Opened dispute for undelivered item, and I cannot get a refund.

[ashvuj0]

Hi there,

I had opened a dispute for a pair of shoes I'd purchased over ($1000 AUD). I'd checked with the seller if it could be posted to me before a certain date as i'll be living overseas for 1 year and wanted to receive them for I left.

After receiving this confirmation withe the seller that it was all good to be sent off and received pretty fast, I bought and paid instantly. After 3-4 days I'd noticed the buyer had not sent the item yet, I'd emailed, and didn't get a response. By this point, I don't really want the item posted to me anymore as there was a big risk that I would not have received it on time. The seller had not responded to me, and I'd then read some reviews in detail and got spooked about them potentially being a scammer.

From this, I'd instantly called my bank, panicked that I'd spent a large amount and wanted the payment to be blocked asap. (Stupid knee-jerk reaction move, I know). I'd explained the situation to my payment institute who then decided to open a dispute. By this point the seller replies and accepts the dispute instead of challenging  it. From which I'd expect to get a refund or even have the item express-shipped via mail perhaps.

After a week, my payment institute closes the dispute out of nowhere . Very strange, I know.

I'd call back, got information from different people but they all have told me, because the charge back failed, they are unable to do anything else and cannot refund me (under Visa rules?) as they cannot attempt a charge back more than once. Obviously I will be changing banks after this experience.

But at this point, I have no idea where my money is. 
I've contacted eBay and everyone I speak to keeps telling me, ''once the dispute has been opened with the payment institution, eBay cannot intervene or help with the case every again''. Ok I get it, but my bank confirmed they cannot do anything AND the closed the dispute. So when does eBay then release my money they put on hold from the seller? and to who? the seller or myself? eBay cannot tell me where my funds are currently sitting, and for me to contact my bank. I keep telling them my bank cannot help me and they closed the dispute. Again, eBay tell me to contact my bank despite me telling them all this. And it keeps going around in circles. 

So how do I get my money back? or even get the item shipped? I just want either what I'd paid for, or a refund for what I have not received. Obviously the seller won't ship the item as the funds would still be on hold?

Is this stuck in the system forever? Literally nobody can tell me. Thanks so much.

[padi*0409]

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@ashvuj0 wrote

I hope so. Sent, and hoping for the best.

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The money will go back to your funding source, Paypal, credit card etc.

eBay is pretty easy to deal with, just read up on the buying help pages.

https://www.ebay.com.au/help/buying

[gutterpunkz05]

It sounds like your seller accepted the claim, however as the dispute is lodged by your bank, against ebay, ebay can still dispute the claim.  It is then up to your bank to decide in favour of you

or ebay and in this case it apears they have found in ebays favour.

I assume you filed a chargeback INR, before the delivery deadline had expired, if so, ebay were justified in disputing the claim.

Your seller probably has no idea what is going on, as they have accepted the claim and the funds are now on hold.  Your seller obviously does not know  who the funds are going to be  released to, so they should be concerned about issueing any refund at this time.

TIP FOR SELLERS

Tip
In some cases, eBay may respond to a payment dispute on your behalf, even if you accept the dispute. If you accept the dispute and eBay challenges the dispute on your behalf, you won't be charged a dispute fee.

[ashvuj0]

Correct, seller accepted the claim. And according to my bank they closed the case as the initial chargeback failed for whatever reason and are unable to do a second one (their VISA rule). So, bank dispute closed.

If the funds are on hold, what would be the trigger to release it? Given it’s been a week or so since the dispute has been closed with my bank, I can’t find any information on what happens next in the process. If anything? It’s just odd.... 

What do you mean:  eBay were justified in disputing the claim? I wasn’t aware eBay would dispute a claim in this circumstance?

[gutterpunkz05]

If the delivery deadline had not expired, you could not make a claim via ebay MBG.

Likewise making your claim via bank chargeback, ebay would be able to dispute that the claim was invalid, ebay would be able to make this dispute even though the seller accepted the claim.

Note your seller is only going to receive about $870  when funds are finally released.  It will be interesting to see who is now going to be responsible for ebays fees, as it appears ebay disputed the claim and won.

[gutterpunkz05]

From Visa dispute guideines

• You delivered the merchandise or made it available for pickup by the agreed-upon date or agreed
upon location.
Provide documentation to prove that the cardholder or authorized person received the merchandise or
services as agreed.
• Specified delivery date has not yet passed.
Provide documentation to support the expected delivery date

Note the delivery date, is that specified by ebay

[springyzone]

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@ashvuj0 wrote:

I'm writing here for advice, so I figured details and context could be helpful.

Erm. Why would I go to read up on eBay's Money Back Guarantee works when you literally said it won't favour me in this situation?

