Damaged Item received - am I being reasonable ?

[nick_brun]

Hi all. I appreciate what it is to be a seller but want some objective opinions on something.

I recently bought a brand new laser engraver from Ebay where the seller explains it is shipped from my home country and they pay freight. Fair enough. But it seems pretty obvious that this unit originates from China.

When it arrived however, the thing was smashed. The 1mm steel case wash severely dented, corners creased and indicated it had been dropped form some height. After several days and outside assistance, we got it going but it seems a bit variable in operation.

Anyway, Mr seller is none too pleased that I want a brand new one (which is what I paid for). I offered to accept compensation of either spare parts or 1/3 of the price. That's been refused and he countered with $15. I am very wary of getting to a stage where pay-pal dispute is no longer an option. I have now sent the following email to him and want to know if this is reasonable (They have proposed to replace it) ?? (My pay-pal dispute period expires April 6)

To Mr seller (it might seem a little terse but understand that this is email number 20):

1)      You will need to immediately ship the replacement unit to me.

2)      The replacement unit must be received by me no later than March 30

3)      Once it has been received, I will open and inspect it for damage.

4)      The unit will need to be a brand new unit, operating 100% and not damaged in any way – which is what I paid for.

5)      I will confirm that I am happy with what has been received.

6)      You will then credit my Pay-Pal account with $AUD560 as per the above quotation.

7)      I will ship it back to China if this is where it is to be sent.

If you have an Australian shipping address, that’s fine. The same rules will apply in that I will NOT do anything until the replacement machine is here and checked. Of course, an Australian shipping address will be much cheaper for you. By way of indication alone, I recently shipped a similar item from Melbourne to Perth via TNT transport at a cost of $63.50. I expect freight the other way might be similar – but depending on your response, I will get a more accurate quote.

What does the Ebay community think ?

[kobies_costume_jewelry]

Hate to be blunt

But you have already lost any chance of paypal protection when you tried to fix it.

Its upto the buyer to send the item back to its return address at their expense

then paypal will reimburse you for the damaged item if it has not been tampered with or 

the seller will supply another one

[lyndal1838]

Take whatever compensation the seller offers you....you have voided all buyer protection via paypal by doing repairs to the item.

[green-gifts-mkd]

This is by-the-by, but on the day you received it, you should have contacted the seller straight away, straight after opening it, straight after the tracking would have shown as 'Delivered'. This would have been to let them them know about the damage and that you will be opening a PayPal dispute for Item Not as Described.

You would have needed to provide pics of the damaged item, and let PayPal decide the outcome. If they decided in your favour, you would have been provided with the official Return Address. You would have needed to pay the return postage by the recommended trackable means. This is the risk of buying high-priced items online.

I applaud you for trying to deal with the seller directly but it was probably more prudent to let PayPal decide on the outcome from the outset, with the expectation that you might need to pay for return postage in order to receive a refund of your initial payment.

[nick_brun]

Yup and thanks g-g-m. That is exactly what I did. Notified them immediatley, Pics etc. It was on the instructions of the seller to try and get it going. on that basis linda, I still believe I have a case. I think I will give them one last chance to do the 1/3 refund and then we'll let pay-pal rip. Interestingly, the listing says it ships from Australia (as a fetaure indeed) so I think any demand to ship internationally for a refund would be a misrepresentation that hopefully, Paypal will consider.

[lyndal1838]

Yes, of course the seller told you to try and get it going....knowing full well that you will not win a paypal claim if the item is not returned in the same condition in which it was sent.

Paypal also takes no notice of where the item was posted from....they will tell you to send it back to wherever the seller has stipulated in their agreement with paypal.  However, that is definitely something you can take up with paypal if it is not cost effective to send it back.

I wish you luck in a paypal claim after you have repaired an item.

[nick_brun]

Fair call. I guess PayPal will weigh up a 10 year client that's spent close to $100k and has lodged one other complaint. I know in my business I would wanna keep me happy over $200..

I shall let you know how I go.

[lyndal1838]

Please do let us know....and also let us know how many times you bash your head against a brick wall during the process.

Unfortunately, your record with paypal means very little these days.  The whole process is automated and you only get to talk with a real person when things go wrong.

I also have spent many thousands of dollars on ebay using paypal to pay, as well as large amounts of money transferred to and from the US and Canada.  I have a paypal phone number for privileged customers and you know what....it means diddly squat, except that they answer the phone very promptly.  I still have to open the standard dispute and wait the standard times for resolution.

[digital*ghost]

The issue of voiding of Buyer Protection by attempting repairs etc aside, standard practice is to return an item (if that's what the seller requests) before a replacement is sent, or a refund is issued. That's actually the seller's call to make, so you can't demand a replacement before the old one is sent back. Also, why are you asking for a replacement and $560? For the repairs? I'm almost certain that legally, if you request the cost of repairs from the seller and they do oblige, the matter is resolved. You keep the repaired item, and they don't send you a new one in addition to repair costs. 

Again, leaving the aforementioned issue aside, if it went to a PayPal dispute, the standard procedure is to return the item via trackable means at your own expense before a refund is issued. 

You are not being unreasonable in expecting to receive a working unit, or having the matter resolved after you didn't, but not all of your requests outlined in the OP would be considered reasonable (and I mean that in terms of from an objective view, which is primarily what dispute resolution processes are supposed to be - certainly not based on how much money you've contributed to PayPal's coffers). 

[amber-eyed-girl]

Lyn, on the plus side, your experience shows that forgetting where the V.I.P. number is doesn't mean a thing 🙂