Who to trust?

[banf15]

After recently having lost $300 buying gold ( that turned out to be fake ) from Chinese sellers with their location shown as Australia. Lost because I handed the items over to the police as the fake hallmarks were fraudulent rather than returning them for a refund where they would be sold to some other unsuspecting buyer. I found myself in another situation today.

I had purchased 2 pieces of gold jewellery with rubies and had paid promptly within the hour. Within 24 hrs the seller from Australia emailed me to say the items were in fact gold filled rather than solid gold as they had been described. In fact I was told that eBAy policy allows sellers to use the term solid gold for items that are in fact only gold filled. The seller was afraid that my discovering the items were only gold filled would lead to negative feedback so offered to cancel the sale and refund my money.

There is also the chance that the items are in fact genuine as they were described as having genuine hallmarks. Selling items with fake hallmarks would be a crime....fraud. So perhaps the seller was not happy with the final price and concocted a story to get me to agree to the cancellation.

The end result being nobody selling jewellery on eBay can be trusted, neither eBay nor the seller ( as this most frequent seller had 100% feedback rating). I frequently read about sellers complaints about buyers on this forum and yet we the buyers appear to be the ones constantly being shafted.

[davewil1964]

If you are still within the Paypal timeframe, open a dispute. When they tell you to send the items back, forward them copies of the paperwork you received from the police. And remind them that sending counterfeit items through the mail is an offence.

You should get your money back. If Paypal don't come to the party, come back here. There are some very knowledgeable members here who can advise you further.

[fixnwear]

banf, the only way you'll get your money back, if you haven't already accepted cancellation is to make a claim through PP.

You'll have to send the items back, fake or not - as they are not your property, nor is it up to you what seller does with it after they give your money back. And it is not against the law to post them, nor indeed to have them in your possession.

How many people did you see arrested for walking around with a fake handbag and wearing a gold filled chain that is hallmarked?

Also, it'll be onus on you to prove to PP that they are fake (if they are).

And just for your info, if it helps - most of the cheap national jewellery stores sell 9K plated garbage, all those around $100-200 per item (when normally should cost much more), all hall marked,  with stock almost without exception comming from China. Buy one, get it vallued and you'll see that the value is not even half of what you paid for.

[jerryman12a]

You cannot legally send fake items through the mail. so because you handed them ( the gold)  in to the Police and they were deemed fake you should be able to get a report from them to give to PayPal who then will take action against the seller ( for the gold)

If PayPal give you grief , tell them your next step is the Ombudsman that usually gets action. Even it it's outside the claim area I would have a go as the thread of both a Police report and the Omb might just jolt PP into action .

To be honest just because something has a Hallmark it means very little if it isn't purchased from a reputable seller and preferably through a Bricks & Mortar store .

Having said that I've bought many a piece of jewellery mainly from Thailand on ebay that is as described. You just learn to sus out the genuine sellers .

I've seen jewellery being 'stamped' right in front of me on Asian markets and passed on as genuine 😄

To buy gold , your only option is to go via the Perth Mint or visit a B & M dealer , there are some decent sellers out there on ebay if your after say a Gold Sovereign etc but for Bullion it's just not worth the risk to buy online.

[phorum_junkie*]

Just having a crime number from the police should be enough for you to get your money back through Paypal as long as you opened a dispute within the 45 day period.

If it is longer than that and you funded your payment with a credit or Visa debit card you can ask your bank to do a chargeback.

[i-once-was-bump]

banf, the only way you'll get your money back, if you haven't already accepted cancellation is to make a claim through PP.

You'll have to send the items back, fake or not - as they are not your property, nor is it up to you what seller does with it after they give your money back. And it is not against the law to post them, nor indeed to have them in your possession.

How many people did you see arrested for walking around with a fake handbag and wearing a gold filled chain that is hallmarked?

Also, it'll be onus on you to prove to PP that they are fake (if they are).

And just for your info, if it helps - most of the cheap national jewellery stores sell 9K plated garbage, all those around $100-200 per item (when normally should cost much more), all hall marked,  with stock almost without exception comming from China. Buy one, get it vallued and you'll see that the value is not even half of what you paid for.

I am sure you are trying to be helpful but giving such erroneous advice doesn't do your reputation any good, whatsoever.

Writing what you think does not mean that you are writing worthwhile and correct information.

Please be very careful when giving advice about the legalities of fakes and forgeries because you are not the one that will be $300 out of pocket.

[fixnwear]

Ha, ha, ha.... wait til I put on my bulletproof vest first!

As for trying to be helpful, I am, more so and to the point than all those advising OP how it's illegal to return fakes through the post, and how he can demand the refund without returning the items!

Rubbish!

He's of course very welcome to try doing it that way.

The only things that PO would be worried about are explosives, missiles, biological weapons and any other weapons of mass destruction.

And PP is likewise. Not only that, but they also have a habbit of demanding a concrete proof that something is a fake.

The best OP will get away with is a claim for signifantly not as described, he'll have to post it back and get a refund.

[lyndal1838]

The only things that PO would be worried about are explosives, missiles, biological weapons and any other weapons of mass destruction.

If you think those are the only items that cannot be sent through the postal system, you need to do a bit of reading.  The list on the AP website is a little more comprehensive than that.

[davewil1964]

The OP has concrete proof the item is a fake - the police report.

I'd also advise you to check with AP - sending counterfeit items through the post is a CRIMINAL offence. As is selling them. People walking around wearing or carrying them does not affect the legality of the matter. I'm also sure the market people who get their entire inventory confiscated and are prosecuted on top of that would be interested to know it's no biggie.

And Paypal will cave when threatened with the Ombudsman anyway, especially as the OP has concrete proof.

[fixnwear]

dave, having a police report is not a concrete proof that something is gold filled rathered than gold.

Police would also require a proof that the item you are reporting is not what it's supposed to be, they are not experts nor authorised jevewellery valuers. Neither is the Ombudsman office.

I can't see the point of this debate as it's very easy to obtain valuation from any jeveller, much easier that getting proof that a handbag is a fake as no store is villing to put it in writing.

It comes down to item being not as described, in PO's case, he sends it back, gets a refund - end of story.

And using this garbage about being illegal to post as an excuse to hold onto someone else's property is low act, it would amount to theft if  one gets full refund for it - as that information is not correct.

Oh, and linda, I forgot animal and human remains in my  prhibited list(or even live ones).

I'll leave you to it good people, I'm off to have another great day!