Welfare Reform suggestions

[donnashuggy]

Who should they target first? Or last?

[freddie*rooster · Accepted solution]

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@catsnknots wrote:

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@lakeland27 wrote:

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@catsnknots wrote:

I knew several people on disability because they have a drug addiction.... I say they go first. 

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 but that is a genuine condition . it is an illness..

prejudice is unhelpful,  what if i were to say all suffering from MI should be first on the list ? does it have any more or less validity as a point ?

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lol.. I don't care if it is an illness, get over it... go get help.. why should the taxpayer have to pay for anyone to have a drug addiction? 

and it is not prejudice, I had an addiction and I never went on welfare. Why should they get a free ride just because they know how to play the system? 

I could not get on it when I was unable to work. I could not even walk three house blocks with arthritis and was told that BiPolar did not mean I could not work even though at that time with both conditions flaring up I couldn't. I even had two doctors and two specialists to back me up... Yet have a drug addiction and you get the tick. 

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That proves how hard it is to be eligible for a disability pension.

[izabsmiling]

Catmad, do you know these people on a personal or professional basis ? Are their addictions the sole reasons for their payment or do they have or do you know if they have other disabilities (ie; intellectual, psychiatric, etc ) ? Do they receive their payments on a short term/temporary basis or long term ?  

and would an employer see them for an interview in their current state of health ..is there any point ? 

or do they need to get well first in order to do that and hold down a job ?

Are they up to looking for work and able and safe to work (not just for their own sake but the sake of other workers) ?

What payment should they be on ?

ps: you said 'you knew' not you know ...how long ago was this ?

[izabsmiling]

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@freakiness wrote:

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@catsnknots wrote:

LL, I stopped without rehab!! Many people can and do...

I think instead of getting extra cash from DSP payments for drug addiction that money should go towards paying for rehab services.... infact how about they go into rehab and all of thier government payments go to help pay for thier treatment? 

SH-wonderland, I am all good now. I got help from a fantastic rehabilitation job network agency and when I got well again I found a great job .... my family helped my financially along with the regular newstart payments.... 

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Going away to rehabs has always been a failure for most. In the past the majority seemed to go on the rehab merry go roundand that became thier friendship circle. Well managed in community rehab would be more successful to enable people to re-educate themselves so they're employable and have the know how to live a hard drug free lifestyle.    To be fair I haven't had anyhting to do with or known anyone going through that for years so the system might have changed.

Yes, some can do it on their own but there is a lot out there who don't seem to be able to.  In some it becomes a mental health problem.

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The problem is that you can't force or enforce rehab .It has to be voluntary .

[izabsmiling]

Who deserves the DSP?

El Gibbs Ramp Up 29 Jan 2014

Receiving the disability pension should be about people's needs, not a moral judgement.

Credit: ABC News

Is the proposed 'crackdown' on the Disability Support Pension more about outdated ideas of what disability is and who people with disability are, than any budget savings?

El Gibbs argues that receiving the disability pension should be about what people's needs are, not a moral judgement about who deserves it.

http://www.abc.net.au/rampup/articles/2014/01/29/3933505.htm

[the_hawk*]

[**meep**]

Did I hear that right?  There is going to be a Pension increase?

[poddster]

So Alex you have no problem with people inflicting a hard time on themselves and others around them and you footing the bill.

I have no issue with people who addict themselves, that is their choice. However I do have a problem with me being the one who is partly footing cost of their habit.

You say that for addicts their only way out of whatever the problems are is to be an addict, I say B/S, there are and were many many people who rose above their problems with determination and sheer guts by applying their effort against all odds.

No one can say that they had no idea of what the result of taking addictive substances would be,

[alexander*beetle]

So much anger Poddster. In the scheme of things, no I don't have an issue financing the healthcare needs of someone with an addiction.

Sadly, you have misinterpreted and twisted my comments.
Nowhere did I say that the only way out of people's problems is addiction. I simply said that for people with an addiction, it's not always cut and dried as to why they have an addiction. I didn't say there was no way out at all. I do agree that many people rise above their problems but not everyone can for reasons psychologists, psychiatrists and most in the medical profession grapple with every day. Worldwide.

Let me give you an example. A young girl grew up in a violent alcoholic family. Bashed by her violent mother, abused by her father. ridiculed by the nuns for having an alcoholic mother. Abused by two of her fathers friends. Somehow it was her fault. All this experience before she was 8 years old. Her mother dead when she was 11 with the nuns telling her it was her fault for not praying enough for her mother. Kicked out of home at 14 when her father remarried, living on the streets and all that entailed. She does have more guts and determination than most but her rejection by her family and the abuse she experienced led her on a path of destruction because the pain of just living was more than she could bear.

Are you going to tell her to just pull her socks up and forget about it all? She had no idea the road her drinking would take her down. She just wanted to block the pain she lived with every minute of the day. Her health costs have cost the taxpayer thousands. I don't begrudge a cent of it. Similarly, a politician, on retirement, even a backbencher most have never heard of, will receive 100's of thousands yearly on retirement. A wealthy business person with a clever accountant will avoid thousands in tax, which costs us all. I know where my $ is well spent.

Nothing is black and white. By your assertion, we shouldn't spend any money or have any empathy for anyone who struggles in life. They should all just 'deal with it' and get on with it. I sincerely hope you are not in one of the caring professions.

[the_hawk*]

Kudos to you Alexander you seem to be an intelligent person that has compassion for those less fortunate and dont begrudge them help purely for selfish reasons and have said it so well

[k0llectable5]

Well said Alexander.  

All I can say is Australias official development assistance (ODA) excceeds 5 and a half billion dollars according to the 2013-2014 budget.  http://aid.dfat.gov.au/Publications/Pages/summary-budget-2013-14.aspx

I dont hear anyone complaining about their tax dollars being sent to Indonesia, Afghanistan ect.