People who do not vaccinate will lose $

[***super_nova***]

From January 2016 parents who do not vaccinate their kids will lose up to $15 000 in allowances/concessions, except in cases of medical  and some religious reasons. 

[k0llectable5]

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@polksaladallie wrote:

There was an anti vaccination woman on Laws this morning, stridently (why are they always that?) arguing her case.  She must have said six times that vaccines are made using aborted foetuses, inserting "is that what people want, killing babies so that they can be vaccinated?"

Laws is not bright enough to pick her up on that ridiculous statement, well he wouldn't have been able to get a word in anyway.  Whether or not any product is made from foetus cells, stem cells, umbilical cells, etc., they would not have come from procured aborted foetuses.  There are plenty of natural abortions if they were needed, but they are not.

Vaccine Myth #13: Vaccinations are made from aborted babies

http://www.drwalt.com/blog/2008/07/09/vaccine-myth-13-vaccinations-are-made-from-aborted-babies/

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So where do the human diploid cells come from?

[bluecat*dancing]

Unless there is a medical reason, have your kids vaccinated - regardless of whether you recieve rebates, pensions etc from the government - and keep your own boosters up to date. Simple really.

Those who are flippant about immunisation need to spend time in a hospital ward and experience first hand the harrowing experience of listening, and seeing, an infant struggling to breathe. I don't know if this baby survived.

Anyone who would willingly put their children at risk, unless there is a medical reason, needs a wake up call and a dose of reality.

[***super_nova***]

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@secondhand-wonderland wrote:

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, we currently have no way of knowing the long term effects this may have on some people.  

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Countries like Denmark have centralized record keeping for several decades, and their records were used for numerous studies. 

Any side effects that tiny minority of children experience is nothing comparing the damage the actual illness would do to them.  I believe it is those kids who do experience some reaction to the vaccine would also be the ones who would be most affected if they actually got the disease.  So, if your kid got slight fever from the shot, he would be probably the one to die if he actually got the disease.

Of-course, it would be preferable if we did not have to force people to vaccinate their children, but we cannot allow the whole system to collapse just because of few ignorant  people.  have you noticed how all those doctors who are advocating against vaccinations are doing pretty well out of it?  I consider them even more obnoxious than those charlatans peddling cancer treatments; the gullible people who abandon proper medical treatments only hurt themselves, people who do not vaccinate are threat to wide community.

[Anonymous]

So Isabella B on some blog site is a credible source for debunking Dr Humphries. Hmmm.

she was able to back her claims up with

credible sources - otherwise i wouldn't have

posted that information.

[k0llectable5]

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@polksaladallie wrote:

There was an anti vaccination woman on Laws this morning, stridently (why are they always that?) arguing her case.  She must have said six times that vaccines are made using aborted foetuses, inserting "is that what people want, killing babies so that they can be vaccinated?"

Laws is not bright enough to pick her up on that ridiculous statement, well he wouldn't have been able to get a word in anyway.  Whether or not any product is made from foetus cells, stem cells, umbilical cells, etc., they would not have come from procured aborted foetuses.  There are plenty of natural abortions if they were needed, but they are not.

Vaccine Myth #13: Vaccinations are made from aborted babies

http://www.drwalt.com/blog/2008/07/09/vaccine-myth-13-vaccinations-are-made-from-aborted-babies/

---

From wiki:

WI-38 is a diploid human cell culture line composed of fibroblasts derived from lung tissue of a three-month-old white (caucasian) female fetus. The cell line, isolated by Leonard Hayflick and Paul Moorhead in the 1960s, has been used extensively in scientific research, with applications ranging from developing important theories in molecular biology to the production of many types of vaccines. The contributions from this cell line on research has been credited with saving the lives of "millions of people".

So how do they get the cells? 

[polksaladallie]

Dunno, you tell me.

[azureline**]

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@***super_nova*** wrote:

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@secondhand-wonderland wrote:

---

, we currently have no way of knowing the long term effects this may have on some people.  

---

Countries like Denmark have centralized record keeping for several decades, and their records were used for numerous studies. 

Any side effects that tiny minority of children experience is nothing comparing the damage the actual illness would do to them.  I believe it is those kids who do experience some reaction to the vaccine would also be the ones who would be most affected if they actually got the disease.  So, if your kid got slight fever from the shot, he would be probably the one to die if he actually got the disease.

Of-course, it would be preferable if we did not have to force people to vaccinate their children, but we cannot allow the whole system to collapse just because of few ignorant  people.  have you noticed how all those doctors who are advocating against vaccinations are doing pretty well out of it?  I consider them even more obnoxious than those charlatans peddling cancer treatments; the gullible people who abandon proper medical treatments only hurt themselves, people who do not vaccinate are threat to wide community.

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Only some people are being "forced" if they want/need FTB and CCR.

It only matters to the parents of the children in that minority, it seems.

My "kid" didn't just get a slight fever, btw.

As for the doctors, I notice all of them are quite well off.

[gleee58]

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@secondhand-wonderland wrote:

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Thats a shame because honestly I would love you or someone, anyone to tell me how the sources I have named have been discredited, I have never said we dont need to vaccinate, but what I am saying is you cannot force vaccination onto unwilling people.  It's just wrong.  It's not a miracle shield from all infectious diseases and because of the adjuvants,  attenuated viruses, formeldehyde killed animal viruses, animal or human dna present in all vaccines and the massive increase of the schedule, we currently have no way of knowing the long term effects this may have on some people.  

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There is an enormous amount of information available that discredits the claims of the anti-vaxers.   Raed some of it.  And while you're at it read some current information about the content of current vaccinations because you have a lot of wrong information.  

When I had children I was wary of getting them vaccinated, however, all the available, reliable information suggested that there was more good than harm in the program and that the side effects of the disease were worse than the side effects of the vaccination.   I had forgetten about the eyesight damage measles can cause and didn't know about the strokes caused by chicken pox or the brain damage caused by seemingly harmless diseases.  

[k0llectable5]

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@*julia*2010 wrote:

So Isabella B on some blog site is a credible source for debunking Dr Humphries. Hmmm.

she was able to back her claims up with

credible sources - otherwise i wouldn't have

posted that information.

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True. It was researched and well footnoted.   Her quoted studies are not the only studies that have been done though.  

I urge people to research the history of the small pox vaccination, measles vaccination, polio vaccination and the effects these have had on indigenous communities and google "Every second child" by Archie Kalokerinos.  His work is controversial but his vaccination studies are extensive and fascinating.  Or google Kihura Nkuba to find out the effects polio vaccination had on his hometown in Africa.  

Tbh I dont want to go into a **bleep** for tat my source is more credible than yours style debate.  I just dont want people to be forced vaccinate plain and simple.  You cant force people to use contraception or take any other drug on the market, why are vaccines seperate from this? 

[Anonymous]

Every time I've followed any of the trails of the anti-vax crowds they inventably lead back to the same discredited sources.

yeah...same.