Banging on and on about rights.......

[poddster]

......under what "right" are people paid to exist without doing anything for their payment.?

Is it just because they exist?

[donnashuggy]

I don't think after studying for 6 year anything falls in your lap. I don't believe they would rather live with mum and dad and stay on the dole either.

[punch*drunk]

I went to an appointment at centrelink with my sister last week. We were there for maybe 15 minutes all up. Took the woman about 1 minute to explian when my sisters youngest turns 6 she will have to start looking for work or studying. The rest of the time was spent explaining the many different ways to get exemptions from the participation requirements.

[icyfroth]

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@punch*drunk wrote:

I went to an appointment at centrelink with my sister last week. We were there for maybe 15 minutes all up. Took the woman about 1 minute to explian when my sisters youngest turns 6 she will have to start looking for work or studying. The rest of the time was spent explaining the many different ways to get exemptions from the participation requirements.

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Pretty sure you meant to have a 1 in front of the 6 there, Punchy? 

[***super_nova***]

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@chameleon54 wrote:

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The PC brigade that are jumping up and down at the suggestion that there may be a portion of social recipients who are bludging off of everybody else, seem to fail to recognise that the people most affected by the bludgers are those who genuinly need  societies support the most.

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I do not think that anybody is so naive as to believe that there are no people who do not really want to work.  But i do not believe that majority of welfare recipients come into that category.   I doubt that there are many people who are happy to be surviving on the couple of hundred $, if they could be earning more and actually have a life.    I fail to see how few "bludgers" affect those who most need support.  When there is more jobs available than people registered as unemployed then it would be another matter.  But in this moment it is not that case.  And yes kids apply for jobs they are not qualified for, they have to apply for o many jobs each week, and there is not enough advertised each week to satisfy that condition.  Especially in small town.  Fruit picking demands skill, and physical strength, and is a very hard work; it is no surprise that many kids are not up to it - but that is another story.  And in any case it is not a job, it is couple of weeks at most. 

As far as waiting for the cushy job goes, well, that is another nonsense.  The fact is that most employers do not want overqualified person.  Employers want person experienced in the type of work they need, and once they find somebody they want them to stay.  It costs to recruit.  I once did it and in that time, some 20 -25 years ago we would get 600 - 800 per ad call in.  We had a line open for 24 hours, and people would call and leave basic info on the answering machine, which got transcribed; the over and under qualified went straight into a bin, rest were invited to submit full resume, which would leave some 150 - 200 people for the one position.  Who cares if any of those few hundreds that got rejected did not really want to work?  It is totally irrelevant, the work was not there.

If somebody has a uni degree and they walk into something like KFCs asking for job, to start with they will be too old, and secondly KFC will not be interested in training them as they know they will be gone the moment they get better job.

[punch*drunk]

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@icyfroth wrote:

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@punch*drunk wrote:

I went to an appointment at centrelink with my sister last week. We were there for maybe 15 minutes all up. Took the woman about 1 minute to explian when my sisters youngest turns 6 she will have to start looking for work or studying. The rest of the time was spent explaining the many different ways to get exemptions from the participation requirements.

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Pretty sure you meant to have a 1 in front of the 6 there, Punchy? 

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lol, no my sister will be required to work or study...not the 6 yo daughter.

[donnashuggy]

My daughter is 15 and works at Target, she could get shifts every day of the week if she wanted. She's working today and tomorrow and at least 2 afternoon shifts during the week. I'm sure she is a very good worker however the age is a huge appeal to those in charge of the rosters.

[gleee58]

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@icyfroth wrote:

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@punch*drunk wrote:

I went to an appointment at centrelink with my sister last week. We were there for maybe 15 minutes all up. Took the woman about 1 minute to explian when my sisters youngest turns 6 she will have to start looking for work or studying. The rest of the time was spent explaining the many different ways to get exemptions from the participation requirements.

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Pretty sure you meant to have a 1 in front of the 6 there, Punchy? 

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why?

a comma after the 6 maybe but no 1 before it.

[chameleon54]

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@***super_nova*** wrote:

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@chameleon54 wrote:

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The PC brigade that are jumping up and down at the suggestion that there may be a portion of social recipients who are bludging off of everybody else, seem to fail to recognise that the people most affected by the bludgers are those who genuinly need  societies support the most.

