on โ19-11-2013 03:59 PM
Should Tony Abbott apologise for the Labor parties phone tapping when Rudd was PM ?
Or should KRudd stand up and apologise for what happened under his leadership ?
Aparently most countries participate in phone tapping and if the Indonesian government is upset and want to take it furtther then withdraw tthe aid Australa gives Indonesia and encourage people to stop holidaying there, that would give them something to think about. Typical bluff tactics from the Indonesians. I am not condoning the practise but they are getting a bit to precious over the whole thing.
โ20-11-2013 12:37 PM - edited โ20-11-2013 12:37 PM
@izabsmiling wrote:
@9brumbies wrote:No Tony Abbott should not apologise for what Rudd and Labor did.
If he isn't up to the Job of being a Prime Minister and doing what they do
He should stand aside.
What does that mean? That he should apologise? Bill Shorten would disagree with you. If that was what you meant.
edit typo
on โ20-11-2013 01:23 PM
TH: " Why? they have been monitoring private calls and people for a long time now, no one in immune to it. your ph calls are as private as talking in a food court through the PA system"
Exactly TH, and your terminology is right "monitoring private calls" but I would prefer "monitoring personal calls "
Being my usual pedantic self I wish people/media would use the correct terms, "tapping" stemmed from the old wired switchboards and is a physical electrical connection, (a tap). TH rightly uses monitoring which involves real time continuous listening (auto/manual) of a specific source, whilst similar to that is interception which is criteria based automatically triggered monitoring, such as recording a message containing the word "bomb" . There is also external hacking of voicemail recordings or recorded phone conversations.
Tapping
Monitoring
Intercepting
Hacking
Take your (correct) pick, but anyone who thinks using a standard mobile phone (broadcasting at large) is private are technically naive, likewise the Internet is not secure either.
nษฅยบษพ
on โ20-11-2013 01:48 PM
Yes John you are correct it is personal calls, I only used the term private because its what people believe they are only between them and the person they are talking to.
add emails, chat rooms, forums and SMS to the list of things that are monitored.
on โ20-11-2013 01:49 PM
on โ20-11-2013 01:54 PM
what you believe and what actualy happens are not the same thing.
on โ21-11-2013 09:50 AM
The public assumption is that listening to conversations was involved.Was it that or monitoring received and sent calls?Which apparently can or does happen to all of us.Yet when I wanted to trace phone calls I received and had the number blocked my telephone company required me to request my phone to be monitored and then for me to write down times I received the problem calls. At first when I read about his wife phone I didn't consider that she too is quite political in her own right.
When you look into it is a tricky situation..like most things political open to manipulation and public interpretation if desired.
Election time soon in Indonesia also?
Did the issue become public one around the same time that there were stand offs on returning boats?
Also relevant perhaps is that we aren't the only Country who is part of the 5eyes.Do we need to consult the other Countries in any way?
Very High level diplomacy required imo.
people like the one below and their offensive tweets wouldn't help matters
Abusive tweets from top Liberal Party pollster
As the government sought to limit damage from the phone-tapping affair, a Liberal Party senior adviser issued a series of racially-loaded remarks about top Indonesian government figures, which have been reported prominently in the Indonesian press.
The Liberal Party pollster, who is a close counsel to Prime Minister Tony Abbott, made the front page of one of Indonesia's most prominent media outlets, the Indonesian-language Kompas newspaper for his series of abusive comments, with one likening Indonesian Foreign Affairs Minister Marty Natalegawa to a ''1970s Pilipino [sic] porn star''.
on โ21-11-2013 09:55 AM
Marciano Norman, the head of Indonesia's BIN agency, said the State Intelligence Office had communicated directly with the Australian intelligence officials, who said, "that now and in the future it will not happen again," Mr Marciano said.
on โ21-11-2013 03:51 PM
You know what I don't get?
Is why Indonesia are wanting an apology at all.
We tapped their phones.
We did it on purpose.
We believed we had good reason to do so.
We got caught.
But we are only sorry that we got caught, not that we did it.
To say sorry that we did it would be wrong.
If what we did has consequences, then so be it and may we face whatever laws, penalties and repercussions that we need to. But to say sorry when we really aren't?
The only thing we are sorry for is that we got caught doing it.
on โ21-11-2013 04:32 PM
on โ21-11-2013 04:35 PM