I have a feeling we fell for a scam - buyer claiming counterfeit on a genuine very expensive item

[bright_tomato]

I have listed my husband's very expensive phone (it's over $5000 brand new) and finally sold it at best offer for only $1300, much less than what we were hoping to get. But we really needed the money. I took all precautions - took very detailed photos, sent the buyer the IMEI number  and tracking number, insured the phone for $1300 when posted. She received the phone and literally the next day I receive a message that she believes the phone to be a copy or a fake. I am in a state of shock, I am not a retailer, I only sell my own second-hand goods and this phone was a gift from a close friend of my husband's. There is absolutely no chance that it is fake or a copy. She didn't even investigate,  i suggested that she takes the phone to a TAG store to check and she completely ignored that. I have a feeling this is a scam artist who is now requesting a return for refund and will send us back a fake phone to scam us.

My questions is, does anyone has any experience with what kind of process ebay/pay pal follows when a buyer claims the item to be fake? I listed the item with "no returns accepted" condition so I am also wondering - am I able to reject her return request?

[bright_tomato]

Spoke to Pay Pal and I am a little confused. They explained to me that:

1. Pay Pal dispute and ebay dispute are two entirely deifferent things

2. Not directly, but they did imply that pay pal dispute would be more beneficial for me and actually told me to encourage the buyer to open a pay pal dispute specifically.

3. if pay pal dispute is opened and escalated he will be required to post the fake back (the policy of destroying the item has been removed) and then, after I receive this fake, I can submit evidence which will be passed on and considered by their claims team. it is unclear what type of evidence is taken into consideration - they don't consider original photographs to be evidence, the only thing I mentioned that they seem to accept is the police report.

4. when I asked what happens in an ebay dispute, she couldn't give me any information so I guess I have to call back and ask how these two processes would cross-over if at all.

Does anyone have any more info on the speficis of these two processes? Is it worth encouraging the buyer to open pay pal dispute instead of an ebay dispute?

[clarry100]

I would have someone (even if it is your husband) who saw you pack the real phone and knows you did to sign a statutory declaration saying just that. This is a legal document that would stand up in court if required.

It will come down to your word against the buyer at the end of the day. With you saying I did not send you a fake and him saying yes you did.

Something (anything) that would show that you were the owner of the original non-fake one. I understand that is difficult for you to get. Ask TAG.AU for help along these lines. I'm sure they must keep good global records of IMEI's and serial numbers.

Maybe once again stat decs from any of your friends who can verify that they know you owned such a phone. Any such little things that can help tilt the case into your favour.

Package tracking data and PO lodgement receipts.

The buyer has little to go on really except his word and claims of a fake received. If/When he sends back the fake one then the IMEI number from that ought to show some history of where it has been. And my bet is that history won't be in Australia.

At some point in the future if the case goes in your favour one way or another, you won't have lost your money but you won't have the phone either. Same position you would have been in had it all gone smoothly.

I would still investigate with TAG the possibility of permanently disabling the phone globally via the IMEI number. Keep this option up your sleeve for if required.

[li.vish]

Hi everyone, the discussion is getting a little heated.  Please be sure to keep your communications civil.  Thanks!

[i-once-was-bump]

Have you contacted TAG about the phone yet?

[lizzy6107]

Its great news that the policy about destroying the "fake " has been changed..

At least when you get the phone back, you wont be refunding because it will be the wrong phone, and you will also be able to compare weights of what you sent and what you recieved, and check the info for the phone that he returns..

I would think just the fact that first he said you sent a fake, and then changing it to being the wrong model is good enough proof he is a liar anyway and is changing his story as he goes along.

[imastawka]

He won't send it.    Too much info on it

[cherry*135]

catspjs wrote: Receipts are MORE easily faked than goods are.

A genuine receipt can easliy be traced to the authorised store that issued it.

A fake one can't

Been through this with travel insurance claim re theft. Genuine designer brand name item, genuine receipt. Item purchased from overseas from brand name store, on request they were able to scan and email copy of original receipt within an hour (purchase around 2 years ago).

Email has store name, phone number etc.. anyone wanting to check authencity of the receipt/email could easliy do so by phone.

[cherry*135]

Re genuine receipts - we are discussing high end, high price designer gear here, not $15 items from kmart. 

[cherry*135]

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@clarry100 wrote:

I would still investigate with TAG the possibility of permanently disabling the phone globally via the IMEI number. Keep this option up your sleeve for if required.

---

Phone blocking is done by the carrier/phone company, not the brand name company of the mobile. I think the OP posted earlier, the phone had only been used a couple of times, in 5 years, so they may not have even had a current sim card for it. Apart from that see below.

The OP already posted this earlier:

Called Australian police and they told me that unfortunately, until I am actually out of pocket (until ebay rules against me) I can't even open a case against them here. And even if I do the IMEI will only be blocked in Australia not anywhere else.

[onei0403]

Where is the Tall Bearded 1?

Bearded is knowledgeable AND polite and offers excellent advice.

I have noticed whilst reading this thread, that some of the posters have been pretty rude with attitude to match their comments, which I feel is unneccessary.

BT is obviously very distressed by this situation ( as I would be) and I hope that the situation is resolved in her favour.

PS...BT ACORN used to be known as a high tech crime unit, they are used to these stories and will do what they can to assist you.