those crazy chinese

[davidc4430]

i bought an item from a chinese seller for $1

he advertised this item as 4pcs for $1, these are easily found at around $2.50 for 4 so at $1 was a good price.

so after waiting 2 months my items arrive, but not 4 only 1.

so i leave a very rare negative feedback.

so far ive had 4 messages begging me to remove the feedback. hes offered a full refund.

me, i think sellers need to adhear to their edverts so i will not remove the feedback.

on checking his feedback hes got 18 negs and 22 neutrals and 2217 positives in 1 month, i'm wondering if all the non positives are getting his sob story about it hurting his business which is his only way to support his family.

[digital*ghost]

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@kopenhagen5 wrote:

And photo.

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Yup, but that doesn't mean the seller is a rich guy out to scam the OP for $1, when they wouldn't have got to keep even half that. Could have easily been seller error. I'm not into sob stories, so I wouldn't pay that too much mind from a seller, but can I interest you in some of the many stories of Chinese sellers who have gone above and beyond to fix issues at their own expense, to temper the bias? 

[kopenhagen5]

Undoubtedly there are the genuine Chinese sellers whom know what it is about.

Far too few as I have experienced, not just online.

Unfortunately gain at all costs has become part of their way of life with such competition internally.

And politeness has never been their strong suit.

That is the result of over populated Nations, China, India just to name the obvious.

The world needs to be careful. China has eaten many species to extinction, no longer has fresh air in many areas and have learnt to look outside of China to continue their ways.

It sounds like a corny line from a movie, but they are taking over the world and not in a planet managed manner.

[davidc4430]

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@countessalmirena wrote:

David, it was the fish tank clip, yes?

Hmm. The listing certainly states that it's 4 pieces, both in the title AND twice in the body of the listing.

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sorry i havent replied sooner.

yes it was the fish tank clip, and i felt the seller was using listing techniques to tricka buyer into believeing he was selling 4 of the item when in reality he was selling 1.

as i mentioned 4 for $1 was a good price but 1 for $1 was about double the price for 4 from other sellers. not a bargain as the advertisement seemed. and the time for delivery, a very long time to wait just to discover i was fooled.

i left the neg to warn others this seller uses trick tactics as if i dont others may get caught.

i dont want a refund to 'make the neg go away'

i want the seller to learn to make listings correct.

if 1 neg kills his store then hes really not doing a very good job.

but he has quite a few negs and neutrals. i didnt read every one but for a seller not selling 10s of thousands of items he seems to be getting a lot of unhappy buyers.

maybe instead of sending numerous begging emails he could just introduce better selling practices?

[digital*ghost]

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@kopenhagen5 wrote:

Undoubtedly there are the genuine Chinese sellers whom know what it is about.

Far too few as I have experienced, not just online.

Unfortunately gain at all costs has become part of their way of life with such competition internally.

And politeness has never been their strong suit.

That is the result of over populated Nations, China, India just to name the obvious.

The world needs to be careful. China has eaten many species to extinction, no longer has fresh air in many areas and have learnt to look outside of China to continue their ways.

It sounds like a corny line from a movie, but they are taking over the world and not in a planet managed manner.

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I am not denying that there aren't some problems in China, even if I had not casually immersed myself in their history and culture for the last 20+ years, it's evident enough just on these forums that some issues are prevalent.

I took issue with your post because you didn't even consider the possibility that the seller had made a mistake, and the way it was written, it seemed apparent to me that you didn't consider that possibility because the seller was Chinese. There's a word for that. 

[digital*ghost]

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@davidc4430 wrote:

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yes it was the fish tank clip, and i felt the seller was using listing techniques to tricka buyer into believeing he was selling 4 of the item when in reality he was selling 1.

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"Why be informed when you can use your feelings as facts?"

There's a T shirt for that (courtesy Philip Defranco). 

[Anonymous]

He should have offered to send you the other three rather than offer to refund.  That would have sounded a lot more genuine, but obviously he didn't want to send four for that price, which means you're probably right and that it was deliberate.  A lot of them seem to work on the basis that it's only a small amount so people will just wear it.

[kopenhagen5]

I took issue with your post because you didn't even consider the possibility that the seller had made a mistake, and the way it was written, it seemed apparent to me that you didn't consider that possibility because the seller was Chinese. There's a word for that. 

No, I did think of that possibility and after scrolling through the feedback (not counting the potential unreasonable buyer feedback) and seeing the listing remained unchanged decided it is a likely scenario of hooking. I also noticed that when you select the size, you are then shown a photo of one unit.

I have purchased 2 of the items which will be David's christmas present so I should receive 8 clips.

Confident I will receive 2.

I must admit I used the opportunity to voice my growing concerns and should take note to keep on topic more. Your post has reminded me to not voice my experiences and opinions so openly having developed confidence in the regulars understanding and knowing me here. And my post didn't consider others reading here for perhaps the first time. So I thank you for that.

[digital*ghost]

Kopes, I have interacted with you on these forums for a couple of years, and have always respected you. I don't know you on a remotely personal level, and probably not even near as well as some other posters do, but I'm not blind and I genuinely believe you are a valued contributor, and I want to make that clear because your recent posts have surprised me, because of how I know you to be. 

I am not here to try and police what people think or post, but at the same time, I do think that if someone needs to know you to understand with perfect clarity where you are coming from and the points you're making, maybe there's a different way you can make those points, rather than suppress them. 