---

I do not think that anybody is so naive as to believe that there are no people who do not really want to work.  But i do not believe that majority of welfare recipients come into that category.   I doubt that there are many people who are happy to be surviving on the couple of hundred $, if they could be earning more and actually have a life.    I fail to see how few "bludgers" affect those who most need support.  When there is more jobs available than people registered as unemployed then it would be another matter.  But in this moment it is not that case.  And yes kids apply for jobs they are not qualified for, they have to apply for o many jobs each week, and there is not enough advertised each week to satisfy that condition.  Especially in small town.  Fruit picking demands skill, and physical strength, and is a very hard work; it is no surprise that many kids are not up to it - but that is another story.  And in any case it is not a job, it is couple of weeks at most. 

As far as waiting for the cushy job goes, well, that is another nonsense.  The fact is that most employers do not want overqualified person.  Employers want person experienced in the type of work they need, and once they find somebody they want them to stay.  It costs to recruit.  I once did it and in that time, some 20 -25 years ago we would get 600 - 800 per ad call in.  We had a line open for 24 hours, and people would call and leave basic info on the answering machine, which got transcribed; the over and under qualified went straight into a bin, rest were invited to submit full resume, which would leave some 150 - 200 people for the one position.  Who cares if any of those few hundreds that got rejected did not really want to work?  It is totally irrelevant, the work was not there.

If somebody has a uni degree and they walk into something like KFCs asking for job, to start with they will be too old, and secondly KFC will not be interested in training them as they know they will be gone the moment they get better job.

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I agree with quite a bit of your post.

I dont think anyone has suggested that the majority of welfare recipients are bludgers and the genuine people are not what this thread is about.

The two teenagers in my family that I merntioned in my first post who are working the wine vintage are both uni students. One is taking a gap year ( a young, strong male doing physical yard work ) the other an inspiring young woman who is training to be a doctor who works the weighbridge, weekends and nights. These are genuine kids who have got off their butts and are prepared to do the casual, not really glamorous work. There are heaps of other great young people like these who are out there waitressing, working the fast food joints ( and fruit picking !!! ) etc. who ARE doing stuff to help get through uni or pay their own way when they leave. These are not the people we are disscussing in this thread.

The ones I havnt got any time for are the lazy slugs who are happier to bludge than work, taking money and services that should be available for the people who really need it. ( and no its not the majority of welfare recipients, but it appears to be a enough to clog up the system and make it a lot harder for those in genuine need to access services and funds )

[wilk1149]

I really want all welfare gone. It will make life more exciting. Trying to get money out of an ATM would be most thrilling experience. Unemployment will be eradicated in a few months. What with all the violent crime.

[chameleon54]

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@donnashuggy wrote:

I don't think after studying for 6 year anything falls in your lap. I don't believe they would rather live with mum and dad and stay on the dole either.

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I mentioned in my first post all but one of the teenagers in my extended family had found work. The one who hasnt has left school and made no attempt at all to find work. He lives at home with parents and helps himself to their alcohol to party with friends all night. He then sleeps untill midday and then watches TV or plays computer games and smokes dope with other unemployed mates in the afternoon.

His parents tried all of the usual nagging and coaxing to get him motivated to apply for work to no avail. In frustration, my sister ( his mum ) who doesnt muck around, cancelled the family internet and the sons phone plan. She also used the child lock on the TV to restrict his telly viewing and didnt buy any more alcohol. ( shes an ex terratorian, so this hurt her a lot more than the son ) .

This was pretty dramatic stuff but had instant results. Within a week he had a trainieship at the local hardware store and evening bar work at the local pub. Unfortunately the trainieship fell through ( not the kids fault ) but the regular bar work is ongoing.

I know there is simply not enough jobs for everyone at the moment, but it seems that those who want to work, can often find something if they are willing to try anything, rather than waiting for the perfect, gold plated, long term career to drop in their laps.

Many, including some on these boards believe that fruit picking and similar casual work is not a worthy long term job, so doesnt really count. Maybe this attitude is part of the problem, rather than part of the solution. And yes I have done fruit picking when I was younger.

I spent the first ten years out of school shearing sheep for six to eight months of the year. Yes it was casual, but at $150 a day for a teenager thirty years ago, it was still great money and an excellent education in how to work hard ( and play hard. ) The senior shearers who taught me where tough, no nonsense blokes who enjoyed a laugh, but didnt put up with slackers.  You arrived on time and worked hard or got out. I then went on to manage the shearing run, organising groups of shearers and addopted the same approach. It was great experience, even if some of the "educated'' people did look down thier noses at our vocation. ( I once had a local teacher tell her son, in front of us that he had better study hard or he would "just end up a shearer like these blokes " )  I think this type of snobbery is a major impediment to some young people getting started in employment.