Orders going missing with Australia Post

[sagenarre]

Hi..Just wondering if anyone else has been having trouble with orders going missing in the Post?   I have had 15 missing orders since July and post around 100 articles per week so not a huge mailout...I have approach them (Australia Post) previously and because I sell Jewellery they are not interested in compensating...The jewellery is small items and not practical to Register but it is becoming costly for me to keep refunding or replacing orders for customers because of failed delivery...If anyone has any suggestions I would appreciate it...Thanks

[tall_bearded]

Now you have been comprehensively misinformed by the regulars, here are your ACTUAL rights.

Once you have handed the item over to the carrier you have no further legal responsibility should the item be lost or damaged whilst in transit.  This is because when it comes to the sale of goods, once you have handed the item to the carrier RISK passes from the seller to the buyer.  Or to put it another way, handing it to the carrier has the same legal effect as if you had handed it to the buyer.

This is why, contrary to popular board myth, there is no oft cited eBay policy which states if you list something on eBay you agree to accept responsibility for all lost items.  I know it doesn’t exist because I have looked for it and can’t find it.  I have also regularly challenged those who assert its existence to show me where it is, with the routine reply being I know it exists but I can’t be bothered finding it for you, which translates into “I believe it should exist, therefore it must exist, somewhere, but I know not where”.

As for your TOS, as they simply mirror the legal position, and as there is no eBay policy to the contrary, they are not only sound but also enforceable.  In fact when it comes to enforcement, as they simply mirror what the law says in the first place, you actually don’t need to include them in the listing.

Finally as to the unacceptable high number of items going missing, there are two plausible explanations. 

There could be something wrong with the Aust Post network servicing you area.  Therefore I would lodge a complaint with AP requesting they investigate and provide you details as to their findings, and if they give you the run around, then lodge a complaint with the Postal Ombudsman.

The other explanation is they are being stolen after they have been delivered.  The fastest growing area of theft in Australia is identity theft, and the best way to steal someone’s identity is to rifle through their letter box.  Needless to say if the pack is as small as you say, then it will simply be deposited in the buyers letter box, and unfortunately, even now, most people don’t bother to lock it.   

Therefore if AP says they have investigated and can’t find anything wrong, and if the losses continue, I would seriously reconsider whether I would continue to reimburse the buyer for any loss where the buyer selects regular post instead of registered post as their preferred delivery option.  

[peternt2001]

I am not a lawyer and not an expert in postal/courier issues of missing items. However , there seems to be a contradiction in what you have said about, as soon as you hand an item to Australia Post it is legally like you have handed it to the buyer.

In my state, a third party can not make any claim or have dealings in a legal sense with a supplier or service provider.

Another example is if I buy a television from a shop and then pass it on to another person before the warranty runs out, if something goes wrong the third party i passed the tv too can not ( legally ) make a claim on the warranty, it has to be me, as i am the person who was contracted by the sale of the television with the retailer. ( yes i know it does happen and people can get around it )

And applying the third party situation to Australia post or a courier, that means that there is no contract between Australia Post and the ebay buyer, but only a contract between Australia Post and the ebay seller. So to me this should rule out the " once the ebay seller has passed it onto Australia Post , it is the same as passing it onto the buyer "

To me the only way around this would be for the seller to make insurance the only sort of postage offered, to protect themselves not protect the buyer.

I stand to be corrected if wrong, and also believe this is something that ebay could and should chime in on and clarify the postage / insurance situation, using not what they think, but legal advice from what i am sure is a team of lawyers they have at their disposal.

[***super_nova***]

It really is irrelevant what TB thinks, when the buyer lodges INR with PP they will refund them (unless the seller has a proof of posting).  I have in past bought on line (not eBay) paid with my CC and the item never arrived; my CC did a chargeback.  So it is not just some eBay myth that the seller is responsible for safe delivery. If it was not so, many people would not be buying on line.

Obviously, if seller could say they posted without having to prove they indeed sent parcel to that particular person,that would be open to abuse.  And of course the sender is responsible for the item arriving without being damaged, who else but the person who packed it should be responsible?

