Pauline Hanson calls for ban on Muslim immigration

[davidc4430]

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-09-14/politics-blog-september-14/7842756

Does she not realise the muslims are here after hearing of us being over run by asians, they have come to throw the asians out of australia!

isnt that what she wanted last time she was in parliment?

just can't please some people, sheeesh!

[lyndal1838]

Only one??

[johcaschro]

Speaking of ball games;

Thousands of Saudis sign petition to end male guardianship of women

"Protest movement seeks to end Saudi Arabia law requiring women have permission of a male guardian to travel, marry or do other fundamental tasks"

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/sep/26/saudi-arabia-protest-petition-end-guardianship-law-wom...

Male guardianship of women, as if they were infantile and unable to make their own free choices and must be protected, for their own good, you understand?

The state of and for women in an Islamic theocracy where Islam has had about 1500 years of free reign to manifest and to develop its true expression in unfettered and unopposed "freedom"..

That state of and for women in Islam which is signified so eloquently (?) by that hideous badge of oppression, the niqab.

(yes, I've strayed off-topc, but I have some good exemplars (above) to follow.

[johcaschro]

rein or reign? both are applicable.

[*tippy*toes*]

My brother, 6 foot white Australian with British heritage has only ever liked Asian women. He hasn't dated a huge amount of women in his 50 years, but most have been Asian. In fact, he moved to Cambodia a few years ago, learnt the langauge and is getting ready to marry the mother of his child.

By contrast, a former Middle Eastern work colleague was "evicted" from his family because he chose to fall in love and marry an Australian girl. I thought it was only women that could bring shame into a family, but he cause so much shame that his family want nothing more to do with him. Even if he divorced her, they still won't accept him back because of the shame. He was told if he attempts any contact with them, they will kill him, his wife and their 3 beautiful children.

I think it's sad that the kids will never have the joy of knowing grandparents (her parents were already gone prior to them meeting). Maybe part of the shame evolved from him being Muslim and not expecting her to convert. He was born and raised here and believes that women should be allowed to make their own choices. He is a practising Muslim, she is a practising Catholic and they have a mutual respect of each others beliefs.

It was quite sad listening to him talk about his upbringing. He was taught that westerners were evil and he should have nothing to do with them. That confused him as he was born here. He was a loner at school because he was told he wasn't allowed to be friends with anyone other than Muslims. He did end up becoming friends with a few Aussie and Asian kids, but never told his parents. He couldn't socialise with them outside of school, or mention them at all. If his parents found out he would have been beaten within an inch of his life.

His sister was subject to FGM and he was forced to watch it happen. He will never forget her blood curdling screams. His wife was considered to be a whore because she hadn't been mutilated. In their eyes, she was a whore because she "chose" to enjoy sex. His sister was to be married off to an older man when she was 8. He never said if that actually happened and we didn't ask. He did say she was locked in her room most of the time. She was their slave.....and a slave to adult male friends, from a very young age. He didn't need to elaborate. I'm guessing she probably wasn't married off as she was no longer "intact".

He heard lots of things when he was supposed to be in bed asleep. His type of upbringing was common place amongst other families that his parents socialised with. Discussions about when daughters would be "fixed" and where it would take place. Discussions about who the daughters were going to marry and when (all under the age of 10). What stories they would tell if caught to justify their actions. Sharia law being rife. People having hands cut off, eyes burnt out, beheadings. Women being dragged out into the middle of nowhere and stoned because they answered a knock on the door.

I don't know how he remained sane. I don't know how he got through it unscathed. One of the lucky few I guess. I think he's lucky that his family don't want anything to do with him. At least his children can grow up knowing what it's like to be loved and knowing what it's like to have freedom, especially his daughter.

[lind9650]

Yes tippy, and there are many, many more stories. Especially ones from young women who escaped from their families. They can't speak out for fear of being found and killed.

But -- muslims are not the only ones who seperate themselves from the people of the country they choose to live in and make their home.

I remember back 58 years ago when I came to Australia. Every italian and greek was called a Wog or Dago. the asians were Chinks and the german Krauts, even the dutch were clodhoppers etc. etc.

The odd thing about language, customs and traditions is that the generation that first migrates, hangs on to their ways tooth and nail, and wants their children to do the same. So there starts the conflict. Their children may obey because of the family influence, but their grandchildren can not identify with the old country their grandparents came from. Most likely don't even speak their language anymore They start rebelling against a generatin that lives in the past.

