Kids with disabilities in standard classrooms

This has been in the news this week thanks to the school in Canberra that felt the need to 'gaol' an autistic kid in a cage whenever he became hard to handle or violent.

 

Obviously an extreme case and I am not condoning it.

 

But I can;t help but wonder if teachers feel they have little choice? Can they really spend a significant amount of time tackling children with disabilities which neglects other kids in their care? Is it really fair that they have to spend the day monitoring a child with a disability to ensure that nothing triggers an episode? And is it reasonable that they should have to grapple with kids who lash out or are violent?

 

Whilst I get that any parent who has a chikd that is different would prefer they went to a mainstream school instead of a ' special' school (not that there are many of those around), personally I think it is asking a lot of teachers and schools.

 

And before I get criticised, I have a daughter with an intellectual disability who goes to a mainstream school. But there is no way I expect her teachers to spend the amount of time they would need to in order to help her through each day, each year. Fortunately for me I can afford to send her to a private school that can provide extra assistance to her classroom teacher. But if she was at the local public, it just wouldn't be possible for them to provide her with the extra care she needs. 

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Re: Kids with disabilities in standard classrooms

It seems that this is not the only school involved in this practice and that at least two others have come to light and its suspected there are more.  I think the biggest issue is lack of training and support within schools.  I've seen both sides of it, one where teachers don't want to know, are not interested and discriminate against kids with disabilities; and I've seen others that bend over backwards and are often left in situations without the training or support to ensure the child has adequate support in a classroom setting.

 

I've had schools turn my girls away BEFORE they have even meet them in their younger days. It was fear of the unknown.  I forced the HS to take them after many years of Homeschooling.  the days they had a full time aide they attended, the days they didn't they brought work home.  Work was always competed and the school never regretted having the girls.  In the end they were far less trouble than many of the so called normal ones.  It was good for the school community to have my girls and they nor I have never regretted it for one moment.  The only sad part though was that most of the students excluded my girls not because of their behaviour, but because they had never been exposed to anyone different, so I think its a learning curve for them that hopefully has developed some empathy.

 

I did not want to send my kids to a special school because they had been brought up in main stream society, the place they will have to live when they are older.  I am all for inclusion but along with inclusion has to be support.  There is never any excuse for caging a child.  All it shows is the teachers lack of ability to deal with whatever meltdowns or behavioural difficulties the student was experiencing. The teacher could have created a relaxed time out corner or given the student time away from the situation but caging them is not acceptable.  There are so many more options out there these days.

 

The school system can not discriminate, so what needs to change here are the funding levels, training and the attitudes. We have to decide as a society what we want, is it inclusion or do we want institutionalised settings for people with a disability.

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Re: Kids with disabilities in standard classrooms


@i-need-a-martini wrote:

I think the fact that it had bars on it gives someone from outside the situation an impression of gaol (which equals punishment). That is probably more the issue than the fact that it was needed at all.

 

But I understand from a news report that the space was considered the childs "special" place and apparently it was in place for months so I am sure the parents would have been aware.

 

And on a practical level it is more sensible than an enclosed room with a window which is what someone else mentioned earlier as an example of what happens in their school. And from the sounds of things what happens in many schools and hence there is now an enquiry into how widespread the practice is.

 

The 'cage' would have been see through enough that the child could still participate and see what was going on.

 

Perhaps, as barbaric as it seems, it was the best and only solution for this child.

 

But on saaying all of this, is it appropriate to school a child in a mainstream school that needs this mauch attention?


The purpose of schools is to socialise all children ready to take their places in society and to hopefully contribute in some manner. Removing a child from main stream schooling removes its ability to learn behaviours compatible with those that mainstrea society expects. It also denies other students the oppoertunities to learn how to socialize with affected people in their life after schhool

 

Every job will have a member who doesn't do their work correctly, where others will have to expend more time to get the job done. Every workplace will have persons who display attributes not necesarily the accepted norm that each person will have to learn to accomodate. If these people cause distractions or obstacles to another getting their job done, they will have to learn how to accomodate tham and adjust their work accordingly.

 

I don't see the problem with the cage is it is for protection of the child or others in the class. We place babies in play pens to protect them from harm and isolate them from undesirable participation in certain things. If the child is calm in there and able to produce better work, then why not? Why not a special corner of the room? Other children get detention and must sit outside the classroom until their behaviour is acceptable, an autistic child should be no different. Consideration does need to be given to the reasons for the non p[referred behaviour and instruction/guidance/training given in how to behave in the manner expected.

 

Aim for inclusion, where inclusion is detrimental for the child or others, than they need to be removed as in any other time out and the whole class educated as to why those behaviours exist and learn what they can do to help to minimize their occurance.

 

It is important to foster an attitude of inclusion, as these kids will become somebody's workmate at some time in the future.Not only that, they have just as much right to a just education as the child in the next desk.

