on 15-11-2014 09:44 AM
I hope the ban comes into effect in Australia sometime soon just like it has in several countries.
Write to politicians and alert people on social media about this. Spread the message.
If these countries can do it so can WE!
on 15-11-2014 02:59 PM
Oh and by the way - I visited another two 7-elevens on my morning kids run this morning. Still no sign of those dreaded halal pies you apparently saw which caused such outrage last week..
Where DID you say this 7-11 was again???
on 15-11-2014 03:00 PM
@the_great_she_elephant wrote:A ban on halal slaughter without prior stunning would get my vote, otherwise I have no problems with it.
One thing I would like to know - and perhaps Mr Grizz knows a bit about it - is how are chickens killed commercially? I remember, years ago watching women dispatching chickens at the salesyard in my local country town in England. There was a fowl pest scare on at the time and live birds were not allowed to be taken from the market. the women would sit with a crate full off bird beside them., pull each one out, wring it's neck and pluck it - all within about five minutes per bird. It was truly an amazing sight. My father used to kill our chooksfor the table by wringing their necks too. It was pretty quick and I doubt very much whether they suffered..
KFC isn't halal. So I doubt the OP would care how those chickens are killed.
on 15-11-2014 03:06 PM
@ufo_investigations wrote:
Write to politicians and alert people on social media about this. Spread the message.
I'd like to write to my local politician but I don't think he knows how to write.
15-11-2014 04:05 PM - edited 15-11-2014 04:07 PM
@the*scarlet*pimpernel wrote:She-ele, you don't want to know.
I saw it on telly years ago, the poultry production line and I still have those images stuck in my head.
I remember the good old days of Granny chopping of the chooks head, and having a headless chook running at you. Gvae us kids nightmares
OMG! that brings back memories Pimpy. We had a rooster called Fitzwilliam that used to attack us kids every time we went into the chookyard to collect eggs. One day he made the mistake of attacking my dad. Dad went and got his shot gun and blew Fitzwilliam's head off - he ran thre times round the chookyard before he dropped,
So with regard to Halal lchicken presumably the only difference is the prayer said over them at the time of slaughter. Surely then if "my God is better than your God", all that would be required would be a quick "grace before meals" to neautralise any evil vibes coming off your Sunday roast.
on 15-11-2014 04:23 PM
The only time an animal is not stunned is for religious festivals. Muslims don't have a religious festival that requires this. Jewish people do.
goes to show how much you know
ASHLEY HALL: With Australia's live cattle exports to Indonesia still in limbo the RSPCA is now turning the focus to the issue of ritual killing in Australia.
It's known as Halal or Kosher slaughter in the Muslim and Jewish communities and it's carried out according to religious laws.
In Australia, the national Halal standard requires abattoirs to stun animals before their throat is cut.
But a number of Australian abattoirs have been given government approval to kill animals without stunning.
The RSPCA says it's a brutal practice and should be banned.
Saturday AM's Jason Om visited one domestic abattoir in South Australia where killing without stunning has been going on legally for years.
And a warning, Jason's report contains some graphic descriptions.
JASON OM: At a farm north of Adelaide, Halil Haliloff is rounding up his flock.
HALIL HALILOFF: Go back, go back!
JASON OM: The Turkish-born Muslim has been running a small abattoir for sheep and goats for about seven years.
So how many sheep do you have here?
HALIL HALILOFF: Sometime I get to 50, sometime 60 because the weekly auction, you know?
JASON OM: Most Australian abattoirs that produce Halal meat stun the animal before its throat is cut.
But not here.
(Sound of knife sharpening)
It's one of nine abattoirs in South Australia that's exempt.
HALIL HALILOFF: It must be Mecca faced before the kill.
JASON OM: There aren't any customers today so the kill floor is clean and empty.
But Halil Haliloff explains how the sheep must be facing Mecca when its throat is cut and its blood is drained.
Most of his customers wouldn't buy the meat if it had been stunned.
HALIL HALILOFF: I kill them for religion, for the religion you know. That's why, if not do for the religion my customer runaway. That's way I say (says Arabic phrase) - that is Halal.
JASON OM: Why is it important to have that prayer before the animal is killed?
