrote:

imagine being required to  cover 

your hair, neck, arms and legs not

only in church but everytime you're

outside of your home or having to 

cover up when you answer your door.

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But then again sometimes requirement to cover might not be such a bad idea

https://www.facebook.com/Vlasto1960/photos/a.928655590549592.1073741897.328294883919002/928655643882...

[the_great_she_elephant]

I wonder if the front view is any better.

[***super_nova***]

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@icyfroth wrote:

If you went to a country where you had to wear head to toe covering would you feel opressed.

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When i am in country where everybody is covered I would feel very uncomfortable not to follow the local custom.  I have no problem covering up. 

[raptor_rebooted]

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@the_great_she_elephant wrote:

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@*julia*2010 wrote:

Do I look back now and realise that it actually was a form of oppression. Yes.

exactly.

imagine being required to  cover 

your hair, neck, arms and legs not

only in church but everytime you're

outside of your home or having to 

cover up when you answer your door.

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That's my whole point, Icy. You can imagine it. specifically you can imagine how you would feel if you had to do it. that doesn't qualify you to project your feelings onto those who are doing it?

Do you know any Muslim women?

Have you ever asked them how they feel about wearing the hijab? 

Because until you have you are not qualified to speak on their behalf.

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your point was that you realised having

to cover your head in church was a form

of oppression.  now, imagine being required

to not only cover your head but your whole

body except face and hands and not only

in church but everywhere in the presence of

unrelated males.  

Do you know any Muslim women?

yes i do. (some from work, some through

friends)

Have you ever asked them how they feel about wearing the hijab? 

yes, i have.

i have spoken to quite a few who 

feel they are not required to but choose

to and to some who feel its their religious

obligation; no different to how you now feel

about the oppressed church going women.

 Because until you have you are not qualified to speak on their behalf.

well, i have so i am. 

[raptor_rebooted]

and this is why sometimes its not

a  choice:

Is there a punishment for not wearing hijab?

The Qur’an does not clearly state that there is a penalty for not wearing hijab. But according to some Hadiths, the Prophet had said that if a Muslim woman refuses to follow the Islamic code of dressing, her place in paradise (together with her father, husband, and son’s place) is jeopardized.

Are some Muslim women forced to wear hijab?

For the majority of Muslim women, wearing hijab is a choice; it is part of their personality and their identity. But in some instances, they are required to wear it in public places. Some Arab countries like Saudi Arabia, for example, require women to wear hijab to cover their body. Also, Muslim families usually require their women to follow the code of Islamic dressing. The head of the family has the responsibility of ensuring that Islamic teachings are implemented in the family. With this in view he might compel his wife, sisters or daughters to observe hijab. Such a compulsion is similar to people being compelled to follow rules for their own safety, for a proper organization of society and the well-being of the whole society.

http://www.hilalplaza.com/hijab/punishment-for-not-wearing-hijab.htm

[***super_nova***]

Should you feel oppressed when you go to school, which requires students to wear uniform?  How about restaurants requiring dress/footwear code?  Remember when beach inspectors used to walk around beaches measuring bikinis?  Even now although our dress code has never been so lax, we do have a dress code.  Most workplaces  have some sort of dress code.  Try to walk down the street topless.

[raptor_rebooted]

Should you feel oppressed when you go to school, which requires students to wear uniform? 

hijab is not the same as school

uniform.  there are girls who are

required to wear a hijab to school

but not all are allowed to take it 

off outside of school.  yes, i would

feel opressed if i was pressured to 

wear it all the time.

[the_great_she_elephant]

Have you ever asked them how they feel about wearing the hijab? 

yes, i have.

i have spoken to quite a few who 

feel they are not required to but choose

to and to some who feel its their religious

obligation; no different to how you now feel

about the oppressed church going women.

Wrong. It is no different to the way  I used to feel when I was attending church and wearing a head covering. i.e I didn't feel oppressed.

 Did any of the Muslim women who told you they wear the jihab as a religious obligation, tell you it made them feel oppressed?

Also I never  suggested that women who cover their heads in church (as some still do) are being oppressed. I said only that, on looking back, I felt that I had been oppressed -  my  feelings,  relevant only to myself. I do not pretend to know how those other women feel, nor would I presume  to tell them how I think they are supposed to feel.

[raptor_rebooted]

Also I never  suggested that women who cover their heads in church (as some still do) are being oppressed. I said only that, on looking back, I felt that Ihad been oppressed -  my  feelings,  relevant only to myself.

your comment came across 

as more general than that.

Do I look back now and realise that it actually was a form of oppression. Yes.

what made you realise it was 

a form of oppression?

[the_great_she_elephant]

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@*julia*2010 wrote:

Also I never  suggested that women who cover their heads in church (as some still do) are being oppressed. I said only that, on looking back, I felt that Ihad been oppressed -  my  feelings,  relevant only to myself.

your comment came across 

as more general than that.

Do I look back now and realise that it actually was a form of oppression. Yes.

what made you realise it was 

a form of oppression?

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It wasn't just the headcovering. It went right back to the concept of original sin.: that Eve tempted Adam, and he was weak and because of this the human race was banished from paradise and Christ had to be born and suffer in order to redeem us. Eve (woman) was the temptress and Adam (man) was weak, and therefore likely to be led astray. And because men were weak and women were designed to be attractive to them it was up to women to conceal those attractions. It's a lot more complicated than that but that's the basics of it  - very similar to Muslim philosophy, really. Once I stopped believing in God (or even before that if I am honest) I realised how absurd it all was.

I doubt whether most churchgoing women who still wear a hat or veil, even give any thought to why they do it - it's just an ingrained tradition - a superstition, I supppose -  a bit like touching wood or not walking under ladders or believing that commenting Amen and sharing  a FB picture of a sick child will help it get better.

My personal belief is that religion generally and the Muslim faith and Caholic church in particular do discriminate against women (oppress them, if you like.) but I also believe that if women are happy to accept the constraints of those faiths and those prqctices do not contravine Australian Law or impinge on my right to live my life the way I choose, then it is not my job to convert them to my way of thinking..

I amay be an Atheist, but I am not a richard Dawkins - who believes teaching religion to children is a form of child abuse.