Seller sent what I'm pretty sure are counterfeit shoes, what are my chances of getting a refund.?

[hellogoodbuy_au]

So I bought a pair of shoes from the UK.  I was VERY confident with sizing because I have a pair that I bought from an actual store here in Melbourne.  They should have been the same.  They were a couple of seasons ago and I can't get the originals here anymore so I bought from the UK.

Anyway, even though the sizing is marked as exactly as my pair.... I DID NOT make a mistake... they are at least 1.5 sizes too small.  So that got me thinking.  This brand would have very good quality control, this really whacked sizing is a red flag to being fakes.

So I notice a couple of other differences, and I am also now convinced that they are not genuine leather.

The seller accepts returns for change of mind, but I feel I did not make a mistake with sizing so I don't think I should pay the return post, which is about $25.  So I opened a case NAD stating that they are not leather and not genuine.  The seller is a fairly big player I think, and they state they have documentation to show they are genuine from the company (but haven't shown it to me).  But they haven't accepted the return yet.  I didn't dare mention about the sizing.  How is this going to play out if I escalate?  

Even if they are genuine, I don't think I could even sell these on, the sizing is so out.

[davewil1964]

The seller could well be correct -

Australian and UK shoe sizes are different according to the above.

You THINK the size is wrong so you are going to claim counterfeit rather than admit you might have made a mistake?

[hellogoodbuy_au]

No I didn't make a mistake, they are the same shoe marked EU40/UK7/US10.  THE SAME.  It's an international brand.

Also, the seller didn't provide measurements.  There's no indication to expect these are smaller sizing than normal.

[kopenhagen5]

The seller has negative feedback for incorrect sizing.

Whether fakes or not, one should read feedback before purchasing.

If escalated eBay will probably favour the buyer but returning the item will be a condition.

[hellogoodbuy_au]

They have 2 neg feedbacks for sizing out of almost 700 in 12 months.  That's hardly fair.  Not the same brand either. 

[kopenhagen5]

A good seller won't have any negs other than what could look like ambiguous.

Two negs for sizing and the seller also has a neutral for sizing.

Not blaming you but for anyone reading here, one needs to really look at feedback before buying. Granted it takes an extra 5 mins but prevents most potential problems.

You should be ok through the case.

[digital*ghost]

A sizing discrepancy between a pair bought in Aus and a pair bought in the UK is probably not enough to be sure something is fake, as there are a lot of ways this can happen (mislabelling, rebranding after import, factory issues - Docs is a good example since we're speaking of shoes. Most are now manufactured in China and Thailand, and only the more expensive originals line are now made in England. The ones manufactured in China / Thailand are genuine, but much lower quality). 

Brands often change the sizing, too. A seller I know sells a well-known brand of clothing and the company decided to change all of their sizing down - eg an XXL now is the same size as an XL used to be. Cost reduction measures. If someone bought a shirt a year or two before the change, and went with the same size after, they were going to be surprised / disappointed. 

Just re: reselling them (if it comes to that), it's not impossible if you describe and measure them accurately.

[gutterpunkz05]

Using this logic, maybe your original pair are the fakes.

[lyndal1838]

Apart from your opinion that the shoes are not genuine, what proof have you got that they are fakes?

Usually whn you accuse a seller of sending fakes you have to provide written proof of the fact.

Also the seller does not have to prove they are genuine to you....if they present that proof to ebay they will win the dispute.

[springyzone]

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@davewil1964 wrote:

The seller could well be correct -

Australian and UK shoe sizes are different according to the above.

You THINK the size is wrong so you are going to claim counterfeit rather than admit you might have made a mistake?

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I understand where hellogoodbuy is coming from. I don't think she was confused with what actual size to buy as she stated they were the same as the previous pair. That doesn't mean that what she bought are counterfeit shoes but it does point to what DG said-that the quality of a brand over time can differ.

Just as an aside, that table above is just one of several you can find on the internet I know. It's very common. But I don't believe it is accurate. I bought a well known brand of shoes using that conversion chart on the seller's page-for a pair of fit flops US size 10. They are not the equivalent of Aust size 10 at all. They don't fit my daughter or daughter in law (both size 10's) . They do fit another friend who takes size Aust 9. I once found a similar thing when I bought US sized shoes-needed to move up a size.

For that reason, I think buying shoes on the internet & not in a store can be a bit dicey, even with the conversion charts.