[digital*ghost]

So it is not just some eBay myth that the seller is responsible for safe delivery.

Sellers aren't responsible for delivery. They're responsible for posting - that's why PayPal - in all likilihood - won't refund you if the seller sends it via C&S or registered, but you don't receive it.

If a seller proves postage - not delivery - they aren't legally obliged to compensate a buyer for lost items, and postage can be established in a lot of ways other than what PayPal will accept. Online buying/selling is bigger than eBay and PayPal, and you will find that many online stores have a disclaimer about no responsibility for lost items if a registered service is not selected and paid for. More importantly, you should know that it is perfectly legal in Australia to have that disclaimer.

[syrupsmummy]

OP is selling mainly $2 to $3 items and click and send ($6.20) won't be very practical.

If getting certain missing mails regularly, put the item price slightly up to cover the losses.

There is a discussion about who is responsible for lost mail here. But I think most important thing is "good customer service" as OP is running a store. Good customer service will attract more customers. And returning customers are precious when running an eBay store.

[bluerose5838]

The only real option you have is to only post via Registered Post.
That way the item is traceable every step of the way by Australia Post.

I would highly reccommend you impliment this with your sales and pass the cost onto the buyer of course. 😞

I do believe that Registered post is now $3.00 although I could be wrong.

Unforunatley postal theft is big thing.

[digital*ghost]

I think most important thing is "good customer service" as OP is running a store. Good customer service will attract more customers. And returning customers are precious when running an eBay store.

I agree 100%, but I also think it's wise to be aware of what everyone's actual rights and responsibilities are, lest an assumption one day leads to an unwelcome surprise.

[treasure-hearts]

If you buy in lots of 50, you can get registered post stickers for $135 ($2.70 each).

I know this doesn't help much considering the prices you sell for, but it might at least allow you to lower the registered post price option.

I started having a similar problem recently.

My suggestions apart from registered are:

Use a larger size bubble bag. If you are buying in bulk there won't be much difference in price.

I'm not sure why this makes a difference (guess it's harder for a postal employee to put in their pocket?).

Don't put your ebay store name on the package, but do put it inside somewhere, otherwise you will have some customers buying from a large number of sellers that forget who they received items from.

I also check buyers feedbacks and will apply registered post labels at my own expense if they have given negatives for item not received or have complained about slow postage.

Overall its a bit of a balancing act and i can see that your overall sales are probably too low to use registered (thanks to terapeak) but one thing i would suggest is setting up your listings to automatically allow combined postage so customers don't need to wait for you to do it. Or if you have already done that, remove the part of the message telling customers they need to wait. You should get more combined orders that way.

One more suggestion.. again it won't directly help with your mail problem but may help you get more people viewing your listings. I notice you describe the product in your titles, but often not the product name that most users would search ebay for. eg:

16g -10mm SSteel Straight Barbell with 4mm BALLS

You would be missing customers searching for words like 'eyebrow', 'piercing', 'stud' etc

So far its been my experience being found first will get you more sales than having the lowest price.

[***super_nova***]

Sellers aren't responsible for delivery. They're responsible for posting - that's why PayPal - in all likilihood - won't refund you if the seller sends it via C&S or registered, but you don't receive it.

If a seller proves postage - not delivery - they aren't legally obliged to compensate a buyer for lost items,

OK, but in this case it is not practical to prove postage, so PP will refund.

Actually what I said was  that seller is responsible for "safe delivery", which is not exactly relevant to the OP, but it was reply to TB's claim that once the item is handed over to AP they become responsible for it .  If the item arrives damaged and the buyer claims SNAD, they will get their money back.  AP will not accept responsibility unless they deem it adaqutely packed ................ etc.  so yes, the sender is responsible for safe delivery. 🙂

[bluerose5838]

TO treasure-hearts

In regards to bulk purchase of registerd post lables, do you still need to go into the post office for them to stamp the reciept thingy or can you simpply drop your mail in the post box?

(If you buy in lots of 50, you can get registered post stickers for $135 ($2.70 each).

I know this doesn't help much considering the prices you sell for, but it might at least allow you to lower the registered post price option.)