on 02-04-2014 07:24 PM - last edited on 02-04-2014 07:39 PM by li.vish
The list of what ifs is endless on this one
http://www.sbs.com.au/news/article/2014/04/02/high-court-recognises-third-category-gender
A Sydneysider has won a High Court case to be recognised as gender-neutral.
Norrie, who was born male but underwent gender reassignment to become a woman, identifies neither as male or female and has taken legal action against NSW's Registry of Births, Deaths and Marriages to be granted a non-specific certificate.
The court was asked to consider whether "non-specific" can be included as a third gender category under the Registry's Act.
"The act recognises that a person may be neither male nor female, and so permits the registration of a person's sex as 'non specific'," read the High Court judgment, handed down on Wednesday.
Norrie, who goes by one name, was famously granted a world-first non-specific status in 2010, but months later the NSW government revoked the classification.
The matter was challenged by both Norrie and the Registry until the latter took an appeal to the High Court.
Lawyers for the Registry argued that unacceptable confusion would flow from the acceptance of more than two gender categories, and that the purpose of a reaffirmation procedure is to assist a person to be considered a member of the opposite sex.
Norrie stopped taking hormones after surgery, preferring to live as neither male nor female.
Counsel for Norrie said it is the register's purpose to record the truth.
"Norrie's sex remained ambiguous so that it would be to record misinformation in the register to classify her as male or female," a judgment summary reads.
Sitting in Canberra on Wednesday, the bench unanimously found in favour of Norrie.
"The act does not require that people who, having undergone a sex affirmation procedure ... must be registered, inaccurately, as one or the other," the court found.
Norrie's application for non-specific status should now be reconsidered by the Registry in accordance with the court's finding, the judgment said.
The Registry must pay Norrie's costs of the High Court appeal.
Norrie said other people wanting to identify as a non-specific gender had made contact.
"Many other people let me know they wanted do that (identify as non-specific) in Australia and indeed around the world," Norrie told reporters in Sydney.
"Maybe people will understand there's more options than the binary."
Norrie's solicitor, Scott McDonald, said the decision was likely to have similar repercussions in Queensland and Victoria, which have similar state legislation to NSW.
"It'll be binding on the states that have identical or similar legislation" he told reporters.
And for states such as Western Australia, with very different legislation, the judgment has sent a message the High Court doesn't think gender is limited to male and female.
Norrie was born a man in Scotland and had gender reassignment surgery in the late 1980s.
Norrie said the legal battle had taken a personal toll, but it was the lawyers who had done most of the hard work.
on 03-04-2014 03:07 AM
About 30 years ago I lived in a share house and one of my housemates was a pre-op transsexual. She was born a male and, at that time candidates for sexual reassignment surgery were required to live as their preferred gender for at least 12 months prior to surgery.
She identified herself as female and requested we treat her as such. Which we did.
Life was not easy for her in the 80s. I expect life is not easy for transsexuals now. It is very easy to make jokes at the expense of transsexuals, but I would like to remind those who do that transsexuals are people and deserve to be treated with respect.
In the 70s and 80s it was considered socially acceptable to make jokes about dagos and wogs and abbos and homos. These jokes are socially unacceptable now. It takes a lot of courage for a person to have gender reassignment surgery, and it eludes me why, in the 21st century, we choose to denigrate these people rather than celebrate their courage.
on 03-04-2014 05:06 AM
About 7 years ago, a male high school student came back from the Xmas school holidays dressed as a female and was in the 12 month living-as-a-female stage. The toilet issue was the greatest concern. Mainly due to his/her not liking being classed as "disabled".
I am not sure what was the outcome. But the situation went pretty high up within the Department.
DEB
on 03-04-2014 05:18 AM
Imagine the Public Conveniences door signs. The ones with words are hard enough; let alone the symbolic ones.
HIM; HER; DISABLED; HIM2HER; HER2HIM;
Frankly, in the past, I've used the Mens due to the lengthy queues for the Ladies. It was just a relief.
DEB
on 03-04-2014 07:11 AM
Gotta love ......the hypocritical nanny state judges in action and as witnessed from the judgement quoted in the OP
"Norrie's sex remained ambiguous so that it would be to record misinformation in the register to classify her as male or female," a judgment summary reads.
absolutely LMAO
on 03-04-2014 08:17 AM
@2106greencat wrote:What public 'rest room' do they use ?? Legally ??
Just wondering...........
It's not illegal to use a rest room not of your gender. Anyone can use any toilet.
But either way, all businesses and property now have unisex toilets in their accessible WCs. And more businesses are opting for standard unisex toilets generally.
on 03-04-2014 11:49 AM
I don't see what the problem is? Perhaps those hung up on other's genetalia and gender need to broaden their horizons. Which toilet to use is such a minor thing compared to the stigma attached to those who are either transexual or intersex.
on 05-04-2014 02:23 PM
interesting wonder what this has cost us and what it will cost in the future as all forms etc have to be changed just to please one person
wonder if this non gender person works or are we all paying for their life style my guess is we are paying for their lifestyle
so what do you call this person as how do you address them it/him/her/she/he/shim/ or what?
on 05-04-2014 02:29 PM
@sarah308 wrote:interesting wonder what this has cost us and what it will cost in the future as all forms etc have to be changed just to please one person
wonder if this non gender person works or are we all paying for their life style my guess is we are paying for their lifestyle
so what do you call this person as how do you address them it/him/her/she/he/shim/ or what?
address them according to their wishes. the whims of bigots.. how much do they cost us ?
05-04-2014 02:31 PM - edited 05-04-2014 02:33 PM
@lakeland27 wrote:
@sarah308 wrote:interesting wonder what this has cost us and what it will cost in the future as all forms etc have to be changed just to please one person
wonder if this non gender person works or are we all paying for their life style my guess is we are paying for their lifestyle
so what do you call this person as how do you address them it/him/her/she/he/shim/ or what?
address them according to their wishes. the whims of bigots.. how much do they cost us ?
r u saying that you are a bigot and you cost us .. is that right and i am reading that correctly am i not yes i am
you are so adorable for a cuddly leftie
on 05-04-2014 02:33 PM
Good for him.
Its doesnt affect me either way.