Equlity. Good thing or not?

[poddster]

This is a simple poll (or is it );-)B-)]:)

The question is:-

Should all people be equal?

Give ita bit of thought before you answer.

If you answer Yes

Why did you answer in the affirmative?

Describe the :"equal" person that everyone should modeled on

If you answer No

Why did you answer in he negative?

[i-need-a-martini]

Yep - that about sums up what equality is, eh?

No crikey, it only sums up what the word equality relates to when the word is looked at from a philosophical faculty.

Nor does a random dictionary explanation (as it has no context) sum up the meaning of equality.

If you look at it from a human rights perspective (which is what Poddster means) it is very clear what equality means. 

If you take any of the examples in this thread and google them in relation to the word  equality (feminism + equality, education + equality, discrimmination + equality), the meaning is very clear.

[izabsmiling]

 Or is it that sitting here in our nice little houses behind our computers that we forget that there are more people in the world than just us Aussies who "don't have ability or resources" to change their lives if they want to?

CM, I think I mentioned the cost of firewood recently in a thread asking could I/we live on Newstart ?

We are not on Newstart Allowance.I did a brief budget which in winter includes firewood,water delivery ,lpg gas,food etc etc  .I said that I could not live on Newstart here. I was in fact thinking of others .I can appreciate how very hard it is...even without firewood.

[izabsmiling]

First and foremost, you know I have enormous respect for what you have done, what you do and what you continue to do for not only your kids, but for many others as well. You have far more on your plate than anyone else I know of in "our world", yet your heart and actions still extend to embrace many others also in need of you.

I think Bella is fantastic and has the ability to appreciate others in needs and their needs and their differences.She cares for and about others and advocates for them in a really 'human' way ....regardless of what Country they live in.

Thanks Bella.

Crikey Mate, The I Had A Dream Speech ....he wasn't speaking for himself .He wasn't saying I got here so can all of you ...no more need be done.

He was advocating for equality.

I think you just see the fact that he got there ....so why can't others....he recognised and spoke up about the need to change .

[*crikey*mate*]

Yep - that about sums up what equality is, eh?

No crikey, it only sums up what the word equality relates to when the word is looked at from a philosophical faculty.

Nor does a random dictionary explanation (as it has no context) sum up the meaning of equality.

If you look at it from a human rights perspective (which is what Poddster means) it is very clear what equality means. 

If you take any of the examples in this thread and google them in relation to the word  equality (feminism + equality, education + equality, discrimmination + equality), the meaning is very clear.

The point is, that everybody perceives and defines equality differently. It is used as a throw away line or punch line to a joke at dinner parties, or as DDU would say - emotive rhetoric.

My version of equality never defined it using words like Feminism, Education, Rights or Values - they were other people's interpretations.

If people want to wax lyrical about equality but then only look in their own backyards - then that's not really equality, is it?

As both Bella and I have asked before, yet no one has been able to answer - how does a person quantify equality? How do you measure it? Who controls it? Who sets the standards and benchmarks for it?

CRIKEY! We can't even define it!

[izabsmiling]

http://www.immi.gov.au/living-in-australia/values/book/english/lia_english_part1.pdf

Australian Values Statement
You must sign this statement if you are aged 18 years or over.
I confirm that I have read, or had explained to me, information provided by the Australian Government on
Australian society and values.
I understand:
• Australian society values respect for the freedom and dignity of the individual, freedom of religion,
commitment to the rule of law, parliamentary democracy, equality of men and women and a spirit of
egalitarianism that embraces mutual respect, tolerance, fair play and compassion for those in need and
pursuit of the public good.
• Australian society values equality of opportunity for individuals, regardless of their race, religion or
ethnic background.
• The English language, as the national language, is an important unifying element of Australian society.
I undertake to respect these values of Australian society during my stay in Australia and to obey the laws of
Australia.
I understand that, if I should seek to become an Australian citizen:
• Australian citizenship is a shared identity, a common bond which unites all Australians while respecting
their diversity.
• Australian citizenship involves reciprocal rights and responsibilities. The responsibilities of Australian
citizenship include obeying Australian laws, including those relating to voting at elections and serving
on a jury.
• If I meet the legal qualifications for becoming an Australian citizen and my application is approved,
I understand that I would have to pledge my loyalty to Australia and its people.

Crikey Mate, I think it's all in here.Our Countries Value Statement.

[izabsmiling]

The point is, that everybody perceives and defines equality differently It is used as a throw away line or punch line to a joke at dinner parties

I must mix with different people to you CM 

[izabsmiling]

http://www.hrw.org/news/2013/01/11/discrimination-inequality-and-poverty-human-rights-perspective

Accepted under the "Addressing Inequalities" Global Thematic Consultation - Call for Proposals for Background Papers, 2012JANUARY 12, 2013

[izabsmiling]

The fundamental human rights guarantees of equality and non-discrimination are legally binding obligations

[bella_again]

CM I am so glad you responded 🙂 I think that we need to appreciate that the circumstances we find ourselves in are very vastly different to that we experience in this country.

In some countries walking miles in barefeet and sleeping on dirt floors, in many cases dying of hunger is very sadly the norm.  Its not right and it is a very cruel world that we live in when innocent children die everyday. 

However I'm purely responding from a the point of view in this country, our lifestyle etc If you walked miles in barefeet and couldn't eat or slept on dirt floors the reality is your children would be removed.  We have a level of lifestyle in this country that is deemed as acceptable meeting the needs of children in our care.  So what I am saying is those two examples are not comparable because we live in entirely different cultures and countries; thats not to say people in other countries don't deserve better they certainly do and we need to make sure that happens into the future.

But I am talking about Australia and people in this country living below the poverty line, how can they afford to pack up and move, where is the money coming for the rental property that cost twice as much as where they live? where is the money coming from for the truck to move the stuff or if you do it yourself, for the hire of the truck/petrol and the many other costs.  If you can't meet your daily basic living expenses are you saying its better to be homeless to be in a worst state? 4 years ago we were homeless luckily only for a few weeks and my family came to the rescue but what about people who do not have family support or access to services? That was where I was coming from.

The other issue for example is education, not everyone has the initiative you do, the ability to problem solve (see I was complementing you in that post sorry you didn't see it).  Not every one has the same access to services because of where they live.  Yes that's an issue and when you are in that situation you plan and look at options but if it was my DD for example she simply does not have those skills.

What I am trying to say is we all do the best we can do.  I was not insulting you both but rather looking at your differences.  You see both you and Iza have enormous strength, you are both diverse people from different backgrounds that have valid experiences to offer.  I just don't get while you both come to heads at times, recognise your diversity and strengths.

Anyway I hope that makes sense...

[izabsmiling]

Equality isn't something I joke about.Discrimination and inequality has harmed too many people,fuel too many wars ,caused the loss of too many lives.Including those of Indigenous Australians.

The fundamental human rights guarantees of equality and non-discrimination are legally binding obligations

That needs to be upheld in every Country, including our own.

Outcomes may not be the same ie;two students may both have piano lesson,do exactly the same amount of practice ....and still not get the same results.

Equal Opportunities is about everyone having an opportunity to try .