Mandatory Vaccination: Would you support it?

https://www.theage.com.au/world/south-america/brazilian-supreme-court-rules-against-covid-anti-vaxxe...

 

Does the collective health for all trump the right of individuals?

 

Discuss

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Re: Mandatory Vaccination: Would you support it?


@eol-products wrote:

Staff are meant to get a flu shot but some who have had reactions in the past are able to avoid getting one.


Do they have to remain masked at all times, if they don't get the vaccine? That's how it works here for the most part. Since Covid, they usually have to have a full shield with hood and neck gaiter as well as a mask. 

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Even vaccinated staff will have to wear ppe because it is appears they can still be carriers and transmit the virus.

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@lyndal1838 wrote:

Springy, I am in Sydney and I feel we need to put the whole of Sydney into lockdown for at least several weeks, not the 4 days that has been imposed on the Northern Beaches.

 

We started off well.....I am in hospital in Southern Sydney, so well away from the current clusters but at 4pm on Friday ALL hospital staff donned masks....from the top doctors to the cleaners, no exceptions.  However, here we are at Sunday morning and it is about 50/50.

 

The emphasis seems to be on relaxing the restrictions before Christmas which I think is a terrible mistake.

 

 


Wow, I am amazed    .... ALL our hospital staff here and in Hamilton hospital must wear masks at work

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@the_bob_delusion wrote:

Would you rather go to a doctor who choose not to be vaccinated or go to one who is? 


@icyfroth wrote

 

Huh? I don't use that criteria to choose my doctor.


I'm the same as you on that one icyfroth, I wouldn't use that as an influencer. But thinking more on this, a doctor that decided against taking the vaccine would be someone who thinks independntly and less likely to be a drone or salesman for big pharma.  Yes, some are and some have been "sprung" in the past. That's another story for another topic.

 

I want the doctor who is going to look at the bigger picture and give me the best for my buck.

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Re: Mandatory Vaccination: Would you support it?

springyzone, NSW has definitely had superior contact tracing.

 

  • The team there have been able not only to contact people with a positive test result within 24 hours, but also their close contacts within a very good timeframe.
  • Additionally (and importantly) ,the NSW contact tracing team have been able to devote resources to upstream investigation, not just downstream. (In other words, not just who might possibly be infectious now, but tracing it back to the source which means clamping down hard on further seeding from that source.)

 

In contrast, Victoria's contact tracing team were overwhelmed even at ~30 new cases a day. The claim by DHHS that they were getting to between 95% and 100% of new cases within 24 hours was simply not true. It has been established that DHHS were defensive and preferred to hide their errors rather than admit them and accept help. It's improved now, but what a tragedy that it took the loss of so many lives to make that happen.

 

 

I hope that the Northern Beaches cluster has not spread into Greater Sydney. If it has, I don't think that the current restrictions will be enough. We can only hope that it is relatively contained - but if I were living in Sydney, I would be bracing myself.

 

Holy cheddar and a nun, who'd have thought two months ago that we in Victoria (and specifically in Melbourne) would think ourselves lucky to be here in Melbourne, rolling doughnuts all the way to Christmas...?

 

 

__________________________________________________________________

 

 

❝The system [Salesforce] allows faster and more accurate contact tracing and case management through a number of measures, including:

  • automatically uploading positive test results from the DHHS database in near-real-time
  • reducing manual input time
  • providing scripts and prompts for contact tracers to ensure they have asked all questions
  • allowing for prompts when a case needs to be actioned within a timeframe, including escalation to managers if this is not actioned
  • facilitating a central end-to-end system record management process which allows overview of the entire matter
  • sending automatic text message communications
  • assigning cases to have a single case manager on an entire household

 

The significance of having a database which can support end-to-end contact tracing was explained by Dr Finkel:

 

                   It can help at every phase. Pop-up test sites initially used paper forms for collecting patient information and tracking the test sample. When the numbers are high processing these paper forms leads to significant delays and the likelihood of data entry errors. A modern system based on digital data collection and digitally tracking the data all the way through and into the contact-tracing system is much more efficient and less error-prone. For contact tracing confirmed cases are allocated to a contract-tracing officer to call the patient and interview them to identify their close contacts and then alert those close contacts that they have been exposed and must start quarantine. These interviews often take up to an hour. Traditionally the cases are allocated manually to the contact-tracing officers and interview details are recorded on paper and then subsequently manually entered into a database to assist with follow-up. This manual process works at low numbers but is easily overwhelmed when the case numbers are high. Moving to digital allocation of jobs and digitally prompted and digitally recorded case interviews is much more efficient and less error-prone.¹²⁵

