Removal of negative feedback

[rosebelle9798]

This subject must be of considerable interest to a number of people that have had their feedback removed.

I have left only 3 negative feedbacks over a number of years with many purchases. All have been removed.

One was removed after I initiated a dispute and complaint about being libeled. I complained. he was found wrong, but he was rewarded with the removal of not only his offending reply but also all of mine which did not contravene policy.

Recently I legitimately stated that that the postage was excessive. And also discoved that another member's feedback stating the same was removed. The seller's score however was such that the reasonableness of his postage outscored the rest.

The basis of malcontent with this seller was that he started the auction at 99cents and it was won at that price but then charged $127 to have that 39kg item shipped less than 5km literally down the road to my place.

An examinination of the seller's feedback scores it indicates that some 200 feedbacks are missing that must be neutral or negative.

Clearly many feedbacks have been removed and given that it can be argued that, that freight cost was excessive and that the seller sells many of the same item and other items  this way, that a substantial number of people would not have been completely happy with this charge.

Seeing that I found another member with the same view, before that person's feedback was also removed, I seemed to have some cause for concern about how the feedback is manipulated for large sellers to show an extraordinary postive feedback in the absence of almost non existent negative. In the real world this rarely is the case, some negative must be justified!

Another alarming point is that when I filled out the feedback it would not allow me to give less than the 5 stars; the item listing incorrectly said freight was free and that is why 5 stars are automatically given. So in affect I was only allowed to give feedback if I gave them 5 stars for freight, although that was the very point of my negative feedback - that freight was not reasonable!

Not fair trading on a number of points.

[lyndal1838]

My seller was quite happy to cancel the whole transaction but I really wanted the item....it was a painting by an artist that I really like.

Although the freight costs put the price up quite substantially the seller was agreeable to removing the frame and glass, which made a huge difference to the final costs.  I was still ahead, even having to reframe the painting.

I have ended up happy with my purchase, but whether I would go through it all again...probably not.  It is not a nice experience being called a liar, cheat, scammer just because the seller was too stubborn to log in to ebay.au to check out what I was telling him.

[*crikey*mate*]

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@rosebelle9798 wrote:

Lyndal, mine said "contact the seller" but they would not reply. It was the feedback form that said "free"!

You say you won your GB item so you would have been locked into paying for freight as well, or were you able to negotiate after they changed their listing? My seller refused to negotiate (?) I assume this as they would not reply to my messages.

I even offered to pay for the item and told them to keep it - no response would not alter payment by PayPal (issue new invoice). Could only pay by PayPal (no alternatives) for the full amount. After a couple of days from end of auction it was listed as Unpaid Item. I of course tried paying only for the item and forfeit because I was infuriated and wanted nothing to do with them although including postage it was a good deal - but a principal. I believe they breached fair trading laws.

I guess this raises the topic "is it ethical to substantially raise the freight cost, then as a combined cost  is their profit". I also think this against EBay policy and consumer law.

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Hi, I'm not disputing, just curious.

Which Fair Trading Laws do you believe they breached?

Would it be too much trouble for you to show me?

please?

[digital*ghost]

I've had a relatively thorough look at the mattress listing and the seller's other listings for mattresses (both BINs and auctions), and there's a couple of things that I think are worth mentioning.

1. Freight is a postage method, and does not allow a seller to enter a cost when selected. It sometimes (incorrectly) shows as free, but it should never be taken as free unless specifically stated by the seller either in the listing description / title, or via messages (in other words, if ever eBay show freight as free, confirm this with the seller). 

2. The seller uses a postage calculator on their listings. I used it on a mattress auction ending in less than half an hour as well as the specific listing the OP won, and both times got a quote just above $130. Chances are, that's why the feedback was removed, because the seller makes the P&H cost available in the listing, and eBay consider complaints in feedback about postage costs in those circumstances worthy of removal. The seller's BIN's for the mattresses come up with free freight on the calculator, so on those they probably selected Freight as the postage method, then ticked the free post box. 

3. The seller states that pick-up is not available on auction items (and pick-up otherwise incurs a handling fee of $10), as they allow pick-up for BINs, it's a fairly safe bet that the freight costs on 99c auctions include some profit margin. 

[digital*ghost]

I thought I better add, just to clarify, I'm not condoning the seller's listing practices, just pointing out that some of the issues raised were evident, or actually did have the relevant info, in the listings. 

[rosebelle9798]

Crikey mate the acts are massive and my first reaction was crikey mate that's difficult (joke) however the Australian Consumer Law Schedule 2 2010 which came into force 1 January 2011, spells out things in simple terms..

As you may know this Act was produced not only to make a unversal law for all of Australia but also to make things clear and simple and less technical.

In answer to your question I will argue in the first instance that the seller breached:

"You are entitled to see the total price, inclusive of any addition fees, charges or taxes"

However you will see by digital ghost's reply that a defence can be mounted (that most info could have been found).

Digital ghost was able to use the freight calculator to get a figure about $130, however my experience was that the calculator did not work (locked out).

What is also an important point is that I don't think any body can use as a defence "the system". Like the seller mentioned by Lyndal, or for that matter EBay shirking away from problems with their system. All parties have responsibilites under these trading laws.

[lyndal1838]

Don't bring me into your arguements.  My seller was in the UK and I am sure he did not give a flying fig about Consumer Laws in Australia.

There was no problem with the ebay system...my seller just did not know how to use it in relation to a listing using Freight.  As soon as the ebay rep talked him through how to list an item with Freight all his listings were corrected immediately.

[rosebelle9798]

lyndal your absolutely right wasn't trying to pull you into the argument. Overseas Ebays work differently (however if he advertised in Aus then he was obligated to make sure that it was correct and also that he should not resort to name calling etc.).

Mine is a simple easily understood local issue that should not be allowed to happen (and that is the seller's reputation can be grossly misrepresented by the way feedback is manipulated).

 I am gauging whether members(buyers) think that this a problem, and that Ebay should address.  

[dave-the-sparky]

i too have an issue with the feedback system... i bought a mobile phone off a seller with 100% feedback. it was faulty on arrival, listing stated refund available if buyer paid postage. contacted seller and he agreed to refund. returned phone with tracking and ended having to get e-bay to contact seller for me. i left a negative feedback so others would know what happened. seller then opened a non payment claim on me after i had paid and he had refunded me, this puts a negitive strike on me!!! e-bay removed the strike against me but this process also removes his negitive feedback, he is still on 100% so if you know how to fudge the system you can keep a clean slate while doing dodgy deals, so a seller with 100% may not be all that good!

[lyndal1838]

There was no fudging of the system as you put it....you just did not know how to use it properly.

It was a bit unethical of the seller to open a non payer dispute against you, but if you had answered it by quoting the paypal payment ID the strike would not have been issued and the feedback would not have been removed.

Also, did you mention disputes in the feedback...that is grounds for it to be removed.

[*crikey*mate*]

the 5 star postage thing just occurred to me.

it is a flaw, BUT

Postage and freight are TWO completely different things.

The DSR's specifically ask you to rate the POSTAGE rate, and because there was no postage, it was free, so 5 stars.

The feedback DSR's aren't asking you to rate freight costs.

Could this be why the feedback was removed? because the word postage was used in the feedback?