HALIL HALILOFF: Because it is a promise to God.
JASON OM: Why do they come here?
HALIL HALILOFF: Want to buy fresh meat, because shop, they keep it in a cool room. He sees from eyes it's been 100 per cent halal.
JASON OM: So the customers actually watch you kill it, is that right?
HALIL HALILOFF: Yes.
JASON OM: And they want to make sure that it is Halal?
HALIL HALILOFF: Yes, yes.
JASON OM: His daughter Emine helps out with the farm, especially during the busy holy season of Ramadan.
She's horrified by the wanton cruelty in Indonesia but she doesn't believe slaughtering without stunning is inhumane.
EMINE HALILOFF: I would want the public be more aware of how the procedure is, Islamic correct procedure. If it's done correctly, I believe there are no issues. But people who are doing it incorrectly, those are the ones that bring the rest of the Muslim community down which is quite bad.
JASON OM: The Federal Government is reviewing ritual slaughter standards but isn't pre-empting the findings.
The RSPCA's Melina Tensen says stunning must be made mandatory.
MELINA TENSEN: The RSPCA believes that it's unacceptable to cut the throat of an animal or sever blood vessels while the animal is fully conscious.
In the case of sheep, it's been shown that sheep can be conscious after the throat cut for 20 to 30 seconds. So that's quite a long time to be aware of the fact that the pain of the knife cut and then the actual stress of the bleeding out process.
And with cattle that have had their throat cut, they can remain conscious for up to two minutes. So again, from an animal welfare perspective, killing an animal without stunning it first is unacceptable.
JASON OM: The Australian Federation of Islamic Councils is the accreditation body for Halal food.
It accepts the stunning of animals but president Ikebal Patel says exemptions are needed to accommodate for religious freedoms.
IKEBAL PATEL: It's not necessarily more humane to have all animals stunned because the process of stunning itself is inherently painful to the animal on impact.
So the jury's out but I think if you talk to somebody who may be having a very strong belief that it should be all stunned then yes you are denying them their right from a religious perspective.
JASON OM: So it could be discrimination?
IKEBAL PATEL: It could be discrimination. It could also be belittling one of their fundamental rights to existence.
JASON OM: Back at the farm in Adelaide, Emine Haliloff is worried about what a ban might do to her family's business.
EMINE HALILOFF: It's like spitting in our face saying it's all wrong. I will fight for it and I'm sure others out there will actually help about not banning this procedure itself, the Islamic way.
JASON OM: She says as Islam continues to grow more and more people will want their meat killed according to their beliefs.
ASHLEY HALL: Jason Om.
http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2011/s3247274.htm
the article is from 2011 but the information is
still applicable today.
on 15-11-2014 04:33 PM
ASHLEY HALL: With Australia's live cattle exports to Indonesia still in limbo the RSPCA is now turning the focus to the issue of ritual killing in Australia.
it is most certainly not in limbo but fully restored
on 15-11-2014 04:33 PM
Because some rogue butcher breaks the law, I am incorrect?
The OP asks that non stunned slaughter be banned in Australia.
It IS banned in Australia for religious reasons. Except for religious rituals.
However, Muslims do not have a specific religious festival where meat needs to be slaughetred live. Jewish people do. Orthodox religions do (greeks, russians) but ironically Muslims do not.
on 15-11-2014 04:37 PM
Because some rogue butcher breaks the law, I am incorrect?
not some rogue butcher and he does not break
the law because there are abattoirs that are exempt
from unstunned slaughter. he is one of nine in south australia.
on 15-11-2014 04:39 PM
@debra9275 wrote:ASHLEY HALL: With Australia's live cattle exports to Indonesia still in limbo the RSPCA is now turning the focus to the issue of ritual killing in Australia.
it is most certainly not in limbo but fully restored
i understand that. as i said, the article
is dated 2011 but the info regarding ritual
slaughter practices still applies.
on 15-11-2014 04:41 PM
KFC isn't halal. So I doubt the OP would care how those chickens are killed.
there are KFC outlets that ARE halal so that isnt
entirely true either HOWEVER - and this is
something i just found out (from the rspca)
All Halal slaughter of chickens in Australia includes prior stunning.
which is really good to know