 

By expediting these processes, the CRM system has put Victoria in a better position to manage an influx of cases moving forward by better keeping up with incoming cases and identifying and contacting primary contacts within the recommended 48-hour window:

 

                   ... the first rule of contact tracing is do not let it get away from you. That has to be, if you like, front and centre, the core value that is necessary, and unfortunately that is what happened in that second wave...I do not know what the upper limit would be at the moment, but I suspect when you get up between 100 and 200 cases a day you are probably taxing even the best of systems globally. With IT and other things and a large workforce of several thousand people you can probably extend it even higher..¹²⁶

 

[...]

 

¹²⁵ Dr Alan Finkel AO, Transcript of evidence, p. 2.

¹²⁶ Professor Julian Rait, Transcript of evidence, p. 7.❞

 

_________________________________________________________________

 

– Legislative Council Legal and Social Issues Committee. (2020). Inquiry into the Victorian Government’s COVID–19 contact tracing system and testing regime (pp. 73-74). Victoria: Parliament of Victoria. Retrieved from https://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/images/stories/committees/SCLSI/Inquiry_into_the_Victorian_Governm...

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I want my doctor to adhere to best practice.

 

Which with aerial transportable diseases, means vaccination or PPE.

 

You might think that a 'doctor' that doesn't take these basic precautions is pushing back at 'big pharma'. I think they should be deregistered. That Hippocratic oath thing.

 

Of course, you might well consider that Loius Pasteur was a captive of 'big pharma'. If 'big pharma' existed in the 19th century. And Pasteur's discoveries hadn't saved millions of lives.

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@lalbo-81 wrote:

@icyfroth wrote:

@the_bob_delusion wrote:

@icyfroth wrote:
No but they have ways. Like denying you employment if you refuse.

Would you rather go to a doctor who choose not to be vaccinated or go to one who is? 


Huh? I don't use that criteria to choose my doctor.


Wait. What? You don't verify that your doctor of choice is taking every precaution to protect you,the patient? That is a very peculiar way of thinking....


The Medical Practice where I visit my doctor takes quite strict Covid precautions. Is my Doctor vaccinated against Covid? No. because no such vaccine is available as yet. Is she vaccinated against the 'flu?

 

I don't know, but if she isn't, I would consider it her choice, just as it is mine. As it is, I've had the Fluvax so I should be safe against the 'flu, don't you think?

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@not_for_sale2025 wrote:

Even vaccinated staff will have to wear ppe because it is appears they can still be carriers and transmit the virus.


Good point! Yes, this is indeed a concern. Vaccinated people can still transmit virus. Now take a vaccine that has been rushed out in months without the years it takes to test it. That's a worry! Now we know that some Big Pharma companies don't do the right thing in testing. Former Merck exec Brandy Vaughan who died this month at age 47 spilt the beans on what goes on or doesn't go on.

With a rushed vaccine, who knows what can be breathed out. I would rather take my chances with an unvaccinated staff member who practices good hygene and nutrition.

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Re: Mandatory Vaccination: Would you support it?


@davewil1964 wrote:

I want my doctor to adhere to best practice.

 

Which with aerial transportable diseases, means vaccination or PPE.

 

You might think that a 'doctor' that doesn't take these basic precautions is pushing back at 'big pharma'. I think they should be deregistered. That Hippocratic oath thing.

 

Of course, you might well consider that Loius Pasteur was a captive of 'big pharma'. If 'big pharma' existed in the 19th century. And Pasteur's discoveries hadn't saved millions of lives.

 


 Firstly davewil1964? please don't try to suggest I'm saying or believing something other than what I am.

 

I am not anti-vaccination! I believe in researching,  looking at a bigger picture and choosing which and which not to take!

 

And why bring Louis Pasteur into it?  *BIG SIGH* 

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images - 2020-12-10T120454.936.jpeg

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