I came to this little country town 46 years ago. One third of the towns population was Italian. I soon found that most of the older women did not speak english. They either had a husband or School child in tow to interpret for them. Then it dawned on me that no italian women joined any womens clubs like CWA, Arts and Crafts group or Mothers Club at School. Naturally all their children went to Catholic School, but even there was a lack of italian mothers present.

My then husband was foreman on the Shire and socialised with the italian workers. All very nice people. One day when two of the men were visiting with my husband I asked them why their wifes never joined the womens clubs. The answer stunned me. "If we allow our women to mingle with Australians, they may get funny ideas and start giving us trouble. They are better off at home where they belong."

Now. 45 years later their grandchildren mingle with everyone, have married people of different religion and background. Nothing ever stays the same, only the old italan women in this town still don't speak english.

Integration is the main problem with most migrants and the Government does not help by settling people in communitie of the same nationalities. There they gather like a flock of frightened chickens and don't spread their wings.

Before I left Europe my father told me, "You are going to a new country that is different to what you know. You have to learn a new language, new customs and laws. You will have to change your thinking and adapt if you want to be accepted as one of them."

I think I did my best and am proud to be Australian. It was not always easy, but when in Rome, do as the Romans do. So the old saying goes.

It should say,"When in Australiia, do as the Australians do."

Erica.

[johcaschro]

But the real issue is not so much about race as it is about religion and the cultural ideas and values and practices which go with it.

Historically, in Australia we have never had any real problems generated by any particular migrant group. We don't yet have any real problem here with the Muslim migrant group (if certain incidents are generously discounted).

here's a news article from Sweden (below)

‘Migrants want Sharia law in Swedish no-go zones’

Published time: 26 Sep, 2016 17:32

"For years European authorities have denied any problem with Muslim immigration, but now crisis is exploding and is getting worse, with the number of so called “no-go” areas in Sweden rising, says Ingrid Carlqvist, editor-in-chief of Swedish newspaper Dispatch International.

A recent report suggests Swedish police are failing to control the country's suburbs following the creation of as many as 55 so-called 'no-go zones'. The police have reportedly been verbally attacked when trouble flares in the areas. A number of incidents have involved officers being pelted with stones. Vandalism, drug crime, and sexual assaults are also reported.

The Swedish public is on edge after a gunman who injured at least four people in the city of Malmo remains at large.

RT: All the risks are listed on a leaflet issued by Hungary. The pamphlet claims hundreds of completely lawless 'no-go zones' exist in Europe especially in Sweden. However, the Swedish embassy in Hungary has dismissed Budapest's claims - saying no such areas exist. Do you think these leaflets are an exaggeration?

Ingrid Carlqvist: No, it’s not. This is just semantics. The Swedish authorities don’t want to call them ‘no-go zones.’ They think that ‘no -go zones’ is place where no one can enter. But that is not what normal people mean. They mean that the ambulances can’t go there without police escort. When the police come there, they will get stoned and people will try to set fire to police cars and so on. They are lawless areas – and that is what people call ‘no-go zones’. No normal person would ever go inside there."

https://www.rt.com/op-edge/360675-sweden-migrants-police-zones/

I am conscious of the probability that my concerns will be mistaken for racism, but I am not a racist.

I understand that the cultural character of a country will and does evolve and change over time and I'm also conscious of the perception that Australia lags behind the rest of the world in certain areas,(trends, fashion, etc, etc.)

So is it that when we look at some European countries who are already having problems with their own Muslim populations, that their problems will be mirrored over here, given a few more years?

I hope this is not the case but I am not really encouraged by the examples seen in some other countries.

Pauline Hanson's "solution" is a simplistic and unattractive propositon and I think it stems out of a frustration that the problems of dealing with the Mulsim immigrant group presents some very special  and extremely difficult challenges.

Have I a "solution"? No.

I think the solution resides within the power of those who teach and influence the people of Muslim faith who come to this country.

Let's see what they come up with.

[peteepie]

Without commenting on what you've said, I think it's important to point out that the source of your main article is hardly objective or neutral.

The Dispatch International was created four years ago by Ingrid Cariqvist and Lars Hedegaard who describe themselves as counterjihad activists and believe that Islam is "like the nazi ideology" and that "muslims are like nazis".  They are associated with Geert Wilders and other right wing figures and organisations.  In fact it is not even a newspaper any more, only lasting one year before reverting to being a "webzine" only.  Carlqvist believes Europe is threatened by immigration from middle east and north africa, and that they have a lower IQ. 

