SHILL BIDDING

[skyrider12-au]

How difficult is it to prove shill bidding? I have been bidding on items, all listed in the same category, and all listed by the same seller. The opening prices are all rediculously low and the first bid is nearly always made by the same id - nothing wrong with that I suppose - Three or for bids are made, very early in the auction and again, all by the same ids. A few mins before closing time I will make my bid and straight away I am outbid, more than likely by a sniping tool, and all too often by an id that has a very high % of dealing with the seller. I have compared all the bidding ids and found that they all have high %ages with this seller - one has 100% with a total of winning transactions in excess of 100, another has 65% for 40 something transactions. A few days after the closure of the auction an identical listing is made of the same item by the same seller ........?  Am I paranoid about sniping tools or is this possibly shill bidding? Would EB investigate this sort of information - or simply do Zip?

[horizon1907]

What is the item Number ? Do not give out the seller ID.

[dithommo]

I have notice similar patterns on numerous occaisions, I often bid on a popular 2nd hand item when ever it appears as an auction (occaisionally I will buy it now if a reasonable price).  I would often make an early opening bid and then set a max bid about $5 lower than my final amount that I am prepared to pay.  If the ending time of the item is convieniant for me (I am a working class slave) I will watch last few minutes of auction. Even if my max bid has not been exceeded by another bidder I will increase my max bid by approx $5 with about 30 seconds to go. Sometimes it works to catch out a shill bidder - recon I have beaten a couple at thier own game recently. The other issue would be that if some one was looking at the same item and tracking my bidding you may well think I am a shill bidder (note I am saying it might appear, I certainily get as peeved as you). For the most part whilst it is annoying they will still have to pay the eBay fees on the total sale price with postage unless they cancel the sale which would make it even easier to track the recalcitrant seller/bidder.

[skyrider12-au]

Thanks Horizon - a more recent number 141513675860.

[horizon1907]

Going by what I see, I would avoid anyway. Take a closer look at what they say in repies re  NEG. Just my opinion.

[horizon1907]

+ there are a few to many Bid Retractions from a couple that would ring alarm bells. Again, my opinion only.

[skyrider12-au]

Thanks again H - I did look at the negs, sometime back and rather briefly. I have had another good look now and see what you mean. Interesting that one of his negs seems to have sumasaulted to be an "excellent " buyer during Dec.Although in all fairness Im not altogether sure that I know how those secret ids work and it may not be the same person - just someone sharing the same *** Your opinion is appreciated.

[kopenhagen5]

Aside, sniping tools usually bid in the dying seconds of an auction. That defeats a shiller.

Shill bidding usually happens when someone pushes up the auction at the begining giving the buyer a chance to bid again.

Sniping tools are often used so shillers don't have time to nibble bid up the price.

If an account has all of the following, I suspect shilling, otherwise it often appears as shilling but isn't.

1. High percentage of bids with one seller.

2. If those bids are on totally unrelated items and rare that one bidder would bid on those different types.

3. More then 2-3 retractions.

[horizon1907]

Id's are alway like that. Only the seller can see them. I think it's up to you if you wish to buy.

[skyrider12-au]

Kopenhagen - thanks for your input. I agree with all you say however, if a seller hasn't reached his (undisclosed) reserve and doesn't want to quit his item then shill bidding, to an amount he is willing to sell at, would achieve an outcome the seller would be happy with.