[davidc4430]

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@kopenhagen5 wrote:

I took issue with your post because you didn't even consider the possibility that the seller had made a mistake, and the way it was written, it seemed apparent to me that you didn't consider that possibility because the seller was Chinese. There's a word for that. 

No, I did think of that possibility and after scrolling through the feedback (not counting the potential unreasonable buyer feedback) and seeing the listing remained unchanged decided it is a likely scenario of hooking. I also noticed that when you select the size, you are then shown a photo of one unit.

I have purchased 2 of the items which will be David's christmas present so I should receive 8 clips.

Confident I will receive 2.

I must admit I used the opportunity to voice my growing concerns and should take note to keep on topic more. Your post has reminded me to not voice my experiences and opinions so openly having developed confidence in the regulars understanding and knowing me here. And my post didn't consider others reading here for perhaps the first time. So I thank you for that.

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you didnt did you?

as it happens i ordered what i'm hoping will be a set of 4 from another seller straight after posting the neg on this sellers.

i needed 4 not 1 and had he been clear i would not have purchased from him knowing id get only 1.

https://www.ebay.com.au/itm/4PCS-Plastic-Clips-Glass-Cover-Support-Holder-Aquarium-Fish-Tank-6-8-10-...

this one is clearly saying hes selling 4 for just over $2, fingers crossed.

i did buy 4 of these once before but when i checked that seller he no longer was listing them, i would have happily purchased again.

[countessalmirena]

Kopenhagen, I greatly respect you and your posts as they are thoughtful, honest and gentlemanly; ditto with digital*ghost, who is perhaps the most well-reasoned and one of the kindest poster on these boards. (That isn't to take anything away from several other posters who are also logical and well-versed in critical thinking, and still more others who are kind and helpful without measure, and those who de-gut problems posted on the boards with fast and accurate advice, and those whose sometimes subtle and sometimes custard-pie-in-the-face humour can make me roar (in a delicate, ladylike way, naturally) with laughter.)

(If any of you have information to the contrary about the decibel level of that laughter, I deny it*, and I have wiped away any incriminating splashes of coffee near my computer, so good luck with proving that charge!)

*

Spoiler

When it comes to Chinese sellers, the main issue that concerns me is that the current Chinese government-endorsed view on IP and copyright is "If you invent it, design it,  own it, we can copy it." Undercutting by means of making cheap copies of brand items or high-end items (without real quality control and certainly without the copyright owners' permission) is not shameful in China.

For Chinese who leave China and who are living as permanent residents here in Australia, they have a different world view to adapt to, just as Australians who leave Australia and who live as residents in China would have a different world view to which they need to adapt.

It wouldn't be correct to say that the Chinese have no honour or are less to be trusted than Australians. Each culture will define certain elements of behaviour, ethics, and legality according to their history and unique perspective. That's not even going into whether the average Australian is honest and law-abiding, to show the other side of the coin. A quick look at local news would show the naïveté of that!

Spoiler

• In the western world, the notion of paying a composer for re-using their music is fairly recent. Either Lully "borrowed" from Purcell or Purcell "borrowed" from Lully the melodic, rhythmic and harmonic components of Purcell's famous "Cold Genius" aria - and neither acknowledged it. Vivaldi regularly pilfered melodies from other composers and reworked them. Handel did so. It was rife in mediaeval music, and no one thought for an instant that it was a disgrace. Musicians performed works without any thought of paying a fee to the composer.
• Late Antiquity - local copies of Roman goods were made without any hint of the Roman "designer" being acknowledged either in words or with money. The Romans could hardly complain; they were masters at turning out copies of Greek statues and vases, also without any notion of compensation or even of declaring that the copies were not Greek originals. It was tacitly understood... but that's scarcely compensation.
• Seamstresses during the 1700s and 1800s would frequently make copies of the gowns in, for instance, La Belle Assemblée, and no one shouted "Pay the designers".

On an individual basis, any person, irrespective of culture or background, is capable of fraud, and also capable of integrity. On an individual basis, any person may have admirable qualities and may be respected and trusted. These are things not intrinsic to any one race or culture. (I'm getting perilously close to saying in that nauseating self-righteous way, "Some of my best friends are [insert race, sex, etc.]")

Spoiler

We will probably see a huge change in the quality of goods that are "made in China" over the next 10 years. China has large ambitions to see it happen. However, that will probably not be to the west's advantage - primarily because China is going to continue to demand rights to access technology (and make that access a legal right) if companies outside China want to tap into China's market - without in any way allowing companies to retain all rights to their IP.

But at present, China is (I think) one of the most robust countries in the world in taking other people's ideas and inventions and using them for its advantage in producing cheap knock-offs. Buying China-made when the quality control is rigorously set by a company is one thing. As long as the company sets the standard and doesn't allow the factory/factories to mess with those quality controls, all is fine. But if that factory or any other in China takes the design and messes with it to produce the cheapest possible version without that quality control, the result is (predictably) something that doesn't meet the original company's standards, and may even be unsafe. It certainly bites into the original company's profits, and it certainly ends up being purchased in the millions by people who think they're getting a great deal...

I believe we are seeing the inevitable result of moving manufacturing to offshore countries where, because of low wages and very different views about workers' rights, production costs become a great deal cheaper. It was always going to come back to bite us on the derrière.