 

IMO, if the school cannot afford additional assistance, being a user pays society, I bel;ieve that it is up to the parent to provide the funding for a suitable class aide - not just for the child, but for the benefit and use of the whole class, whilst including Johnny Austism/ADHD?Speech Impairment - whatever

 

I am referring to those whose cognitive function falls within the framework of average - ie IQs between 85 and 120. Prior to 70 and higher than 130, they do need a sopecialized education, but very different to each other

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Re: Kids with disabilities in standard classrooms

You have no problem with the cage idea, but then again you had no problem with the doctor hogtying a child that visited him in his surgery.

 

You think that a parent should pay the wages of a class aide? Nine 'til three, five days a week?  How many people could do that on the wages of a kitchen hand.

 

Joono
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Right so prior to 70 kids should be in specialised education, let's just institutionlise them hey easier that way and cheaper. Oh that's right we are now a more inclusive society provided you have an IQ in the average range and all the parents and teachers are happy because we don't have to deal with disability or challenging people..... No that's not how it works, either we are an inclusive society or we are not. By the way I successfully put two kids in normal High School with IQ's below 55 and they still had less issues than some called 'normal' children.
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Re: Kids with disabilities in standard classrooms

Thanks for the Kudo commander-x-2

Joono
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Re: Kids with disabilities in standard classrooms


@j*oono wrote:

You have no problem with the cage idea,


No

 


@j*oono wrote:

again you had no problem with the doctor hogtying a child that visited him in his surgery.

 

I did have a problem with that

 

 

 



@j*oono wrote:

 

 

You think that a parent should pay the wages of a class aide? Nine 'til three, five days a week?  How many people could do that on the wages of a kitchen hand.

 


Yes. It is a user pays society. Society pays for a certain level/type of education, anything over that needs to be funded by those who use the service.

 

It may not be for 5 days, or it could be. I have no idea how many people could afford to do so, but the child is entitled to attend school where is cognigative abilities fall within normal ranges. It may only be for two hours a day where extra assistance is required.

 

The focus here is the child, not on the parents financial abilities. If the financial ability is low, or funding cannot be found then the child misses out. The child's needs are over and above that which is funded bt the governemt, so there really is no other way to facilitate inclusion into a mainstream classroom whilst the child causes stress on the school framework than to have additional help in accessing that situation.

 

The alternative is to pay no money and accept a standard of education lower than what your child id entitled to.in comparison with his same aged peers.

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Re: Kids with disabilities in standard classrooms

We have a fair country (so far).  A fair society where special needs children are taken care of with funding, although I don't think it is so easy to get, but all schools should have qualified staff to look after children that might need extra help.

 

Other countries have no social welfare.  Job or you starve. We just tend to think that our world is Australia, US or Asia.

Joono
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Re: Kids with disabilities in standard classrooms


@bella_again wrote:
Right so prior to 70 kids should be in specialised education, let's just institutionlise them hey easier that way and cheaper. Oh that's right we are now a more inclusive society provided you have an IQ in the average range and all the parents and teachers are happy because we don't have to deal with disability or challenging people..... No that's not how it works, either we are an inclusive society or we are not. By the way I successfully put two kids in normal High School with IQ's below 55 and they still had less issues than some called 'normal' children.

That's not what I meant at all,.

 

It is my understanding that those children with IQs below 70 and those above 130 learn in a very different style to the remainding 80% of their normal pears. Children who fall within these stanines apparently learn differently and need a different delivery of their curriculum.

 

Those who have cognitive ability within 80 to 120 stanine - these are the children the mainstream education system is created for. so have the greatest chance fior it to meet their needs, Some will require additional; assistance to engage ion that class, and that extra attention needs to be paid for by someone. The government only provides so much assistance, the next source of funding ios the parents.

 

Uour children were able to prosper in a mainstrean schoo, that is good. Did it require additional resources and who opayed for those? The more kids we can keep in mainstream schooling the better, but for some, it just isn't possible, for others there is a way, it just has to be found, but I don't expect the government to incur a higher cost to educate my child than they do another child.

 

It's like private health. If what is offered through the public system does not meet your requirements, then you need to source that assissstance independently

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Re: Kids with disabilities in standard classrooms


@j*oono wrote:

Thanks for the Kudo commander-x-2


hahaha acciden. I didn't know i did. Not used to the buttons here

 

If it contributes positively to your happy place, then you may of course keep it at your discression.

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Re: Kids with disabilities in standard classrooms


@commander-x-2 wrote:

@j*oono wrote:

Thanks for the Kudo commander-x-2


hahaha acciden. I didn't know i did. Not used to the buttons here

 

If it contributes positively to your happy place, then you may of course keep it at your discression.


Not used to the buttons here? LOLOL Woman LOL

Your expertise is immeasurable.  

 

Edit:  Off to bed so don't think too deeply tonight.

 

Joono
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