Not allowed to leave HONEST feedback for buyers who default - WHY??

[johneltin]

I've had more than 2,550 sales and lately I've had a spate of buyers who make no contact after the sale - no payment.

I receive a FVF fee refund but this is not enough - I want justice!!

I see these buyers going on with their 100% rating and their behaviour should at least be visible to sellers.

Why keep them at 100% poistive when they have defaulted????????????

It's just NOT FAIR!!!!

[leader-of-the-band]

Normally not interested in Feedback but got a Neutral last few days with no comms from the customer and no reason just "thankyou". Only realised we no longer have the right to real feedback when I checked what feedback I had/could leave her and realised I could only leave a POS! What a joke.

not really wanting to keep an old thread going . . . . BUT . . . . if I read your post correctly you feel that having received a neutral you feel that you should now be able to respond in kind.

Now, if I have read that correctly, then that is the very reason why sellers should not be able to leave negatives or neutrals for buyers.  Retaliatory feedback is wrong.

If you want to hurt these buyers then do the non-paying buyer thing.  That way they will not be able to buy anything from sellers who have their blocks in place if they get two non-paying strikes in 12 months.

[leader-of-the-band]

If you want to hurt these buyers then do the non-paying buyer thing.  That way they will not be able to buy anything from sellers who have their blocks in place if they get two non-paying strikes in 12 months.

This bit of my post was for the OP of this old thread.

[moochgraber]

Hi Leader of the Band,

Thank you for making my point so clearly. It is not about retaliation or money or UPIs. Please re-read my original post again. Your reply is echoing eBays attitude to feedback, not mine.

I don't want to Neutral or Neg them for any sort of retaliation. That would be personal and vindictive and I agree that it does not belong on eBay. I want to warn other sellers in my community that if you deal with this buyer you too will get no communication and a neg or neutral without any reason - this is what the system was set up for (and the reason why without this, eBay has become a worse and worse place to trade. The truth is being buried under political and commercial expediency, and honesty is required to build trust as stated by its founder).

When I contacted the buyer they made no attempt to reply. This is not the sort of buyer I like to deal with or want on eBay and it will serve as a warning to them to be more thoughtful about the sellers rights and their obligations as an eBayer to give everyone a fair go. What do they learn if their rude behaviour is not outed? That it is OK to just slander a seller and there is nothing that they can be held accountable for? This just encourages behaviour that makes eBay a worse place to shop. What if everyone starts doing this just because they can? The onesided use of power has already caused many other sellers to leave to other sites and set up their own sites to the detrement of this one (though they will not own up to it).

It is more than just strikes and UPIs and fees. Feedback should be about honesty (as OP stated) and the right to tell your side of the story which is so sorely lacking here. When I see feedbacks (like mine) with thousands of transactions but with not a single N of either type, I wonder how honest can it possibly be? How can I trust a feedback system which shows everyone to be perfect all the time? For every single transaction for years on end? That is just a lie, and if I do not trust the site then I am far more hessitant to buy there.

[the3coopers]

It wasn't the good sellers like you, moochgraber, that caused the problem.

It was SHONKY sellers who made claims that Buyers negged them unfairly and without communication, when in fact that was absolute lies.

[moochgraber]

Hi the3coopers,

Yes there are shonks on both sides. As the founder states "But some people are dishonest. Or deceptive. This is true here, in the newsgroups, in the classifieds, and right next door. It's a fact of life. But here, those people can't hide. We'll drive them away. Protect others from them. This grand hope depends on your active participation. Become a registered user. Use our feedback forum. Give praise where it is due; make complaints where appropriate." That is precisely what the feedback system was meant to do before it was twisted. You notice he never mentions UPIs and money but about protecting others from fraud. I would like to ask eBay "How can you 'participate' if you can only toe the line?"

IMHO Both sides should be able to tell their side of the story, and others can make up their own minds who they believe (I personally feel there should be more room for explainations if non-Pos feedback is left for both parties, nor should the reply from one negate the rights of the other - so it should not matter in a good system who leaves it first, there should also be an option to remove or rephrase given how often things are said on the spur of the moment, at least for a time period).

This is why bad feedback (like good) drops off over time and stays relevant i.e. if used correctly the cream will rise to the top whilst the crud will drop off and out. eBay can make feedback work again and restore the trust.

Regarding Negs or Neutrals - It is no shame to admit you made a mistake, that is how we learn -  but if a seller or buyer continues to act badly then that is a symptom of something worse and must be dealt with. Ignoring it or covering it up is why bad behaviour flourishes. Pretending it is all good when it is not is why the system has failed us.

[mens_choice_ladies_lingerie]

EBAY’S FEEDBACK CONTRADICTION

Hi, look I am not the most intelligent person in the world how ever I have found exactly where your feedback terms and conditions contradict each other.

Here it is:

Buyers can leave sellers positive, neutral, or negative feedback depending on how the transaction went. Sellers can only leave buyers positive feedback.

Note Sellers can only leave positive Feedback.

Before you bid on an item, you can check the seller's Feedback Profile by clicking on the Feedback Score next to the seller's user ID. Sellers might also want to view the Feedback Profiles of bidders to see how reliable they have been in past transactions

Note:

Sellers might also want to view the feedback profile of bidders.

See the contradiction

SELLERS CANNOT LEAVE NEGATIVE FEEDBACK.

YET SELLERS MAY WANT TO VEIW FEEDBACK PROFILES OF BIDDERS?

PLEASE EXPLAIN?

[moochgraber]

I think Mens Choice is just pointing out that even eBay staff do not know how the Feedback system is supposed to work anymore and this is why their advice makes no sense. i.e.

Why bother checking useless buyer feedback?

It all goes back to the point I think we are all trying to make - that the eBay feedback system has become like an astray on a motor bike or an ejector seat on a helicopter - pretty pointless (yes I am curtailing my language for public consumption).

[freightcar2009]

Moodhgraber: yes I understand that its just he posted the same comment on 2 other threads and started his own with nothing new to add

[koalablue12]

Mens and his couple of friends are often here re-quoting, and totally misunderstanding much of what is written here, they go quiet every now and then........then just when you think it's safe to go back on  the boards.................:O.

[kopenhagen5]

I call them the underscorers. B-)               (waves to koala)