She also claims she is not a racist.

[johcaschro]

Well, I must admit that I didn't know the background of Ingrid Cariqvist and Lars Hedegaard or of the RT news site.

However, it's important to not "shoot the messenger" when the news is delivered just because we don't like the message.

They're not alone in observing the similarities between Islam and nazi doctrines.  The late Christopher Hitchens drew a similar parallel. (you can see and hear him delivering many well-argued critiques on youtube)

It's unarguable that many cities in Europe have "no go" zones where it is just not safe for conspicuously non-Muslim people to visit.

Of course Europe is threatened by mass immigration of Muslims. Mass immigration of a people possessing profoundly different values and customs must have an effect of change on the culture of the receiving country.

The threat is a threat of change. A change to what or from what?

I have talked with many people here and on other websites about Islam, and the main thing I have noticed is that many of my interlocutors have no idea about what islam teaches or about what values it holds dear.

Christopher Hitchens argues it far better than I ever could and I recommend to you to view and to hear some of his discussions.

You do understand that people from many racial backgrounds are Muslim. it's a bit tiresome to have to reiterate that any system of doctrinal belief which  a person can join or voluntraily subscribe to or commit to or apostasise from and leave, is not a race.

Islam is not a warm and fuzzy alternative (to christianity) religion; it is something rather different.

It is a complete religio-political doctrine which holds as one of its essential tenets that Religion and the State cannot ever be separate and independant entities. That alone should condemn it even if one ignores another; that women are less than the equals of men and bear the responsibility for inflaming such passions in men that the women should (must) cover themselves and even their faces, effectively reducing their right to be individuals and instead forcing on them some anonymous status as personally unidentifiable 2nd class citizen; Woman.

[peteepie]

Au contraire...it is important to shoot the messenger if he is presented as an unbiased authority when clearly he is not.  You obviously have an agenda; I suggest you back it up with authoritative articles in future instead of the usual far right twaddle.

[johcaschro]

Well, as I said, I was unaware of any possible bias by the authors I quoted or of any of the RT news site.

However, here are two articles from reputable news sites which I hope meet with your approval:

" A 120-page research paper entitled "No-Go Zones in the French Republic: Myth or Reality?" documented dozens of French neighborhoods "where police and gendarmerie cannot enforce the Republican order or even enter without risking confrontation, projectiles, or even fatal shootings."

In October 2011, a 2,200-page report, "Banlieue de la République" (Suburbs of the Republic) found that Seine-Saint-Denis and other Parisian suburbs are becoming "separate Islamic societies" cut off from the French state and where Islamic Sharia law is rapidly displacing French civil law.

The report also showed how the problem is being exacerbated by radical Muslim preachers who are promoting the social marginalization of Muslim immigrants in order to create a parallel Muslim society in France that is ruled by Sharia law.

The television presenter asks: "What if we went to the suburbs?" Obertone replies: "I do not recommend this. Not even we French dare go there anymore. But nobody talks about this in public, of course. Nor do those who claim, 'long live multiculturalism,' and 'Paris is wonderful!' dare enter the suburbs."
https://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5128/france-no-go-zones

"Whether or not Molenbeek, Rinkeby, and the Marseille slum are no-go zones, then, depends on what aspect one chooses to emphasise – their accessibility to ordinary visitors at ordinary times or their inaccessibility to government officials in times of tension. There are also no-go gradations, some places where attacks are more frequent and violent, others less so. However one sums up this complex situation – maybe partial-no-go zones? – they represent a great danger."

Daniel Pipes (DanielPipes.org, @DanielPipes) is president of the Middle East Forum.
http://www.smh.com.au/comment/muslim-nogo-zones-in-europe-20151208-gli61t.html

the same article from The Age newspaper:
http://www.theage.com.au/comment/muslim-nogo-zones-in-europe-20151208-gli61t.html

It's a bit ironic being accused of being right wing by a person who apparently supports arguably the most right wing religious philosophy  in existence (Islam) (please correct me if I am wrong about your support for it)

The religion of Islam  shares many of the characteristics  of the political philosophy of Totalitarianism, a political leaning of the extreme far right.

If I have any "agenda", it is to encourage  people to a deeper understanding of what Islam teaches and what it and its symbols represents, and if that's a bit uncomfortable for people who   have formed an opinion in blissful ignorance of what they offer support for and who would rather believe it is only  an innocuous alternative religion which has suffered some bad press lately, well that's too bad.