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I'm a buyer so I'm not up with all the details of how sellers deal with claims but I think dave means you should read up on ebay's MBG for future reference. And that had you read up on it before this purchase, you may have dodged a world of pain.

One of the main things with the money back guarantee is that you cannot open a claim for item not received till after the due delivery date has passed. That date will be in the ad when you buy.

You can understand this. If you buy something eg this morning and try to open a claim this afternoon, it would not be fair to the seller, they need time to get it to you and ebay will give them the agreed time.

But once that date has passed, if you open a claim and the seller cannot show proof of delivery, then you will almost certainly win your claim with ebay.

Your problem is you seem to have rushed straight to the bank and filed a claim well before the estimated date of delivery. From what I have read here in other posts, it seems that with this claim, it is the bank challenging ebay (rather than the individual seller) for the money back, . In this case, ebay would have responded that the advertised delivery date had not even arrived yet so any claim was premature. That's apparently why you lost the claim.

How experienced is your seller? Is he very regular or does he sell only now and again? 

It sounds as if it may be an occasional seller & with someone like that, they don't get the money for a month. It is on hold with ebay. Some newish sellers make the mistake of not sending the goods straight away because they want the money released before they will do so.

I don't know if that is what happened here or whether the hold was just because a claim was opened. But as the claim is now shut, you'd think the hold would lift. If the hold is the normal 30 day hold on occasional sellers though, it may still have a week or so to go.

My feeling though (and again, I am not the expert so don't know for sure) is that the money would be released to the seller. Once this happens, maybe he will send the goods. I can't see why ebay would release the funds to you as you never opened an ebay claim and you lost the bank claim.

I do agree with you though that ebay reps are useless and should at least be able to tell you what will happen with your money. The bank lost the dispute, they don't have your money, I can't see that they would know.

I have a bad feeling that the seller will eventually get the funds and you will be at his mercy as to whether he posts or not because now you can't open an ebay dispute (which I agree is ridiculous now that the bank dispute is finished). I'd write to the seller and explain that the dispute is over and so once the money is released to him, you would like him to send the shoes on to you.

You'll have to arrange for someone to post them on to your new address.

[ashvuj0]

And I probably also should've bought Bitcoin when it was a dollar, yet here I am. I have to say, as a buyer, I don’t really want to have to be reading t’s and c’s and waiting days for shipping. As I'd said in a previous comment, eBay probably isn’t for buyers like me. 

That makes sense. I did tell the seller I needed it before the date in the ad which was agreed upon, and is one reason I went through and bought the item. I didn’t expect a handling time of 4 days and radio silence after that. Obviously I then took the wrong path of action.

eBay has not confirmed I’ve lost any claim. They have only said the bank have control of the situation, which they don’t.

I’m also inclined to think this is what might have happened, the seller seems newish, poor with comms and not likely to have sent the goods right away for the reason that the money had not released to them. 

Based on everything, yes, I now do think the money will then be released to the seller too and I’d have to wait for him to communicate that to me, if he does. My hunch is that the dispute is not officially over in eBay and perhaps there is a period of time that they dedicate to this before officially closing and releasing funds. Maybe.

In any case, I do see how I will be at his mercy as to whether the seller posts or not. Hooray.

[sugar249]

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@ashvuj0 wrote:

And I probably also should've bought Bitcoin when it was a dollar, yet here I am. I have to say, as a buyer, I don’t really want to have to be reading t’s and c’s and waiting days for shipping. As I'd said in a previous comment, eBay probably isn’t for buyers like me. 

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I have some very bad news for you.

No matter what you do in life you need to read the T&C's, be it Ebay,  your bank or any other transaction.   And you will run into similar issues if you don't.

If you had read your VISA t&C's yopu would know you cant raise a claim until the delivery date is past.

If you had read the Ebay T&C's you would know how the system work.

Reading your novel,  it is all self imposed,  and a great idea if you do leave Ebay,  but I would suggest putting your money under your mattress as well, because your bank has T&C's.  

[gutterpunkz05]

eBay has not confirmed I’ve lost any claim. They have only said the bank have control of the situation, which they don’t.

You do not have a claim via ebay,  you made your claim via your bank and it is your bank that has decided in ebays favour.  Ebay was only required to deal with your bank and are not required to communicate anything to you, quite possibly illegal for them to do so.

Frankly your claim should never have been accepted  by Visa.

[gutterpunkz05]

Just to ad,  There is also the remote possibility, that ebay did not dispute the claim, and that although the seller accepted the claim, Visa then realized that your claim was invalid and should never have been initiated.

Just a possibility, but my money is on ebay disputed the claim.