Will Work For Dole Work?

[icyfroth]

The federal government's planned revival of the work-for-the-dole scheme won't help people into jobs and could take jobs from paid workers, critics say.

But the government says it's more concerned with helping the unemployed learn "soft skills" and getting them job-ready.

Under the coalition's planned work-for-the-dole expansion, Newstart recipients will be forced to complete some tasks which may include rubbish collection, park maintenance and gardening and painting at aged care facilities.

The scheme would be compulsory and anyone who refused would lose their Newstart payment.

"We're looking for ways in which we can create more work-like placements, such as placing jobseekers with organisations (like) local councils, where they could work in a team environment with people on various council activities," Assistant Minister for Employment Luke Hartsuyker told AAP on Monday.

While no date has been fixed, the scheme will be operational in the next financial year.

The government will pay "host" organisations to cover the costs of job requirements like workers compensation, health and safety training or police checks.

The Australian Council of Social Services said it was concerned the scheme would require individuals to work below the minimum wage, based on the Newstart rate of $35 a day.

The Australian Services Union said it could put paid workers out of a job if organisations could get free labour under Newstart.

But Mr Hartsuyker says that won't happen.

The scheme would not displace paid work and paid opportunities, he said.

The opposition has slammed the proposal, saying it could increase the unemployment rate.

Labor MP Andrew Leigh said a Melbourne University study conducted under the Howard government showed the scheme didn't help people into jobs.

"It ended up diverting people from job-search activities into work-for-the-dole activities," he said.

Mr Hartsuyker said the government's focus was on getting people into jobs by teaching them "soft skills".

"It's as simple as turning up to work everyday and being appropriately presented."

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I think it's right that ppl should work for the dole. You?

[lloydslights]

Maybe they are "saving face" by saying they don't want to work.  Maybe, THERE IS NO WORK for them, at all.

DEB

[***super_nova***]

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@purple_haize wrote:

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They can afford to do that if they are getting the living away from home amount, and that is what they do, they dont live at home so they get a higher amount of the dole.

Well, if they do not live at home they also pay rent and have to feed themselves. 

My nephew works in Belgrave and he sees all the young ones who are on the dole hanging around or sitting outside the pub drinking and smoking.

I am not assuming anything, I know for a fact I see it when I am out, I live in The Dandenongs, alot goes on that people that dont live here never know about.

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I used to live in the Dandenongs, Emerald actually, I do not think that the problem of kids on the dole was any worse than anywhere else.  Yes, kids with no qualifications who leave school have problems getting jobs.  So, what do you want them to do?  There are only so many places you can apply, it does not take very long to email off your application once you have it in your computer.  But in this moment there may be heaps of kids that are just hanging around waiting for Uni to start.

[spotweldersfriend]

Four Corners should investigate and expose the Job Network for what it is-a waste of taxpayers funds and completely useless at getting people who want to work off the dole.

[boris1gary]

The other thing about TAFE courses, the last one my son did, he lost $160 (approx)  a fortnight from his dole, hardly an incentive.

[boris1gary]

Purple,

Maybe you should just be happy that your step son  and his mates seem happy to live on next to nothing and are healthy (assuming they are). There really aren't enough job's available so better that they are content than sufferering serious health consequences from all the stress and stigma that can and does affect large numbers of our unemployed.

[the_great_she_elephant]

But what if "work for the dole" included courses, perhaps recognized ones at places like TAFE? Certificate III's or IVs is under resourced fields?

In theory that sounds good - in practice it is pie in the sky.

Many years ago now, the  TAFE College where Mr Elephant worked ran a Government sponsored "Foundation For employment" Scheme.

It was cobbled together, not around the real needs of the young unemployed, but around which lecturers had empty spots in their timetables and what subjects they were qualified to teach. It acheived absolutely nothing apart from making the unemployment figures look better. 

[spotweldersfriend]

I know a few people who drink and smoke too purple.They're not on the dole but on disability pensions.They get substantially more than dole recipients.
In the past,governments of both persuasions would put a large number of long term unemployed-and I'm talking about people who were out of work for 10 years or more-onto disability.For some strange reason it was always during an election year.Massaging the figures I think they call it.
I suppose it did make some sense.A lot of these people don't fit in,some have mental illness issues and realistically who'd hire someone who's been out of the workforce for 10+ years?.Not many.

[freakiness]

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@lloydslights wrote:

Maybe they are "saving face" by saying they don't want to work.  Maybe, THERE IS NO WORK for them, at all.

DEB

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True, it's not easy to accept and admit you are not employable.

[boris1gary]

Disability pension is the next one in the govts sights - it's already extremely difficult to get on and if the UK is anything to go by

Below is what the British Govt has done to it's own, I really fear that our govt will follow a similar path.

Attacking society�s most disadvantaged

Incapacity Benefit (IB) was meant to compensate people for lack of earnings if illness prevented them from working. At the end of the last Labour government, IB was rebranded the �Employment and Support Allowance� (ESA), and an independent medical assessment was introduced.

Hundreds of thousands of disabled claimants have lost around £70.00 per week in the move from IB to the new ESA as private firms who were employed to �assess� claimants during the move from one to the other (presumably on a bonus system) have been declaring virtually everyone fit for some work based on a short examination from a �medical professional� (usually a nurse of some undisclosed type).

According to Nick Sommerland, �The work capability assessments are carried out by private firm Atos, on a £100m a year contract.

�The firm made a £42m profit in 2010 and paid boss Keith Wilman £800,000, a 22 percent pay rise on the previous year.� (�Thirty-two die in a week after failing test for new incapacity benefit�, Daily Mirror, 5 April 2012)

This �professional� assessor ticks boxes on a form, and in very many cases the outcome is 0 points. This has the effect of putting many claimants off even trying to appeal against the adverse decision, as the required 15 points seems so far out of reach. Yet of those who have appealed, some 40 percent have been successful.

For those who win their claim, however, it is a long and arduous slog to get their money back. The Department of Work and Pensions (DWP) shamelessly claims in this age of computers that it cannot be done instantly because of the backlog, and 8-10 weeks is now around the average time it takes to change a claimant�s rate to the appropriate one having worked out the difference between what they have been getting and what they should have been getting and multiplying that by the number of weeks/months that they have been underpaid!

Meanwhile, the government carries on enjoying what is in reality an interest-free loan from hundreds of thousands of the poorest and most disadvantaged people in the country for as long as it can. Of course, that is still better for people than having that money taken away permanently and having then to submit to interviews to explain why they haven�t got a job, even though it is glaringly obvious that very few employers are interested in employing anyone who is not fully fit.

The disabled are then herded into what are mostly completely useless �retraining� courses under threat of losing even more of their benefits if they fail to attend. For the chronically ill, who often are in extreme pain for much of the time, this is a nightmare without end, as jobs are few and no one will employ someone who is obviously incapable of work or even of turning up every day.

[jean2579]

Sometimes I thnk that posters on these boards have sunk as low as humans can go, then along comes a topic like this one, where without fail, and allowing for a diversity of opinion, posters have an in depth discussion without name calling, or getting personal

It seems that every poster is trying to find a solution to an overwhelming problem. I really hope that someone in or out of government can come up with a viable solution that satisfies both those concerned about the amount of tax they pay and those who receive it, but at the same time have a right to some dignity and respect. Perhaps it is an impossible task.